25 Replies Latest reply on Aug 13, 2009 2:22 AM by Karel Bata

    A few basic questions I must have answered :)

    DentMe

      (CS3)

       

      Hey, I've been using Photoshop professionally for 6 years and am JUST getting into video editing so I have a few questions.

      So please bare with my noob questions.

       

      1)

      I import a 200MB video and add a simple black fade to the beginning and end.

      I then export as a movie and it explodes to 400MB! What gives?

       

       

      2)

      Also, whenever I export as movie, the video quality always seem to suffer. Even with no compression selected. Is there a fix?

       

       

      3

      I really want to upload my videos to YouTube so what's the best method of compression for that? (while retaining a high video quality)

       

       

      4)

      My original video frame size is 640x480. The Premiere presets don't have that size (the closest is 720x480)

      How do I create my own custom frame size? There isn't even that option uder "Custom Settings"

      And my original frame rate is 30fps but Premiere only has 29.97fps in the beginning....

       

       

      Thanks a lot. I'm sorry if this is asking a lot but any help will be MUCH appreciated.

        • 1. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          1)

          I import a 200MB video and add a simple black fade to the beginning and end.

          I then export as a movie and it explodes to 400MB! What gives?

           

          Whatever you give as instructions on export. It is a bit hard to guess with the complete lack of details, but OE is the first thing to come to mind.

           

          2)

          Also, whenever I export as movie, the video quality always seem to suffer. Even with no compression selected. Is there a fix?

           

           

          No. That is inherent to editing. You lose a generation.

           

          3

          I really want to upload my videos to YouTube so what's the best method of compression for that? (while retaining a high video quality)

           

          That is impossible with YouTube.

           

          4)

          My original video frame size is 640x480. The Premiere presets don't have that size (the closest is 720x480)

          How do I create my own custom frame size? There isn't even that option uder "Custom Settings"

          And my original frame rate is 30fps but Premiere only has 29.97fps in the beginning....

           

          Then your source material is wrong. Use VIDEO from a VIDEO camera or, in your case, use consumer software for 'editing'.

           

          FYI, 30 and 29.97 is exactly the same and desktop is the setting you may try.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
            DentMe Level 1

            Hey, thanks for the reply Harm Millard!

             

            1)

            What's OE?

             

            2)

            Wow, that's really surprising!

             

            3)

            Well, I see a lot of really nice hi-def videos on YouTube

             

            4)

            What do you mean by video from a video camera? (I'm using the video mode from my point-and-shoot Canon digital camera, which is 680x480)

            And how would 'consumer software' be better for my case than a professional application?

            • 3. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
              Harm Millaard Level 7

              Hident,

               

              OE = Operator Error

               

              Not really. When you edit, the original gets modified. When you export the modified version, you get a generation loss. If you don't want generation loss, don't edit.

               

              I haven't seen anything worthwhile on YouTube. It can all be gathered under the acronym CCNWLAOOWS.

               

              Use a still camera for PS, use a video camera for PR. If you shoot with a still camera, use consumer software, since

               

              a. the material is unsuitable for editing with PR

              b. consumer software is better suited to handle that material.

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                Curt Wrigley Level 4

                The type of generation loss HARM is referring to is not what you are seeing.  The loss he referrs to is typically not perceptable if you are following a good workflow.

                 

                If you are seeing visable quality loss, there is likely a problem with your workflow.

                 

                Can you describe exactly what you are doing, and what your source video is?

                 

                Edit:  I missed that you are shooting with a still cam.   Harm's advice is right.  Those still cams same video in peculuar formats that PPRO doesnt deal with natively.   You can convert the video to a edit friendly format with a 3rd party app, or find a consumer app that is designed to edit consumer still cam video.

                • 5. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                  DentMe Level 1

                  What's CCNWLAOOWS? Sorry for being behind on the lingo!

                   

                  That's so weird how a lower-res video file isn't suitable for PR. Is there any technical reason?

                  I might be buying a point-and-shoot digital camera that has 1080p video capabilities. That would be suitable for PR correct?

                  • 6. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                    DentMe Level 1

                    Curt Wrigley - Oh I see.

                     

                    Well, what are some nice consumer software for my video editing of these still camera videos?

                     

                    I'm running Win 7 RC. Apparently, it didn't come with Windows Movie Maker...

                    • 7. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                      Harm Millaard Level 7

                      DentMe wrote:

                       

                      What's CCNWLAOOWS? Sorry for being behind on the lingo!

                       

                      That's so weird how a lower-res video file isn't suitable for PR. Is there any technical reason?

                      I might be buying a point-and-shoot digital camera that has 1080p video capabilities. That would be suitable for PR correct?

                       

                      This may not get through the filters here, but it stands for: Commercial crap not worth looking at or otherwise worthless sh*t.

                       

                      Yes, the technical reason is the codec used on these cameras that PR does not support, thank God. Your way out of that is to invite disaster to strike by downloading a codec package and prepare for a complete reinstallation of OS and programs, or use a consumer application that can handle these esoteric codecs. PR was designed to handle video materials from video cameras, and even there it is not very strong on handling everything. Just a few common formats is really all it will handle with ease, all the rest requires re-encoding and possible generation loss. Material from a still camera is best handled with WMM, Magix, PE or Pinnacle, not PR.

                       

                      That point and shoot camera you have in mind, does it happen to be AVCHD? If so, prepare for a $ 2K+ investment in hardware to be able to edit that.

                      • 8. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                        DentMe Level 1

                        The1080p camcorder I was referring to was this (unbelievable price for 1080p!)

                        http://www.amazon.com/Aiptek-Action-HD-GVS-Definition/dp/B001GXR03U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=e lectronics&qid=1249777524&sr=8-1

                         

                        Unfourtanately, I just found out its not AVCHD (I had to research what AVCHD meant first. haha)

                         

                        Since that Aiptek camcorder isn't AVCHD, would it not be "fully compatible" with PR?

                         

                        And you keep mentioning "video camera" which is simply a camera that records VIDEO and not audio. A camcorder does both is that not as "pro?"

                         

                        Thanks HARM for all the help your giving me. You are my teacher

                        • 9. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                          Curt Wrigley Level 4

                          I havnt met a still cam that takes decent video yet.  At least if you ever intend to edit it.  They work ok for captung video and playing back; but not editing.  They are also impossible to hand hold and get any decent quality because of movement.  Many still cams uses a MJPG codec. If you want to be able to edit video, get a video cam.

                           

                          Likewise, video cams that also take still pics; produce bad still pictures.

                          • 10. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                            DentMe Level 1

                            Oops, I meant to link to this Sony Cybershot, which is a still camera that does HD videos (720p)

                            http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Cyber-shot-DSC-W290-Digital-Stabilization/dp/B001SEQPGK/ref=sr_ 1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1249779177&sr=8-1

                             

                             

                            What's a good budget video cam for editing? (and I also need it to be lightweight. I plan on going on adventures with it! )

                             

                            Basically I need AVCHD video cams right?

                             

                            This looks nice and cheap!

                            http://www.amazon.com/Sony-HDR-CX100-Camcorder-Shutter-Optical/dp/B001PY41YQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie =UTF8&s=photo&qid=1249777605&sr=1-1

                            • 11. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                              the_wine_snob Level 9

                              Let me see if I can apply some Photoshop analogies to help you with a few of these"

                               

                              1) I import a 200MB video and add a simple black fade to the beginning and end.

                              I then export as a movie and it explodes to 400MB! What gives?

                               

                              If you take a JPEG compressed image and Open it in PS, you will see (bottom left) that the file size has gone way up, over the file size of the original JPEG. If you then Save_As and choose PSD, that file size will also be up, compared to the original JPEG. It is basically the same with regards to Video. If you start with a compressed MPEG Video, and then Export as, say a DV-AVI Type II, the file size will grow exponentially. Now, you could Export as something else, to keep the file size down, but see next.

                               

                               

                              2) Also, whenever I export as movie, the video quality always seem to suffer. Even with no compression selected. Is there a fix?


                              In this case, Imagine that you have started with a good sharp TIFF image. You then choose to Save_As a JPEG and choose 2 for the quality (higher JPEG compression) in PS, you get a smaller file, but the quality suffers.

                               

                              Depending on what you are starting with (looking down the thread, it appears to be video from a still camera), if you begin with a JPEG, and then apply more JPEG compression, even with higher quality settings, the overall, final quality will still suffer - you are recompressing compressed material.

                               

                              Just like in still work, the better the quality of the image in, the better that the quality of the image out. Think starting with Canon RAW in and then a PSD out - great. JPEG in and then another JPEG out - not so good.

                               

                              Hope this helps,

                               

                              Hunt

                              • 12. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                the_wine_snob Level 9

                                Oops, got side-tracked and missed #'s 3 & 4:

                                 

                                3 I really want to upload my videos to YouTube so what's the best method of compression for that? (while retaining a high video quality)

                                 

                                I am not a YouTube expert, but I have never seen any way to use "high video quality" and "YouTube" in the same sentence, where there was anything positive. It would be like doing a Save_For_Web and then wanting to go to a double-truck at 450dpi on an eight-color press with that file.

                                 

                                 

                                4) My original video frame size is 640x480. The Premiere presets don't have that size (the closest is 720x480)

                                How do I create my own custom frame size? There isn't even that option uder "Custom Settings"

                                And my original frame rate is 30fps but Premiere only has 29.97fps in the beginning....


                                You will want to explore "Desktop," for your Project, as you can set the parameters that you need, based on your original Assets.

                                 

                                Good luck, and sorry to have missed these,

                                 

                                Hunt

                                • 13. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                  Curt Wrigley Level 4

                                  DentMe wrote:

                                   


                                  Basically I need AVCHD video cams right?

                                   


                                  AVCHD is the current consumer hd video format usually to flash drives.   While PPRO will edit AVCHD format natively; it requires a VERY fast computer to do it well.  Why?  It is a highly compressed format.

                                   

                                  So, is that what you want?   If you are willing to buy a super fast computer, it will work ok.

                                  • 14. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                    Phil Griffith Level 2

                                    Here's the way I see it. All the major (and not so major) camera companies see dollar signs out there for people wanting to have one camera do everything. So that's what they advertise. They don't bother to tell you that it's not alway the best thing to use. So people buy them then they want to be the next Spielburg with their new "all in one camera" These cameras either take great stills and lousy video (what is lousy? It looks good in the camera but you can't do anything with it. Kinda like a picture that you can't print. A picture you can't bring into something like photoshop and make it look professional and something people will want to see.

                                    Or a video camera that takes great video but 640 X480 still photos. Try and print that out to a 10 X 14 print.

                                    Its the same thing.

                                    Use the right tool for the right job. Don't believe the hype about all in one cameras.

                                    • 15. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                      Phil,

                                       

                                      I see similar from too many camera mfgrs. with regards to video cameras. They are touting something that looks good, when hooked directly to the TV to show Aunt Marge. Heaven help you, if you wish to edit it, but most buyers do not care about that, and the ones who do, end up here looking for advice.

                                       

                                      I almost cannot wait until the Holiday Season, and the new crop of cameras and buyers, who DO wish to edit that "stuff."

                                       

                                      Good luck to them,

                                       

                                      Hunt

                                       

                                      PS for anyone, who thinks that it gets crazy with the CODEC du jour here, should drop into the PrE forum on about Dec. 27th!

                                      • 16. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                        DentMe Level 1

                                        the_wine_snob wrote:

                                         

                                        PS for anyone, who thinks that it gets crazy with the CODEC du jour here, should drop into the PrE forum on about Dec. 27th!

                                        Why's that? Because of all the mom's that are going to be editing their videos? You'd think they use WMM...

                                         

                                        I just found out that PrE uses a non-linear editing system.

                                        Would this be good for editing my 640x480 digital camera videos or should I still stick with WMM?

                                         

                                        And thanks a lot for your great reply + Photoshop analogies

                                        Very good stuff

                                        • 17. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                          DentMe Level 1

                                          Curt Wrigley wrote:

                                           

                                          While PPRO will edit AVCHD format natively; it requires a VERY fast computer to do it well.  Why?  It is a highly compressed format.

                                           

                                          So, is that what you want?   If you are willing to buy a super fast computer, it will work ok.

                                           

                                          Computer hardware. Now that's my terrority! Haha. I built my own PC so I'm down for upgrading.

                                           

                                          I run a Q6600 quad core, 8GB RAM, and an 8800GT

                                           

                                          What's the ideal spec for editing inAVCHD in PPRO?

                                          • 18. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                            DentMe Level 1

                                            Phil Griffith wrote:

                                             

                                            Use the right tool for the right job. Don't believe the hype about all in one cameras.

                                             

                                            I hear what your saying. But a 720p video from a digital camera sounds pretty strong...

                                            • 19. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                              Jim_Simon Level 8

                                              720p video from a digital camera sounds pretty strong...

                                               

                                              Any kind of 'video' from a digital camera sounds like a bad idea if you want to edit the stuff.  At least until the makers of such cameras realize that their 'video' needs to be in a professional, editable format - DV, DVCPRO HD, AVC-I.

                                              • 20. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                Phil Griffith Level 2
                                                just found out that PrE uses a non-linear editing system.

                                                Would this be good for editing my 640x480 digital camera videos or should I still stick with WMM

                                                 

                                                 

                                                Any digital video editing sytem is non linear. Linear is hooking 2 cameras together and playing back and recording from one to the other. As in linear tape??? Non linear is data files that are on computer memory.

                                                And yes, I would recommend you stick with WMM.

                                                • 21. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                                                  Why's that? Because of all the mom's that are going to be editing their videos? You'd think they use WMM...

                                                   

                                                  In the consumer arena, camera mfgrs. usually release new models in time for the Holiday shopping. Many will have newer implementations of CODEC's. Some will be based on older CODEC's, but some might be brand new.

                                                   

                                                  Most people do not even know that they have WMM. They stop my the retailer and pick up a copy of PrE, Pinnacle, etc. to edit with. The sales people often have no clue as to what might work and how well.

                                                   

                                                  I just found out that PrE uses a non-linear editing system. Would this be good for editing my 640x480 digital camera videos or should I still stick with WMM?

                                                  PrE is a good little program, and is more "forgiving," than PrPro, though not THAT much. Other consumer NLE's might be a better fit, though all depends on the exact footage being edited. Besides the lack of many of the features in PrPro, PrE is a "big-button" program. Much is done behind the scenes and without user input or intervention. This makes it easy for a user to get general editing done - the most common operations. Many like PrE better than WMM, but they are not THAT far apart. Though I have PrE, I would not want to have to use it often, after having lived with PrPro for years, but that is just me. I seldom like "big-button" programs, as I like the power and control, and do not want my NLE making the decisions for me.

                                                   

                                                  Good luck, and you might want to stop by the PrE forum and ask specific questions. It is very likely that someone there is using it to edit the exact footage, that you wish to, and can give you all sorts of useful tips.

                                                   

                                                  Good luck,

                                                   

                                                  Hunt

                                                  • 22. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                    DentMe Level 1

                                                    Thanks for the thorough answer

                                                     

                                                    I just bough Pinnacle 12 Ultimate. I played around and it is MUCH better than WMM. No comparison.

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    Just wondering...would iMovie (I don't own a mac but I'm curious) be a good choice for digital camera videos?

                                                    • 23. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                      Jim_Simon Level 8

                                                      Not really, because then you'd have to get a Mac.  And no one really wants that.

                                                      • 24. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                        You might be able to find a comparison chart on the Web, that will show the features of several popular editing programs, side-by-side. Now, I highly doubt that either iMovie, or WMM will be listed. WMM is still included (I think), and iMovie used to be. Not sure what Apple is doing now. Still, commercially available NLE's might appear in a chart someplace, if you can find it.

                                                         

                                                        Good luck,

                                                         

                                                        Hunt

                                                         

                                                        PS I'm with Jim - if you have not had a Mac forced upon you, I'd stay away. Note: you will probably get the same response, but with "PC" substituted for "Mac," if you ask a Mac-person. It is all personal perspective and taste.

                                                        • 25. Re: A few basic questions I must have answered :)
                                                          Karel Bata Level 1

                                                          Talking of comparison charts on the Web that will show the features of something side-by-side, here's a page dealing with video hosts. YouTube is not the only option, nor the best. . http://kareltests.co.uk In fact (though HD is not that page) ExposureRoom offers superior HD encoding

                                                           

                                                          But it's worth noting that most people do not have the capability to view HD or (like me) the patience to wait out the buffering. I'd strongly recommend downsizing to 640 and perhaps offering the option to users of. choosing. I often find myself on Vimeo previewing the SD version and then if the content is compelling switching to HD.