20 Replies Latest reply on Jan 8, 2010 10:23 AM by Chad Baker

    PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...

    rkad41

      I recently purchased a Dell Studio XPS Desktop (SX8000 series) running Windows 7.  I also purchased Premiere Elements 8.0 because I do a lot of video editing and I loved version 2.0 on my old HP desktop.  But I have had nothing but problems.

       

       

      I experience two catastrophic fail modes when using this product:

       

      1. PE8 unexpectedly crashes destroying any unsaved data.  I then get a dialog box stating that the application has terminated unexpectedly.

       

      2. PE8 freezes.  I can do nothing.  The pointer icon indicates PE8 is thinking but it does not matter how long I let it go.  It never returns.  If I click anywhere in the application GUI, it simply grays over and tells me the application is not responding.  I have let it set for as long as 45 minutes without resolution.  The only “fix” is to terminate PE8 using the task manager.

       

      One of these two fail modes will occur 100% of the time when I use PE8.  I worked for about 4 hours yesterday using the software and the application froze or crashed a total of 11 times.

       

      There is little rhyme or reason to the fail mode occurrences.  But it seems to occur most often when I am trimming or moving video clips.

       

      Has anyone else experienced this problem?  Can anyone give me some pointers for debug?

       

      Thanks in advance.

        • 1. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

          First, go to the Dell site and ensure you have all of your machine's firmware updates. Even brand new machines can be months out of date.

           

          Also go to the Apple site and ensure you have the latest Quicktime.

           

          And I recommend you turn off the background processes that the program runs, per the FAQs to the right of this forum.

          http://forums.adobe.com/thread/503270?tstart=0

           

          Beyond that, this article from the FAQs offers some suggestions for ensuring that the program runs more stably.

          http://forums.adobe.com/thread/533334?tstart=0

           

          I don't know enough about the type of camcorder you're getting your video from to offer any specific suggestions. But, if you've got an i7 processor, plenty of RAM and hard drive space and you keep your computer well-tuned and defragmented, you should be able to work with most standard formats with no problems.

           

          The other qualification is if you are running Windows 7 64-bit, which is not yet fully compatible with this 32-bit program.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
            rkad41 Level 1

            Thank you Steve.  I will try your suggestions.

             

            One thing that I just thought of ...

             

            I have have been using the Roxio Import Media utility to import .AVI files onto my computer.  Is it possible the CODEC used is not fully compatible with PE8?  If so, how could I find out and / or remedy the issue?

            • 3. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
              the_wine_snob Level 9

              The freeware utility, G-Spot, will give you full details on those Roxio AVI files. There could be a CODEC conflict there.

               

              Good luck,

               

              Hunt

              • 4. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                This ARTICLE might give you some tips on setting up, even a new computer, for an editing session. Dell is pretty good, but there is probably unnecessary bloatware, that could be getting in the way.

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                  When a program, or system crashes, there is usually a breadcrumb trail of what was happening, when the crash, or hang occurred. This ARTICLE will give you some tips on tracking down "clues."

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  • 6. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                    This ARTICLE links to a troubleshooting FAQ. While it was written for PrPro, there are a lot of great general, non-NLE specific tips.

                     

                    Good luck,

                     

                    Hunt

                    1 person found this helpful
                    • 7. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                      rkad41 Level 1

                      Thanks Hunt.

                       

                      Steve had some suggestions about time hogging processes (auto-rendering, auto-scrolling, etc.).  That seemed to help.  I've been working for the last 2 hours and I only crashed once.  But again, it was a catasrophic crash taking all unsaved data with it.  Still unsatisfactory by any standards.

                       

                      Regarding your suggestions ...

                       

                      I downloaded GSpot and looked at the "culprit" videos.  Correct CODECs are installed.

                       

                      Launched event viewer but I cannot find any indication of a crash symptom.

                       

                      Here is what I do know ...

                       

                      Unlike every other crash or freeze instance, this time I got a popup warning from Adobe PE8 saying: "You are running low on system memory.  Please save your work and proceed with caution!"

                       

                      But I'm not sure I understand why.  I have 8GB of RAM and I've been monitoring the process monitor while I work.  It NEVER gets about about 33%.  I have run the full memory system diagnostics and they all passed.

                       

                      Any ideas how I might debug this?

                       

                      Thanks in advance.

                      • 8. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                        the_wine_snob Level 9
                        it was a catasrophic crash taking all unsaved data with it

                         

                        Do you have AutoSave ON? If so, once you do a Save (Ctrl+S), it will be invoked and will do an AutoSave per the settings in Edit>Preferences. To access these, look in your Project's folder structure for Premiere Elements AutoSave. If you have left the default, you'll have 5 files, incremented 001 - 005. Before you choose one of these, set the folder to Details View Mode, as the AutoSave files are FIFO, so 003 might well be newer than 005. Check the Date/Time column carefully. AutoSave has saved many hours of work for many.

                         

                        I also use Ctrl+S often (though I have few instances of any crashes), and when major segments are done, I'll use either Save_As, or Save_As_a_Copy, depending on what I need. Couple these with AutoSave, and you should not be more than about 5 mins. into editing, should you have a crash.

                         

                        This ARTICLE will give you some tips on Save/Save_As/Save_As_a_Copy, plus some details on what a Project (.PREL) file is all about.

                         

                        Good luck, and I do agree that crashes should not be part of a normal editing session,

                         

                        Hunt.

                        • 9. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                          PIANISSIM0

                          I have Windows 7 64-bit version, and PE 8.0 is very unstable in it. I guess there is no point in describing things that it does, because of the compatibility issue clearly stated with 64-bit OS. I wonder if 64-bit PE release is near?

                           

                          Another problem that makes things more difficult is loss of the rendered preview files after project is reopened. After PE crashes, I open saved project to find that half of the clips require another rendering. So, even though my losses of unsaved work are minimal (auto-save every 1 minute), my loss of time is unbearable because I have to wait for 20-30 minutes before I can resume work. Without rendering, my i7/920 cannot handle direct previews of AVCHD 1080P material. I think only those rendered clips are lost that have any type of processing applied (trabsnitions, effects). Has anyone experienced this? In a nushell, I render everything, see the green line across the timeline, play preview, save project, open project again - half of clips are shown in red.

                           

                          Thanks

                          Ivan

                          • 10. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                            rkad41 Level 1

                            Ivan,

                             

                            I very much appreciate your reply!

                             

                            I am still tormented by this very persistent problem.  I have tried just about everything suggested by the experts – and while some things seem to make it better – PE8 still freezes or crashes with alarming regularity.

                             

                            And yes, I am constantly re-rendering clips after a crash.  (I actually thought that was normal – that every time you reloaded a project you just had to re-render a bunch of stuff.)  Perhaps you are on to something.  Maybe it is a Windows 7 64-bit thing!

                             

                            As I stated above, after disabling certain memory hogging processes (auto-rendering, auto-scrolling, etc) things did improve.  What's more, about 50% of my freezes or crashes now are preceded by a popup window that states: “Warning you are running critically low on system memory.   Please save your work and proceed with extreme caution.”  If I continue at this point, I'll freeze or crash within about 5 minutes.

                             

                            So it seems the PE8 crashes and freezes are related to memory usage in some form or fashion.

                             

                            My current theory is that if I limit memory hogging operations, sometimes the memory breach is incremental enough that I get a warning message.  But the remainder of the times the memory overuse (or perceived memory overuse) is so severe the app just shuts down or freezes.

                             

                            I say “perceived memory overuse” because I have an abundance of memory.  I have 8GB of RAM total and even with PE8 running full blast I've never used more than 38%.  Same goes for hard drive space.  I have 800GB sitting around waiting to be used.  So I cannot not fathom how I can be running critically low on memory.  I've had the system monitor running when I experienced a crash and there is nothing that is even remotely redlined.

                             

                            Ivan, can I swap contact info with you (i.e. email address)?  Right now you the only one that seems to be experiencing the same or similar issue.  I'd like to trade computer spec information.  Right now I know you, like me, are running Windows 7  64-bit.  And it could be just that simple.  But we can't be the only people use PE8 that are running this OS.  Could it be something else?  Maybe PE8 has issues with a particular video card?

                             

                            If you want to swap contact info, let me know.  I will give you my email address and you can contact me at your convenience.  Thank you.

                             

                            -Rodney

                            • 11. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                              the_wine_snob Level 9
                              I wonder if 64-bit PE release is near?

                               

                              This is pure speculation, but PrPro CS5 (no release date yet) will be full 64-bit ONLY. Given this, and the historical cycle of PrE releases, I'd guess that PrE 9 (maybe next Oct/Nov?) will be full 64-bit. Now, whether it will also run on 32-bit (PrPro CS5 will not) will only be known near release.

                               

                              I can see a potential problem, should PrE 9 be 64-bit ONLY. It will be the same as when Premiere (both flavors) went to SSE 2 only instruction set. Users with older AMD CPU's screamed bloody murder. They were shut out completely, and there are still a few posts coming in on how could Adobe turn its back on the AMD install-base. Well, it was for the better, and for those who had moved up to an SSE 2 processor (the vast majority of the install-base).

                               

                              I'm still on 32-bit OS's, but will have to look into moving up for CS5. Photoshop is already there, but does still offer an either/or installation. PrPro CS5 will be 64-bit ONLY, unless something major changes.

                               

                              Good luck,

                               

                              Hunt

                              • 12. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                the_wine_snob Level 9
                                What's more, about 50% of my freezes or crashes now are preceded by a popup window that states: “Warning you are running critically low on system memory.

                                 

                                First, remember that System Memory is both physical RAM and Windows Virtual Memory (Page File). There are usually many programs and Processes, that use System Memory (both types), that are totally unnecessary. Most are installed as bloatware by the computer builder, but many are added by other programs upon installation. Most are called at bootup. A good example of the latter is iTunes, which installs all sorts of "helpers." Roxio and Nero also do it with "sniffers" and "watchers." These programs and Processes are designed to speed up certain things, but usually just get in the way and use System Memory unnecessarily.

                                 

                                This ARTICLE might offer some tips on cleaning up your system for an NLE session. It mentions some of the "usual suspects," but cannot cover all possibilities.

                                 

                                Good luck,

                                 

                                Hunt

                                • 13. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                  Ed.Macke Level 3

                                  Hunt,


                                  I wonder if that error message is a red herring...

                                   

                                  I have had that error message pop up once or twice when using PRE7, and I can tell you that I know for a fact that I was not running low on system memory when the message appeared. While I try to shut down all unnecessary processes when I'm editing, one that I specifically start *up* is Sysinternals Process Explorer, which displays real-time CPU and Memory Usage in the system tray.


                                  The last time I got the "out of memory" error, I was only using 1.5GB of my available 2.0GB of memory, and even *if* that was used up, I have about 8GB of page file space available.


                                  I suspect that it's not an issue with truly running low on system memory, but more of an issue/bug with PRE's memory allocation logic where it just THINKS you're running low. Or PRE's term "system memory" (or "system resources"... I can't remember what the message said) means something besides physical RAM???

                                  • 14. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                                    Ed,

                                     

                                    Several folk here, and on the Muvipix forum, have indicated that the possibility of a "false positive" does exist. I recall Chuck Engels was getting one in some version of PrE, but never had an issue. He just ignored the message and never had an issue. Others experienced the same. A similar error would pop up, but most were able to just ignore it, keep on editing and never had crashes.

                                     

                                    Personally, I'd love to see all software first give 100% accurate and fully detailed error messages. Unfortunately, even if the programs were hard-wired to do so, they'd still have to rely on the OS for 100% accurate and fully detailed reports and that is not going to happen. Hence, we get highly generalized and very cryptic (at best) error messages.

                                     

                                    Probably the worst program for this is Adobe Encore. While I love that program, it's built on the Sonic authorcore, which is a system of modules. The modules do not talk to each other, and also do not talk to the OS. Talk about cryptic error messages! Each module has its own set of error messages, and they are not consistent module to module, plus there is usually zero input from the OS, even if it is causing the module to fault. Fortunately, I get very few of these, but others get tons, and there is just no easy way to figure that "stuff" out. Even power-users do not know the code for each module.

                                     

                                    Good luck to all,

                                     

                                    Hunt

                                    • 15. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                      Ed.Macke Level 3

                                       

                                      Several folk here, and on the Muvipix forum, have indicated that the possibility of a "false positive" does exist

                                      Ah, late to the party again, I see.


                                      I'm wondering whether it's a false positive (i.e. not really a problem), or whether it's really reporting on some other finite system resource and calling it system memory (i.e. there actually is a problem, but it ain't memory). Like maybe it's talking about contigious space or something? The thought being, if we really knew what the message was saying, we could fix the real problem. But obviously that would require us knowing what the root cause of the error message was... good luck on THAT!


                                      I'm a programmer by trade, so I know how it goes with crafting meaningful error messages. If you think commercial software is bad, try in-house. One programmer thought it was funny to craft error messages like "If you knew what you were doing, this wouldn't be happening"... I'm not sure the users thought it was as funny.

                                       

                                      Personally, I'd love to see all software first give 100% accurate and fully detailed error messages.

                                      Personally, I'd love to see software just work 100% of the time, making error message obsolete!

                                      • 16. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                        the_wine_snob Level 9
                                        or whether it's really reporting on some other finite system resource and calling it system memory (i.e. there actually is a problem, but it ain't memory).

                                         

                                        That possibility is why I broke "Memory" out into RAM and Virtual Memory. Some folk only think about physical RAM. There can be many more issues with Virtual Memory, i.e. where located, how allocated, and how managed by the OS. Then, there are issues with other programs and Processes accessing it, and under-reporting, or inaccurately reporting their usage - usually a memory address issue. Also, things like a video driver sharing memory can cause issues, though this is usually with physical RAM. Still, if one does not do a perfect job of telling the OS what it's doing, problems can arise. As we've all found out, computers are very specific. They do not "fill in the blanks" very well. If we type "MSCONFIH" into Run, we get an error message. The OS does not realize that we really mean "MSCONFIG." Same thing with memory addresses. Get one bit off and the OS just scratches its head and crashes.

                                         

                                        Hunt

                                        • 17. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                          RidingTheWave123987

                                          Where does Adobe say that PE8 is not fully W7 64-bit compatible?

                                           

                                          As someone who specifically upgraded to PE8 from PE7 because PE7 was useless with W7 64, that would have been good information to know.

                                           

                                          The only info I can find seems to say PE8 is compatible with W7 64.

                                           

                                          It says

                                           

                                          Adobe Premiere Elements 8 may not run correctly on a system that doesn't meet the following requirements:

                                          ...

                                          • Microsoft Windows XP with Service Pack 2 or 3, or Windows Vista, MCE, Windows 7*

                                          ...

                                          *32 & 64 bit versions of Windows 7

                                           

                                          Here is the link.

                                          http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/514/cpsid_51427.html

                                          • 18. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                            PIANISSIM0 Level 1

                                            2 Rodney -- glad to hear that the need to re-render already rendered clips is not an uncommon problem. That drove me crazy on my Windows XP 32-bit and Windows Vista 32-bit platforms. I ended up ordering new Windows 7 64-bit platform, but relief is not in sight. This re-rendering should be something easy to fix! certainly not a standard behavior, rendered files are piling in the preview folder, same copies made over and over again. Write me on pianissim0 at comcast.net, we can exchange tricks how to stay alive under 64-bit OS. I am getting a white screen of death most commonly (preview screen goes white, and then PE stops responding). I think this must be driver-related, but I am afraid to upgrade/change anything in the fear of making things worse under the pressure of my deadline. The only other thing would be switching to p-n-n-c-l-e, it also throws "low on memory" warnings (I think it is Boris FX leaking memory), but at least it renders once and for all. Then export to output file goes rapidly. In PE, however, I noticed that when I use SHARE to export freshly rendered material, it definitely re-renders certain parts, so that progress bar goes quickly/slowly depending on something. This should not be hapenning...  3 minute video should not require 20 minutes to drop pre-rendered material to a file.

                                             

                                            As for the memory size, the way I understand it, we can get ourself 16 GB of RAM that, under 32-bit memory management, still does not let a single process to use all of it, even if it is free. And so we need to be patient, control our blood pressure, and wait for PE 9 and Windows 7 64-bit SP1.

                                             

                                            2 Hunt -- thanks for shring your vision on 64-bit prospects. I wonder if there will be releases of PE 8 that would be more compatible with W7/64 drivers... pushing "check for upgrade" button becomes my routine.

                                             

                                            2 RidingTheWave -- I checked Microsoft W7 software compatibility list, and it says PE 8 is compatible with 64-bit W7, which is not quite true, it seems.

                                             

                                            Good luck to all,

                                            Ivan

                                            • 19. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                              digitalreply Level 1

                                              Another process which might consume valuable system memory is the Auto Analyzer (ElementsAutoAnalyzer.exe) which runs along with the PE8's exe and is responsible for the smart features in this release of pre.

                                              So if your workflows do not use any of the smart features you might try killing the process from the task manager Or Launch the Elements Organizer, go to edit > preferences - Auto-Analyzer Options and uncheck all the options for various filters.

                                               

                                              Hope this information is useful.

                                              • 20. Re: PE8 crashes or freezes every session ...
                                                Chad Baker Adobe Employee

                                                Hello everyone,

                                                 

                                                I've linked to a couple technotes that we've written to address some of the issues being discussed here. Our testing has indicated that most of the problems with crashes and freezes in Premiere Elements 8 are related to specific problems with Nvidia drivers. The solution to this problem is to upgrade to version 195.81.

                                                 

                                                I posted an announcement at the top of the forum with more details, but I'll copy it here as well. There are also links at the bottom of this post to KB articles that deal with the issues you mentioned in the original post.

                                                 

                                                ---------

                                                 

                                                For Nvidia users, there is a driver update that will fix both of the following issues:

                                                 

                                                • Premiere Elements 8 does not restart after closing on Windows
                                                • Frequent and inexplicable crashes with Premiere Elements 8

                                                 

                                                To resolve these issues, you should update your GPU (graphics card) driver to version 195.81 or higher, by following the steps below.

                                                 

                                                1.      Identify which GPU driver you have by right clicking on the Desktop > Properties > Settings and in the Display field it will be displayed.

                                                2.      Go to http://www.nvidia.com/Download/index.aspx?lang=en-us and download driver for your GPU card. Its size varies from 80 to 120MB depending upon the GPU card model.

                                                3.      After the download is complete, run the driver install Installation. This should take less than 2 minutes.

                                                 

                                                There are no known issues that the latest driver update will cause.

                                                 

                                                This is an announcement. There is a separate discussion topic located here.

                                                 

                                                 

                                                ***If the update steps shown above do not upgrade your system to version 195.81 or higher, then you may need to download the driver directly. Use the link below only if the steps above do not update your driver to 195.81 or higher. The download page for Vista and Windows 7 is located here:

                                                http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_32bit_195.81_beta.html

                                                http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_64bit_195.81_beta.html

                                                 

                                                -------------

                                                Premiere Elements 8 does not restart after closing on Windows

                                                http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/523/cpsid_52386.html

                                                 

                                                 

                                                Frequent and inexplicable crashes with Premiere Elements 8

                                                http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/530/cpsid_53099.html