4 Replies Latest reply on Jun 25, 2009 6:14 AM by Wucky

    PE7, Canon Vixia HV30

    Wucky Level 1

      Okay, after taking a break of more than a year, I'm doing some new video projects.   Don't know that I'll be doing more 55 minute sagas with 4000 file items like the past,   but I'm looking forward to doing some projects.     Upgraded to the new "7" bundle (PrEl  and PhEl), purchased Steve's new book (great   ....  I still have the one he and Chuck wrote some years ago and still refer to it as well).


      Also, decided to upgrade my camcorder from the trusty Canon Optura 50 to a new Vixia HV30.  Granted, the most current model is the HV40, but the 30 seemed to have the features I needed (and the guts are the same) at a much better price (B&H sells new ones).  Thought it would be cool to step it up to HD but still use the mini DV tapes and standard workflow I enjoy on Prem El.


      SO, having some issues when using HD...  I'm hoping I can be helped by y'all.   It a nutshell   ....  the capture process, and the results, are very different than what I've been used to on the various previous versions of Elements....  and I do not think this is a PrEl Version 7 issue, but maybe a camera....  recording format issue?


      (Long post, but I wanted to give as much info as possible)


      Process   -   HD

      *** Shoot in widescreen HD

      *** Plug in FireWire cable, turn on the camera.

      *** Windows makes the ding **** sound, indicating something is connected.  However (clue 1?) no window opens up asking me what I want to do with the device  (old camera would ask if I want to use Premier Elements, etc.)

      ***  Open Elements...  create new project, change settings to 1080

      *** Choose "Organize",  "Get Media", "HDV Camcorder"    note --- I'll take no warning about camera format and project formats being different as a positive sign.

      ***  Issues at this point.....   a) Clip name   is myproject.mpeg   . . .    in the past it's always been   blahblah.avi.  ???    b) I cannot select to split scenes by timecode?  The button's grayed out.   This is a big deal for my workflow.... when I shoot sports I deliberately start and stop the camera with the knowledge it will create dozens of small clips.

      *** Press capture and see what happens.... no video (image or audio) being previewed.   Instead, get the screen Playing on video hardware" in several languages.

      *** Does the capture...  does the smart tagging (although I do NOT want that and the button for it is not clicked)

      *** Image  is captured  (MPEG format) and placed on time line.    Other difference   . . .  it's already rendered?   Usually the AVI files placed and not rendered (red line across the timeline).  

      *** The image quality is very nice...  this HD looks nice.  The file is large 448 MB for about two minutes.

      *** When I copy the clip  (control + M) .... another step in my std workflow as I edit down the clips...   I guess on the format  avig  (hey, it's AVI)...  takes a long time to copy, the file is now 499 MB and when placed on the timeline (needs to be rendered   . . .  takes 5 minutes !!!) it is no longer widescreen, but more 4:3   (image distorted skinny)

        You can probably guess my questions   . . .    the workflow is different than what I've used   . . . the render times are too long  . . . files sizes pretty large,  etc.   How can I get the workflow to function properly?


      PROCESS   STD  (Non HD, but still widescreen)

      ***  Same camera, but configured to shoot in non-HDV,  just  DV (16:9)

      *** When connected and turned on the PC calls up the window asking if I want to use Elements or MovieMaker .  I start a new project in Elements  (std definition, widescreen).

      *** Capture performs exactly as expected   . . .  I can check the split scenes by timecode and it does so.   When placed on the timeline the clips look already rendered?

      ***  Back to my old workflow   ....   the quality of the images is not as nice as HD!!!



      I was hoping I could do all my new projects in HD (love the quality)  and selected this camera (and tape format) to avoide the various issues I read about HDD cameras ,  AVCHD, etc.     Now I'm wondering




      Thanks, folks !

        • 1. Re: PE7, Canon Vixia HV30
          Paul_LS Level 4

          Long thread, short answer... that is the way PE7 handles HDV.


          - PE7 does not split by timecode. You can split by content after capture... but not as reliable.

          - Premiere Elements never did not have the option of previewing during capture.

          - Solution to the above two issues is to use the free HDVSplit to capture.


          - You can disable the smart tagging after capture. In the capture window unselect the Smart Tagging option.

          - HDV MPEG2 file sizes are the same as DV-AVI... 13GB per hour, 220MB per minute.

          - Not sure about the copy "Control + M" to timeline. Why do you not just drag it from the Organise panel to the timeline?

          - Once dropped on the timeline the audio will be conformed... you should see a little progress bar saying Conforming in the bottom right of your screen.

          - It should be widecsreen and there should be no line (red or green) above it in the timeline and should not need rendering. PE7 handles HDV MPEG2 natively. I assume you are using the correct HDV project preset?


          - PE7 handles DV-AVI from a HDV camcorder same as DV-AVI from a standard camcorder.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: PE7, Canon Vixia HV30
            Wucky Level 1

            Thanks, Paul


            Thanks for the suggestion about HDV split....   I'd looked after reading some earlier posts, but figured it made sense to first try the processes in PrEl.  SO, from what I read, I'll run it on the single, long MPEG file and it will (using timecode) split that file into several files (based on how I set up the file naming)??


            This is a basic question   . . .  so, If I shoot in HDV, does that mean all the files I'm using will be MPEG and not AVI?  Once I've captured (and then split) the files, do I use them in my project  (adding them from my drives, applying effects, etc) the same as my older DV files (all in AVI)?   I'd like to do the projects in HD because the images are so much nicer, but I want to understand the workflow   (especially before I capture and start organizing  the files).


            I take off a year  from this and now get to learn all sorts of new things.






            On the other stuff   .....


            By preview during capture, I meant that  while the software is capturing the video, it is seen (and heard) on the screen.  It does this for plain old DV.


            I did disable smart tagging  (ensured the button was not selected)   . . . still ran through the smart tagging (until I manually captured).   I'll work this issue later

            I use the "ctrl+m" when editing as a way to toss out the unneeded footage   ..   under settings I select work area bar . . .  this allows me to take, say, the 30 seconds I need from a two munite clip.  Also, I give it a file name that works with my digital asset mgmt structure.


            I'll re-check on the audio.


            I believe I'm using the correct project presets(NTSC) .... for plain old DV  I use widescreen 48kHz   and for HDV 1080i  30.   The DV works fine   ...  on HDV I need to learn a bit more about 1080i  vs  780, but something in the camera manual made me think I was shooting at 1080.


            Yes, my tests for DV from this HDV camera indicated it behaved exactly as it had from my older camera.

            • 3. Re: PE7, Canon Vixia HV30
              Paul_LS Level 4

              If you capture in HDV your files will be high def MPEG2. HDVSplit can split these on Timecode during capture whereas PE7 will split the files on content after capture... and this is rather hit or miss. They file is not really split, you have a folder in the Media Bin with clips in... but they are just pointers to the original looong clip.


              Folks have reported Premiere Elements does not play the video in the capture screen during HDV capture... you need to view it on your camcorders screen. I did a short test when PE7 was first released and I am sure I could view the video during capture. That said.. in all previous versions there was no preview during capture within PE.


              Your camorder shoots 1440x1080i... so you have the correct project preset.

              • 4. Re: PE7, Canon Vixia HV30
                Wucky Level 1

                Thanks   . . .   will try to capture via HDVSplit.   Then, pull the files in PE and see how the editing goes.