17 Replies Latest reply on Oct 5, 2009 10:06 PM by theDawnTreader7777-eBriRO

    Three Wishes...

    Cadillacula Level 1

      CS3


      I've had these same reoccurring wishes for so long, but I always just work around them in the heat of the moment. I thought I'd finally throw them out there.

       

      #1) moving a track up or down in position. Yep, that’s all, I just wanna grab a track and slide it above another track or vice versa.

       

      #2) The ability to grab all pieces (clips with gaps between them, etc) on a single track and apply effects to all. IOW apply effects to a track and everything on it, regardless if it’s part of a single continuous clip or not.

       

      #3) The ability to somehow have the “black” that renders in place of gaps when rendering/exporting be opaque. IOW if I leave a gap in-between clips it’s because I want that space to be empty so that another track will “show through”. As it is now I continually have to go back in after a render/export and re-import and manually cut out all the “black”

       

       

       

        • 1. Re: Three Wishes...
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          #1) moving a track up or down in position. Yep, that’s all, I just wanna grab a track and slide it above another track or vice versa.

          Has not happened yet, though several have filled in a Feature Request.

           

          #2) The ability to grab all pieces (clips with gaps between them, etc) on a single track and apply effects to all. IOW apply effects to a track and everything on it, regardless if it’s part of a single continuous clip or not.

          Well, here you're close. Apply your Effect to one Clip and Rt-click, choosing Copy. Lock all other Tracks, except for the destination Track, and choose Ctrl+A (Select All). Shift-click on your Clip with the Effect, to unsellect it, and then Rt-click on the rest. Choose Paste Attributes. CS 4 does have some more Track-based pluses. Explore them too.

           

          #3) The ability to somehow have the “black” that renders in place of gaps when rendering/exporting be opaque. IOW if I leave a gap in-between clips it’s because I want that space to be empty so that another track will “show through”. As it is now I continually have to go back in after a render/export and re-import and manually cut out all the “black”

          This one throws me. If I have Video material on, say Video Track 1, and material on Video Tracks above, but with gaps, there is no issue seeing the material on Video Track 1. Can you give more details, as what I read makes no sense at all. If there is not Video above, there is nothing to obscure the lower Video Track. PrPro will NOT create Black Video over it, just to fill in any gaps. Either I do not fully understand, or there is OE afoot.

           

          Good luck,

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Three Wishes...
            Jim_Simon Level 8

            1) Given that Premiere, unlike Photoshop, sees only from the top down, and the effects moving a whole track would have, I can understand why this hasn't been implemented.

             

            2) Adjustment Layers for Premiere would be a godsend.

             

            3) Tracks below a gap do show through.

            • 3. Re: Three Wishes...
              Cadillacula Level 1

              Whew... looks like I'll need to take a community college course to get the hang of #2

               

               

               

              Okay glad I've peaked some interest... more explanation on my #3.

               

               

              What I do is take a track with the raw/original video on it. Then I edit that track by razoring out chunks where I will want other tracks to show through... so eventually this track looks like a bunch of clips spaced out with gaps in-between them. NOW that I have this track edited and cut up like I want - I need to render and export "just" this track, with all of its cuts and gaps, to have it render as a new complete track with say a bunch of whacky effects on it rendered in of course. Once that track is rendered and exported - with the effects cooked in... I now re-import this newly created track, with all the goodies rendered on it, back into my timeline... and all the gaps I painstakingly created are filled in with BLACK. Now I have to go in, again, and slice out all of the black from my new effect laden track.

               

              thoughts?

               

              • 4. Re: Three Wishes...
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                Maybe Nest that Track/Sequence (turn off the eyeball of other Tracks) and add Transparent Video (New icon), for your Export? Then your Exported/Imported AV file will have "holes" in it.

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                 

                [Edit] corrected for more info

                • 5. Re: Three Wishes...
                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                  For #2, you might also want to look at turning off visibility (eyeball) for other Tracks after you Nest the Sequence?

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  • 6. Re: Three Wishes...
                    Cadillacula Level 1

                    I assume you mean "#3" on your last post.

                     

                    But I do want to talk about the real #2 for a moment... believe it or not you can simply copy the effects of of the first clip, select the other clips via the mouse and paste attributes and it works. No locking or selecting all, etc. Cool, i never knew that and wouldnt have discovered without walking through your steps so thanks for that... however not the solution to my "normal" needs per my wish (my luck)... I'll be more specific.

                     

                    In my case, I typically have a lot of different things happening on each clip on a track, adjustments, positioning, scale, etc... every clip may have something different going on... NOW say, once i have each clip effected and adjusted as I need... I then want to add a tint of blue (or color correction or whatever) to everything on the track... with your method the tint of blue wipes out all the unique/individual setting/effects on each of the clips and replaces it with just the tint of blue (or whatever I did to the first clip). So all of my positioning, levels, scales revert to match whatever was on the first clip. Is there a way to select just a single effect and apply to all per your method? When i try and copy a single effect the paste attributes option is greyed out.

                     

                    Back to #3...

                     

                    are you saying that you have rendered a track, exported it out so to speak... and when you import it back in it comes "cut up" with holes in it and not a continuous clip? i didnt know this was possible via any method... but If so I will explore your reccomendations asap.

                    • 7. Re: Three Wishes...
                      Jeff Bellune Adobe Community Professional

                      For #3, you have to export from Pr with an alpha channel.  Only certain codecs support an alpha channel, so choose carefully.   The alpha option is typically expressed as "Millions of Colors + " or "32-bit color depth".

                       

                      -Jeff

                      • 8. Re: Three Wishes...
                        Jim_Simon Level 8
                        NOW that I have this track edited and cut up like I want - I need to render and export "just" this track

                         

                        Why not just keep editing?  Why the export step?

                        • 9. Re: Three Wishes...
                          Jim_Simon Level 8
                          I then want to add a tint of blue (or color correction or whatever) to everything on the track.

                           

                          The only way to currently achieve that goal is to use nesting.  It's not quite as workable a solution as an Adjustment Layer, but it's all we have at the moment.

                          • 10. Re: Three Wishes...
                            the_wine_snob Level 9
                            No locking or selecting all, etc.

                             

                            The Locking was to make Selection easier. With everything else Locked, Ctrl+A (Select All) will be limited to just the Track that you are working on. It is NOT necessary for the Copy/Paste Attributes at all, as you point out - only to speed up the Selection, should one have many Clips and many Tracks.

                             

                            Sorry that I was not clear on that.

                             

                            Good luck,

                             

                            Hunt

                            • 11. Re: Three Wishes...
                              Cadillacula Level 1
                              Why not just keep editing?  Why the export step?

                               

                               

                              Lots of reasons of course... off the cuff... I may want to apply an effect that "must be rendered", like a magic bullet plug-in for example... where I want one set of scenes (aka bunch-o clips on one track) to have a yellowed film look, and perhaps another set of scenes will have swirling animations in the lower third. In these cases you'd have to render these things and bring them back in as new tracks with the effects "cooked in" as I like to say... and then you may need to take these tracks back into a project and do further broad stroke adjustments. (Perhaps the yellow film looked scenes need to fade (opacity) in and out of the film w/ animation scenes, etc, etc)

                               

                              As far Jeff Bellune's comment - Do you know off hand if the alpha channel thing is supported within the DV AVI format?

                               

                              Lastly, I am completely unfamiliar with nesting, I'll have to brush up.

                               

                              (and thanks to all btw, this ongoing thread has been enlightening for me)

                              • 12. Re: Three Wishes...
                                dradeke Adobe Employee

                                Cadillacula - love the handle...

                                 

                                #1 - nice feature request and as noted, it has been submitted.

                                #2 - This screams CS4 as we address this.  WIth CS4, you can simply range select your clips and apply either a transition or effect to all clips.  For CS3, the easiest way to accomplish this is to nest the sequence (drag your sequence into another one) and then apply the desired effect to the timeline.

                                #3 - In Premiere Pro, you can create a color matte.  My faulty memory says File>New Item>Color Matte.  Create a black clip and drop it in any of your gaps.  The other approach is to create a new black video.  Same location.

                                 

                                hope this helps,

                                Dennis

                                • 13. Re: Three Wishes...
                                  Jim_Simon Level 8
                                  In these cases you'd have to render these things and bring them back in as new tracks with the effects "cooked in" as I like to say

                                   

                                  You certainly can, but you hardly "have to".  I never do.  I just keep editing till I'm done, then make one export.  Nesting takes care of broad effects applications, no export required.

                                  • 14. Re: Three Wishes...
                                    Jim_Simon Level 8
                                    WIth CS4, you can simply range select your clips and apply either a transition or effect to all clips.

                                     

                                    But you cannot change that effect globally once applied.

                                     

                                    Adjustment Layers are what is needed and wanted for Premiere Pro.

                                    • 15. Re: Three Wishes...
                                      Cadillacula Level 1
                                      You certainly can, but you hardly "have to".

                                       

                                      Well now I know we each have our own preferences and comfort zones when it comes to work flows and methods, and for any one of us to think we can completely understand exactly what the other one needs for their given specific projects would be impossible. Having said that, some of the effects I am applying cannot be rendered in the editor, so I could never see how the effects are performing and behaving, when attempting to apply subsequent effects. So I unequivocally "have to" render them out and then import them back in - in these cases (not always). If I didn't, I would in essence be making all of my other needed adjustments blindly because once again I can’t "see" the previously applied effects in action. Some of the examples are intensive lower third animations, 24P conversion effects, complex "film look" treatments that apply a dozen effects/settings at once, etc, etc.

                                      Just wanted to be even more specific, so that it is clear that my needs, and wishes, are beyond viable.

                                      • 16. Re: Three Wishes...
                                        Jim_Simon Level 8
                                        some of the effects I am applying cannot be rendered in the editor

                                         

                                        Such as?  I've never heard of an effect that can be used inside of Premiere, but that Premiere cannot render, including all the ones you later mention.

                                        • 17. Re: Three Wishes...
                                          theDawnTreader7777-eBriRO

                                          Cadillacula wrote:

                                           

                                          You certainly can, but you hardly "have to".
                                          
                                          

                                           

                                          Well now I know we each have our own preferences and comfort zones when it comes to work flows and methods, and for any one of us to think we can completely understand exactly what the other one needs for their given specific projects would be impossible. Having said that, some of the effects I am applying cannot be rendered in the editor, so I could never see how the effects are performing and behaving, when attempting to apply subsequent effects. So I unequivocally "have to" render them out and then import them back in - in these cases (not always). If I didn't, I would in essence be making all of my other needed adjustments blindly because once again I can’t "see" the previously applied effects in action. Some of the examples are intensive lower third animations, 24P conversion effects, complex "film look" treatments that apply a dozen effects/settings at once, etc, etc.

                                          Just wanted to be even more specific, so that it is clear that my needs, and wishes, are beyond viable.

                                           

                                           

                                          Wow, I thought I made things complicated...

                                           

                                          this rendering out seems to be a pointless step. I hate to say it, because I consider myself a total amateur at video editing, but that seems to be just a waste of time.

                                           

                                          why not move the workbar to cover only the area you need to see the final result, hit the enter key and then go have a coffee or something while premier RENDERS the effects on the video in place? that red bar indicates that it needs to be rendered, if you hit enter premier renders and turns the red bar green to indicate final results. if you set the work bar to a spot just before and just after the area you need to see the final results for it will render that and help you to see what it is going to look like.

                                           

                                          I understand you may be doing something pretty complex, but the amount of work you seem to put into rendering out, importing in, editing again and then tweaking, then rendering out, importing in, editing again and then... etc seems to me to be a monumental job. I would have quit being interested in producing videos ages ago if that was all really necessary.

                                           

                                          even if you render and then make changes to the effects, you can rerender that section in order to see the new result. no reediting chopping out the black blocks because it is all done without having to reimport anything.

                                           

                                          I really believe you are making more work than necessary. I could be wrong, because like I said before, I am no expert, but what you are doing just seems like overkill.

                                           

                                          it also seems to me that maybe you need to learn and use after effects, it allows you much more power in adding effects to your video and it also allows you to add a composition directly to your video. look into it, it might speed up your work flow.

                                           

                                          oh by the way, the reason I came to the forums was to post my version of your number 2. I have been dreaming of that for a few months now.