13 Replies Latest reply on Oct 7, 2009 9:35 AM by the_wine_snob

    Problems with Video Playback in PE4

    Susan Verner Level 1

      I have been making projects using MPEG Streamclip to create video clips in AVI format, and then using those clips in PE4 projects.  I add a few titles and burn a DVD and I'm set.  I tried to do one of these projects yesterday, and now it is not working.  I was able to use MPEG Streamclip to create my clips.  Then I opened a project in PE4 and importing the 27 clips (total time 6 minutes).  I created my titles, and went to play the project and it will not playback.  Then, PE4 crashes and takes me out of the program ("Adobe...had to close....)

       

      I can't get back into the project though I have tried repeatedly.

       

      Nothing has changed to my knowledge on my computer since a few months ago when I did my last project of this type.  I have 408 GB of free space on my hard drive and 2 GB RAM so I wouln't think that is the issue.

       

      I updated my Quicktime software yesterday, and that made no difference.

       

      Any suggestions??

        • 1. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

          Go into one of the sub-folders in your project folder and see if you can open one of the Auto-Saves.

           

          Also, when you add those clips to your project timeline, ensure that there is no red line above them on the timeline. If there is, you aren't using the right project settings or those are not true DV-AVIs.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
            Susan Verner Level 1

            I tried getting an Auto Save version.  There weren't any of this project.  Then I tried playing a video clip from MPEG Streamclip in Windows Movie Maker and it worked fine.  So then I tried going back into the project to look for the red line.  To my surprise, the project opened.  I discovered there were some unused clips in the project which I deleted.  Then I was able to play the project.  Then I got a message that system  memory was low and I should proceed with caution.  I started editing the first and second video clip (of 27) and then the problems returned until I was bumped out a few seconds later.

            (So I haven't yet looked for the red line...)

             

            It seems like there is a memory issue.  I have closed most of the programs that are normally open (virus protection, printer program, Roxio....) which I have found in the past slow the system down.  Is there some other way for me to increase the memory available to PE?  

            • 3. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
              Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

              When you get the project open again, remember to render often (by pressing the Enter key). This will turn the red lines above your clips into green lines and should cut down on your memory issues.

               

              If you're still having trouble with memory use and instability (and assuming you've got at least the requisite 2 gigs of RAM), try opening a new project and, as a test, try adding some of these clips to it. Do you still get memory issues in the new project? Are you seeing red lines above the clips on your timeline?

              • 4. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                Susan Verner Level 1

                I did create a new project this morning and tried bringing in a few video clips at a time.  (This was before your response; I've learned from you and others from using this forum )  This is working fine so far.  I thought I would split the project in half and export each half to a movie file and then combine the two movie files and add my titles at the end in PE4 before burning to a DVD.

                 

                I do have 2 GBs of RAM, but I see that my video clips are large and probably amount more than 2 GBs.  I found an earlier post that suggests using the Apple DV/DVPRO_NTSC codec for file compression in MPEG.  I was using the default setting.  So I'm guessing if I went back and used this codec my files would be smaller and then maybe not cause this problem?    I guess I should also consider boosting the RAM on my computer?  It would be nice to be able to work with projects like this in one piece (which I have done before without too many problems).

                 

                Thanks for your help.  I do love my Adobe products but I would not be very successful without this forum!

                • 5. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                  Susan,

                   

                  Your available free space is rather low. Besides the media files and the .PREL (Project file), PrE will create several larger working files. Some are Temp files, but some, like the Audio CFA's (Conformed Audio files), are large and not really Temps. If they are deleted, then PrE will recreate them. If you had other Assets in your Project, that were later deleted themselves, you likely have .CFA's that are not being used anymore.

                   

                  I'd suggest looking into cleaning up your HDD (Hard Disk Drive), if possible. Also, it seems like you only have one HDD, and it's getting full.

                   

                  I also suggust looking over this ARTICLE for setting up your computer for an editing session, especally as you got some Out Of Memory errors. Most computers have all sorts of unnecessary programs and Processes launching and running. Even the ones that are necessary for other things, like surfing the Web, can be stopped on a temporary basis, when one goes to edit Video, which is one of the most intense tasks that one can ask their computer to do.

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                   

                  PS - unless turned off, AutoSave will kick in, after one does the first Save of a Project (Ctrl+s). From then on, PrE will do an AutoSave about every five mins. of editing. If you ever do have to go in looking for an AutoSave file, remember to look closely at the Time/Date in Detail View. The incremented AutoSave .PREL's will not tell you the entire picture. [Project Name]_003.PRL might well be newer than [Project Name]_005.PREL - check the Time/Date carefully to get the latest version.

                  • 6. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                    Susan Verner Level 1

                    Hunt--

                     

                    Thank you for that article.  That is great, and I will start following those steps.  I do delete the media cache files PE4 creates before I start working and I also delete preview files.  I have 408 GB of free space on my hard drive (out of 440).  Do you think that is not enough?  Would performance be better if I devoted a separate hard drive to projects of this kind?

                     

                    Thanks for your help,

                    Susan

                    • 7. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                      I have 408 GB of free space

                       

                      I now see that in your OP. I had read 40GB, not the 408GB that you reported. Gotta' make sure that I get my second cup of coffee, before I respond. DU!

                       

                       

                      That is more than enough HDD real estate to handle PrE and even very large Projects. One thing that can slow down editing is a single HDD. What happens is that the system is requesting access to many files at the same time. As single HDD cannot comply, so there is a slow down. The two main areas, that will be most active are the Windows Virtual Memory (Page File) and then the media and media cache files, which are large.

                       

                      Many have had better speed, if they change the settings in Windows Virtual Memory from the default of "Let Windows Manage," (dynamic) to a static fixed size, about 2.5 - 3x the physical RAM. With a nice large HDD, this will not be a problem, if one sets the size to static. It means that Windows sets this up at boot, and the size does not need to dynamically change, while editing, as large files are read into the Page File. With a dynamically managed Page File, Windows is doing several things at once, determining what it thinks it will need, setting that up and then actually reading from/writing to that Page File. For regular computing, this is seldom an issue and is just fine. With Video editing, the files are huge and Windows is suddenly very busy.

                       

                      This might also be a reason why you're getting Low Memory. To Windows, there are two basic types of "Memory," physical RAM and the Page File. In most cases, error messages do not reflect which is getting Low. The Page File normally steps in, when physical RAM is depleted, and is pretty much seamless to the user. If there is a bottleneck, Windows often does not know exactly where it is, and just issues a blanket report.

                       

                      Good luck,

                       

                      Hunt

                      1 person found this helpful
                      • 8. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                        Susan Verner Level 1

                        Thank you Steve and Hunt.  I was able to complete my project today all in one project, without having to work in batches.  Instead of bringing in all 27 clips at once, I brought them in a few at a time, edited what I needed to edit and the brought in a few more.  I also rendered frequently, as you suggested, Steve.  Next time, I will free up more memory using your suggestions.

                         

                        Thanks again!

                         

                        Susan

                        • 9. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          Susan,

                           

                          Glad that it is working for you.

                           

                          Here are a couple of things to think about. AutoSave starts, when one does the first Save. The AutoSave files are placed in an AutoSave folder within the Project folder structure. If you do need to go to them, make sure to turn your Windows Explorer to Details View, and look closely at the Date/Time. It could well be that a lower incrementally numbered file is newer than, say [Project Name]_005. Check those dates and time.

                           

                          Next, when Importing several files at one time, Conforming of the Audio can take quite a bit of time. Look to the lower-right of the GUI, and you'll see a progress bar. Wait until it completes and disappears. Often, people miss this, and start editing too soon. I go get a cup of coffee. When the Conforming, and creation of the .PEK files is stopped, bad things can happen.

                           

                          Just some tips,

                           

                          Hunt

                          • 10. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                            Susan Verner Level 1

                            Hunt--

                             

                            I was able to complete my project last week with the tips from the Forum.   I did change the RAM setting as you suggested.  I went from 2 GB to about 5.  I thought I would see a dramatic change in performance but that didn't happen.  In fact last night I was not able to burn an 8 minute slide show/movie in PE4 without receiving a transcoding error with a message "out of memory."  I went back and ran EnditAll2, and deleted some of the temporary files created by PE4 and I was fine.

                             

                            So my question is this, does PE4 know that I have more than twice as much RAM now, or do I have to reinstall the program for it to recognize that system resources have changed?

                             

                            Thanks,

                            Susan

                            • 11. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                              the_wine_snob Level 9

                              Susan,

                               

                              There is a limit on how much physical RAM PrE can use. There is also a limit on how much physical RAM a 32-bit OS can see and use, and also how it can use it. Once one reaches these limits (they can also differ program to program), more will do zero for performance, it cannot be accessed and might even interfer with the OS's ability to see what it can see.

                               

                              I recommend that one install only what their OS can work with. With a 32-bit OS, this will be ~3+ GB RAM. Most MoBo's allow for 4GB of installed RAM, so there is a small bit of overage. This will likely cause no issues, whatsoever. I have 4GB on all of my machines, though I still have that ~ 3GB limit. One machine has the +3GB switch, so it does squeeze a bit more out of the 4GB of physical RAM, though not really that much. This switch can cause problems with some systems and with some programs, so I do not make a blanket rec. for using it. One should do so, only after extensive testing with all programs on that machine, monitoring the performance of each. They should also set things up, so that they can revert easily, safely and quickly, should something not function.

                               

                              An NLE (Non Linear Editor) program will stress one's system. This will be with the CPU, the physical RAM and also the I/O sub-system, i.e. the HDD's. Each of these is an important part of the performance equation. In most cases the order of importance is: I/O, CPU and then RAM. With AVCHD, and some other highly compressed formats/CODEC's, the role of the CPU and the I/O are reversed. In my observations, RAM still runs third in this equation, though it is still important.

                               

                              An NLE computer is a complex beast, with little things often yielding big benefits (like that article on tuning up one's computer), or where major changes yield small benefits. Addressing every aspect, I/O, CPU and RAM is the best way to approach it. With AVCHD, it would be CPU, I/O and RAM, in that order. All are important, and to degrees, each will yield observable performance enhancements.

                               

                              Getting back to your question on RAM, up to the limit of your OS, your programs and your MoBo, the performance increases will be there, but probably not very dramatic. They are there, but a casual observer might not be aware of them. Going from one internal HDD to three, and properly allocating them will show up more quickly and be more noticable. Going with a faster CPU will do the same, though one might only observe this boost in certain operations, like Rendering. With SD Projects and media, the I/O improvement will yield the biggest "bang for the buck."

                               

                              Hope that this helps.

                               

                              Good luck,

                               

                              Hunt

                              • 12. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                                Susan Verner Level 1

                                Hunt--

                                 

                                Thanks so much for educating me!  Now I had a much greater understanding of the whole situation (though I must admit I had to google "MoBo").

                                 

                                Thanks again,

                                Susan

                                • 13. Re: Problems with Video Playback in PE4
                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                  Susan,

                                   

                                  Glad to have helped. Sorry about the abbreviations. I should have said "MoBo (Mother Board)," to make it clear. Hey, if you're like me, you found some other interesting "stuff," while on Google... !

                                   

                                   

                                  Since I am an old guy, I still have a complete set of encyclopedias. I can't use them, because when I go to look something up, I get side-tracked with all sorts of other subjects, begin reading, and forget what I set out to find.

                                   

                                   

                                   

                                  Good luck,

                                   

                                  Hunt