1 2 Previous Next 46 Replies Latest reply on Dec 22, 2009 2:33 AM by DonAndress

    Problem with exporting moving still images

    DonAndress

      Hello.

       

      I would like to create a sequence where the movie is made of still images (photos in .PSD format, reminiscent of a old-fashioned Polaroid photos) with added motion.

       

      Now the problem is that after rendering and exporting (DV format, both interlaced and progressive) these moving-images somehow bounce or leap on the edges, especially inner white edge. It doesn't matter if I turn on or off the "optimize stills" option.

       

      I attached short sample but it shows what I mean.

      The file is 1MiB, 5sec, progressive, compressed with XviD with constant quantizer=2, resized to 640x480.

      But all above modifications of exported file do not matter what so ever. It's the same with original export.

       

       

      What shoud I do to improve fluency and smoothness of the movie?

       

      I use Premiere Pro 1.5.

        • 1. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          In your Project Settings, do you have Optimize Stills checked? Do you get better results if this is unchecked?

           

          Good luck,

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
            DonAndress Level 1

            I tried both, checked and unchecked. Unfortunatelly nighter

            improves the quality.

            • 3. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
              Curt Wrigley Level 4

              Opimize sills does nothing to the still image. It optimzes the export video encoding for repeating frames.

               

              I cant see your video example as I refuse to install xvid codec.   So, can you tell me do horizontal thin details/lines shimmer in the video or is the entire frame jumping?

               

              If the first; add a tiny amount of blur to the stills; their res is too high.

              • 4. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                Level 1

                HI,

                 

                Nice effect.  I like it.

                On my computer the image is looking pretty darn good with just the very slightest "jitter" where the bottom of the image meets the white background.

                 

                You basically have what looks like a piece of photo paper (white) with an image on it. The bottom border is larger than the sides and top, making it look like a polaroid. This white photo looking paper with image on it is on top of a black backround...black screen.

                 

                Where your image meets that bottom border it jitters a little bit, but I had to look closely to see it.

                 

                It's weird that it does that, but you have the overall "photo" image (paper with image) getting larger as well as moving across the black screen...so maybe it's the interlacing as the image gets larger as well as its lateral movement ?

                 

                I thought I would explain at least what I am seeing from the sample so others who can't see (codec to play avi) it know more too...

                 

                Rod

                • 5. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                  Level 1

                  PS.

                   

                  When I said "interlacing" I meant my monitor refresh rate and scan lines...not "interlacing".

                  I wonder too if a psd file that has merged layers ( cause its not flatttened, it still has layers maybe) when moving like that can have one layer rendered like 1 pixel off from the other layer...? )  hence bluring and resolution thing I suppose...

                   

                   

                  Rod

                  • 6. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                    DonAndress Level 1

                    @Curt

                    O man, so I have to make the quality worse?

                    It's not perfect right now anyway. The resolution of the movie is only 720x480 (DVD NTSC).

                     

                    Yes, only horizontal lines shimmer but not all of them. Only of the picture inside and not the white frame. In other words - white "polaroid" frame has two lines, inner and outer and only the inner one shimmers. Outer is smooth as expected.

                    The more vertical movement the more shimmer effect shows up.

                    And exactly to what I should add blur? To the entire sequence or just the moving picture?

                    You don't need Xvid in your system, ffdshow will work just fine. Would you like me to prepare another version of the sample? If so, what codec?

                     

                     

                     

                    @Rod

                    The details of the project are like these - there is a picture (looking like polaroid) with resolution a bit higher then the movie. Then I scale down the picture, start motion with slight increase of the picture.

                    But I also tried with no scaling. I mean I scaled down before the movement and then just moved the picture with no further scaling. I tried with pictures (also PSD) with only one layer and nothing helps.

                    • 7. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                      Level 1

                      Hi,

                      I'm a newbee...brand new at learning premiere pro cs3....so I should not give you advice but others here are very very good at this stuff. I like the effect of your sample video. When I first looked at it I thought only the bottom edge was slightly jittery, but I can now see that the entire image inside the white border does jump...the jittery-ness is the vertical (not horizontal) movement of the image about 1 or 2 pixels up and down as it is interpolated at certain points in time.  The larger the screensize of the image the more noticeable it is.

                       

                      I found this help file about keyframes and animation and interpolation...

                      Change transition settings

                       

                       

                       

                       

                      1. In the Timeline panel, click a transition to select it.
                      2. In the Effect Controls panel, adjust settings:
                      3. Edge selectors
                        Change the orientation or direction of the transition. Click an Edge selector arrow on the transition’s thumbnail. For example, the Barn Doors transition can be oriented vertically or horizontally. A transition doesn’t have Edge selectors if it has one orientation or if orientation isn’t applicable.

                         

                        Start and End sliders
                        Set the percentage of the transition that is complete at the start and end of the transition. Hold down the Shift key to move the start and end sliders together.

                         

                        Show Actual Sources
                        Displays the starting and ending frames of the clips.

                         

                        Border Width
                        Adjusts the width of the optional border on the transition. The default Border is None. Some transitions do not have borders.

                         

                        Border Color
                        Specifies the color of the transition’s border. Double‑click the color swatch or use the eyedropper to choose the color.

                         

                        Reverse
                        Plays the transition backward. For example, the Clock Wipe transition plays counterclockwise.

                         

                        Anti‑Aliasing Quality
                        Adjusts the smoothness of the transition’s edges.

                         

                        Custom
                        Changes settings specific to the transition. Most transitions don’t have custom settings.

                       

                       

                      Maybe the anti-aliasing quality adjustment will help?

                       

                      I put your sample clip into VirtualDub and tried a filter called "Field Bob" (compensates for field jumping in field- split video by applying bob-deinterlacing techniques). In the filter setting I tried "smooth" for both even and odd fields.  It didn't really help.

                       

                      Rod

                      • 8. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                        Curt Wrigley Level 4

                        If you can post it as wmv, mov, mp2, mp4, flash...

                         

                        Thin horizontal details in an image will shimmer when played on CRT devices when the detail is thinner than a scan line on the TV.  You may know that old fashion CRT technology scans the screen twice to disp;ay one complete frame.   If your horizontal detail is thiner than one scan line, it will be missing every other scan; ergo shimmer.  So blurring the image slightly makes the detail spread out.  You dont have to blur enough to notice.  In older ver of Pr I use the Gausian blur set to a real low amoun.  In later version of Pr there is a setting in the motion filer specifically for his.

                         

                        Or; if is just one edge; scaling it up a tiny amount might fix it also.

                         

                        Edit:  If you see this problem on Non CRTs; it may be somethig else.  In that case; describe your workflow.   What size are the images, what effects, what project preset are you using, how are you exporting?

                        • 9. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          Curt,

                           

                          For Titles and similar, when going to CRT displays, I've found that a tiny bit of Horizontal Blur works wonders. Depending on the still images, I'd look into that too - though, as you say, with a tiny amount.

                           

                          Good luck,

                           

                          Hunt

                          • 10. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                            DonAndress Level 1

                            @Curt

                            Ok, so I attached MPG file this time, it's without blur.

                             

                            I can see this problem on LCD FullHD monitor.

                             

                             

                            Data you requested:

                             

                            Images size: 1060x1220px,

                            the movie is NTSC DVD so it has 720x480px

                            I scale images from 20% to 30%.

                             

                            Effects I use: only motion (position, scale)

                             

                            Project preset: DV, 29.27, 720x480, DV1 NTSC (0.9),

                            render-> DV (NTSC)

                            color-> millions

                             

                            Export: the same as project preset, progressive.

                             

                             

                             

                            And about blur effect. I added gaussian blur = 4 and edges are smoother but, what is obvious, I can see a slight decrease of the picture quality.

                            Is there a solution that doesn't make it worse?

                             

                             

                             

                            @Rod

                            I tried anti-aliasing. I added it to each clip but there are no settings of it (for example strength) and unfortunatelly it doesn't help in my case.

                            • 11. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                              Level 1

                              Hmmm,

                               

                              You have photoshop?

                               

                              If so, how about adding slight blur (gaussian or just normal blur tool at low opacity...think I would use the blur tool first...)

                               

                              Try this:

                              Make a rectangular selection so that you only have a little of the border outside the selection.  use guides (snap to guides) to make it even around your frame...

                              Invert the selection

                              Feather the selection about 10-20 (depends entirely on your image dimensions how much effect that has..the feather...I will see if I can get a still image form your sample and test..)

                              Use blur tool  Mode: normal   Strength: 8%

                              This makes a tool that you can move around the edge with mouse fluently and with only a gradual effect...with finesse...kinda like when you burn real photo prints at a very high F-stop so you can have more control over it ...do a couple passes with the blur tool through the active selection..

                               

                              That should only effect your edge and not your image...and should be feathered enough so you don't see any " line " where the blur starts and stops...

                               

                              Same with Gaussian if you want...set it low like .5...but I think I would do the blur tool instead...more control...less noticable.

                               

                              Rod

                              • 12. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                Level 1

                                Hi.

                                 

                                I don't know why but your image got stretched out when I exported the frame from premiere...

                                 

                                I blurred mostly sides and bottom (not top as much)...using that selection thing mentioned earlier....using photoshop.

                                 

                                Since I'm new at this I didn't get the speed of the transition as slow as I'd like....but I think you can see some improvement on those edges, and maybe it will give you a way to make that jitter less noticeable without affecting whole image.

                                 

                                Rod

                                 

                                This is first attempt at attaching a file to mail ...so I hope this works !

                                 

                                : P

                                 

                                Rod

                                 

                                Hmmmm...guess what ?  I just got this message back ( " recovered " notice which I clicked and presto, here's my message from a while ago )...

                                 

                                And, want to hear something funny ?  The file I attached (the 1.5 meg video of your floating image which I blurred in photoshop and re-introduced to the black frame project I made in Premiere) is GONE.  I will add to this hilarity by saying, "yes, I deleted everything from my computer already"....haha.

                                So, just take my word for it, blurring just the edges a little bit helps.   sheesh.

                                 

                                Rod (wondering what happens to video files that fly off into the ether of cyberspace never to be seen again ? )

                                • 13. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                  Curt Wrigley Level 4

                                  DonAndress wrote:

                                   

                                  @Curt

                                  Ok, so I attached MPG file this time, it's without blur.

                                   

                                  I can see this problem on LCD FullHD monitor.

                                   

                                   

                                  Data you requested:

                                   

                                  Images size: 1060x1220px,

                                  the movie is NTSC DVD so it has 720x480px

                                  I scale images from 20% to 30%.

                                   

                                  Effects I use: only motion (position, scale)

                                   

                                  Project preset: DV, 29.27, 720x480, DV1 NTSC (0.9),

                                  render-> DV (NTSC)

                                  color-> millions

                                   

                                  Export: the same as project preset, progressive.

                                   

                                   

                                   

                                  The project preset isnt progressive.   So part of you problem may be mixing formats.  Let me re-create what you are doing as a test...   Are you doing the poloroid border on the image in PS or adding the border in Premiere?

                                  • 14. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                    Level 1

                                    Hi Curt and Don....

                                     

                                    Do you guys mind if I tag along, try to follow you on this? I could learn a lot...

                                     

                                    Don't mind me...you know, I'm a fly on the wall...  but I'd love to do this too because I love the effect Don created, his timing and cross dissolve etc.

                                     

                                    I'm pretty sure he did the image on the white in psd and then put that on the black screen ???

                                     

                                    Are you going to make up your own image file for the test Curt ??

                                     

                                    Rod

                                    • 15. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                      Curt Wrigley Level 4

                                      I just did a quick reproduction in Pr and exported at mpg4...   It doesnt jitter for me.

                                       

                                      I used standard DV NTSC SD preset' exported with default h264 options

                                       

                                      I did the poloroid background in Pr just a white box in the titler.

                                       

                                      One thing to watch out for is using pure white.  Dont do it.  NTSC has problems displaying pure white especially on black.

                                      1 person found this helpful
                                      • 16. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                        DonAndress Level 1

                                        Guys,

                                        first of all thanks for helping me

                                         

                                        Curt, I actually did a progressive version, problem is I uploaded interlaced one.

                                        And please take my word on that, in my case/project it doesn't matter if the output is progressive or interlaced. Jitter effect is the same.

                                         

                                        The image I try to animate is a single-layer image made in PS, it has polaroid-effect border already in it. I actually didn't know that NTSC has problems with pure white but my white is not white. I used a little bit grey color.

                                         

                                        So you suggest I prepare in PS only the image and then add polaroid-effect border in Premiere?

                                        If so, how to link image and border to move simultaneously?

                                        Does it matter that I use Pr Pro 1.5 and not newer?

                                         

                                         

                                         

                                        Rod, in my sequence I added only image to black screen, no alpha channels, no transparency. I wanted to make it as simple as possible.

                                         

                                        And if anyone needs, I can upload the image, no problem with that.

                                         

                                         

                                         

                                        -----EDIT------------------

                                        And Oh My God...

                                        I've got also a major problem with titles made in Premiere.

                                        I use Titler to make simple title, no movement. In the Monitor it looks fine (but the monitor window is rather small) but after exporting, edges are jagged (look like stairs). And again adding gaussian blur even at amount of 1 helps but the title is not sharp.

                                        How can I improve it?

                                        • 17. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                                          This TUTORIAL will give you some tips on Titles.

                                           

                                          Good luck,

                                           

                                          Hunt

                                          1 person found this helpful
                                          • 18. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                            Level 1

                                            Hi u all...

                                             

                                            Went through another tutorial yesterday (learning basically how to set up workflow and how to use basic edit controls).

                                             

                                            Trying this moving still image thing ( I haven't done the tutorial for this yet, so I'm flying blind ) has been interesting.

                                             

                                            Curt, your sample looks good. Smooth.

                                             

                                            I don't know if this will work (didn't last time) but I will try to attach my moving image thing...

                                             

                                            Two things I ran across I don't know the answers to yet...

                                             

                                            1) Best ppi for imported image for most clarity on rendering. I tried 72 and it was horrible, but that might have been any number of other screwups on my part regarding exporting the video.  This one was 300 ppi, which seems a bit nutty as there's no way it can be used or seen on a TV or monitor.

                                             

                                            2) How to make the image move at the same rate throughout the timeline.  I'm sure I'll get this from the tutorials I've yet to do but was wondering, since it's being scaled as well as moved if the scaling always gives the impression of moving faster...

                                             

                                            I didn't use 255 white, Curt...and I did blur the edges a little bit....  Seems nice enough....

                                             

                                            Rod                        ps   first one static, second one moving

                                            • 19. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                              Curt Wrigley Level 4

                                              DonAndress wrote:

                                               

                                               

                                              So you suggest I prepare in PS only the image and then add polaroid-effect border in Premiere?

                                              If so, how to link image and border to move simultaneously?

                                              Does it matter that I use Pr Pro 1.5 and not newer?

                                               

                                               

                                               

                                              No, I just did it all in Pr as a test.  Adding the border in PS is fine and should work as well.

                                              I dont have Pr 1.5; the oldest ver I have is CS3; but It should work in 1.5 I believe..

                                               

                                              Yes; please post a sample PSD you are using; Ill try using that

                                              • 20. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                DonAndress Level 1

                                                Hunt, thank you very much for this tutorial.

                                                Now, I know DV codec is not lossless (compression 5:1) but if DV codec is not the best idea, what should I use to compress it initially for further editing without lossiness?

                                                 

                                                 

                                                Curt, in attachment I uploaded image with single layer only (merged).

                                                • 21. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                                                  1) Best ppi for imported image for most clarity on rendering. I tried 72 and it was horrible, but that might have been any number of other screwups on my part regarding exporting the video.  This one was 300 ppi, which seems a bit nutty as there's no way it can be used or seen on a TV or monitor.

                                                   

                                                  Actually, ppi/dpi are totally ignored in video. I'd say that most likely the method used to alter the images is at fault here. All that matters in video is the pixel x pixel dimensions.

                                                   

                                                  Now, this ARTICLE will give you some tips on resizing your still images, pixels x pixels, and doing so with a fairly high degree of automation.

                                                   

                                                  Good luck,

                                                   

                                                  Hunt

                                                   

                                                  PS - especially if you are starting with a JPEG image, I'd keep things in .PSD out of Photoshop and NOT do another JPEG compression again.

                                                  • 22. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                    For lossless transport of files, I like the Lagarith Lossless. It works well, though the files ARE larger.

                                                     

                                                    Good luck,

                                                     

                                                    Hunt

                                                    • 23. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                      Level 1

                                                      This has been pretty interesting...

                                                       

                                                      Thanks everyone for this cool string of messages...

                                                       

                                                      The last thing I did, just now, is that I copied Don's image into photoshop and checked out the dimensions and so on...

                                                      Then I opened a new file of same dimensions and stuck my image of Dani into the same space...

                                                       

                                                      Then I did a little blurring of the edges where the images meet the almost white border.

                                                       

                                                      Imported to Premiere same as Curt's settings and exported same way...

                                                       

                                                      The earlier image of Dani that I did was different dimensions (not copying Don's as I did this time) but was imported and exported same way as per Curt's suggestion (how he did his test)

                                                      That was: import dv ntsc 720x480 29.97, default preset..

                                                      Export was media encoder mp4 default

                                                       

                                                      Sooooo, what I discovered  ( I think ) is that Don's image dimensions (and my copy using Dani ) have to be scaled down so much in the black video that it causes the jumpy stuff somehow.  My earlier trial of Dani , where the image was not scaled down hardly at all, doesn't appear to be jumping.  Everything else I did the same, the blurring of the edges and so on.....The only variable I can see is the image dimensions and the amount of scale to arrive at a nice size in the screen.

                                                       

                                                      These two exports demonstrates it, I think.

                                                      • 24. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                        Level 1

                                                        And....here is Don's picture moving with less jitter..

                                                        .

                                                         

                                                        But I screwed up on the size of the image and had to scale down to about 80% anyway...I think it would be more clear and smooth if it didn't have to be scaled at all (at it's full size on screen)...

                                                         

                                                        Rod

                                                        • 25. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                          DonAndress Level 1

                                                          Rod, can you please make a test with small image but size-increasing while moving? You know, it's my artistic vision

                                                          I have the picture with the size you know, then I scale it to 20% at frame 1 and increase the size up to 30% at frame 90.

                                                           

                                                          With your smaller dimentions do you still got rid of this jitter effect?

                                                           

                                                           

                                                           

                                                          Hunt, I have a major problem with Lagarith codec.

                                                          It produces huge artifacts (green for YV12 and red for RGB) that take like 1/3 of the movie surface. The artifacts are not still, they flicker.

                                                          Of course I downloaded the newest version from the website.

                                                          What the heck?

                                                          • 26. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                            Level 1

                                                            Ya, Hunt, I'm getting the hang of  this a little.

                                                            A TV camera scans for an image, whereas a TV monitor uses the scan lines to reproduce it.  So ppi wouldnt matter, as that is more a print type thing or graphic thing....the process to convert this stuff to video must simply be similar to the TV camera scanning for it's image. (light bulb went on in head)

                                                             

                                                            That said, I would stay at 300ppi just because these images always get adjusted in PSD and for that I find 300 much better than 72, 96 etc.

                                                             

                                                            This has been fun. I learned how to do the image movement and fade / scale .....in the beginning I was making a "position" change for each adjustment in scale and opacity... a new position keyframe for each change...  duh....So the image movement was erratic ...

                                                             

                                                            Now I'm getting the hang of it...

                                                             

                                                            Thanks for helping.

                                                             

                                                            Rod

                                                            • 27. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                              Level 1

                                                              Don,

                                                              Here is the image and the exported video of the smaller size.

                                                               

                                                              I was still off by 10% on the image...it shoud be 10% smaller than it is now.

                                                               

                                                              I blurred the edges too much. I would do less blur on the edges than what you see.  Compare it to what you work on in PSD (open side by side) and you'll get an idea how much to blur it ..

                                                               

                                                              I made some notes:

                                                               

                                                              1) Who is your audience ? TV ? Computer ?

                                                              This sample mp4 video is progressive...I didn't try interleaved.  So that would depend on who is going to view it (how they view it)...what you want to use to make the video.  I was just happy to deal with the jitters and will leave the rest up to you.

                                                               

                                                              2) My monitor refresh rate is 75. Yours might be 85 or higher, in which case this video will look better on your monitor.

                                                               

                                                              3) Leave image at 300ppi (psd).  When you work on the image to change things the higher res will make those changes smoother, nicer..

                                                               

                                                              4) When images go down in size this much ( from your original WAY bigger size ) you should adjust picture quality stuff, like levels, or contrast/brightness, color, saturation, etc....so it looks good small ....  You can do macros in PSD to do that stuff fast for a lot of images. I think Hunt has an article link in one of his messages about that earlier in this thread.

                                                               

                                                              Rod

                                                              • 28. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                Level 1

                                                                Hi Hunt,

                                                                 

                                                                Nice article on how you resize and convert images.

                                                                 

                                                                Is that for documentaries and / or annual report things ? Industrials ?

                                                                 

                                                                Is a lot of material (still images) to augment a video...

                                                                 

                                                                I copied it to WORD reformatted and saved it for printing later...will add to my now HUGE Spiral binder notebook...I will have to get another one soon.

                                                                 

                                                                It's nice...plastic photo type sheet holders for the pages so you don't have to use those high school donut things to keep pages from tearing out...

                                                                 

                                                                If I was further along with this I would ask you about your various bicubic things and algorithms as it applies to video, but it will have to wait a few more days.

                                                                 

                                                                I just bought a book at Micro computer store, in their 'bargain' area (marked down because nobody wants them). The MPEG Handbook, 2nd edition , by Watkinson , for (get this ! ) 54 cents !!!!!  Geez.  54 cents !

                                                                What a cool book !

                                                                 

                                                                Rod

                                                                • 29. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                  Rod,

                                                                   

                                                                  I've done these for a combo of uses. Right now, I'm working on a tribute DVD set with over 2000 still images, 100's of .MOV files, and a handful of .AVI's. This was basically a family tree chronicle, that ends with the life of the client's mother, who visualized the epic. It's a little over 8 hours now, and will probably fill 5 DVD-5's, when done.

                                                                   

                                                                  I think that the two most common uses of lots of stills would be the tribute/family album and the travelogue, though I have done a few industrials, where there is a speaker, and rather than inserting cutaways to his slide presentation, I've used stills from those slides. I find this much better than trying to get PowerPoint presentations to look good. In one, I just re-created each "slide" in Illustrator and Photoshop.

                                                                   

                                                                  Because anything that I do for myself, with still images, starts as RAW, and is then processed to .PSD, I will use my Actions to resize, and still keep things in .PSD format. Since I resize to exactly what I'll need, I might have 3-4 folders. The main will be sized to my Project's Frame Size and PAR, with some a bit larger for panning on the zoomed out image, and then maybe some more just a bit larger still. I like to do all of my resizing in PS for several reasons, and also like to keep my Assets "lean & mean," so I never have any resource problems, even when I end up with 20 Sequences and thousands of stills.

                                                                   

                                                                  Hope this helps,

                                                                   

                                                                  Hunt

                                                                  • 30. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                    Level 1

                                                                    Hunt,

                                                                    Wow, that is great... doing a project like that. It must be great fun to pull something like that together.  And rewarding, when you see how satisfied the "client" family is...

                                                                     

                                                                    That's very nice.

                                                                     

                                                                    And thanks for explaining how you handle the image workload re: folders and sizes ( for various purposes).

                                                                     

                                                                    I can see how that would work out well.

                                                                     

                                                                    I did something similar re: organization of images for a small web site I built for a friend...

                                                                     

                                                                    http://rodneybauer.com/hhsilversmith/index.htm

                                                                     

                                                                    You can see the galleries (12) have 8 images each. Both horizontal and vertical images had to fit within the framework of the 'tables and cells' that make up a website page (html page).  All the images had to get resized, get a border added, etc...and preserve the original stuff.

                                                                    So I had one folder for vertical and one for horizontal images, original and those acted on by the "action"...there was also the image type conversion folders.

                                                                    Got kind of easy to do once I got it laid out right.  Thing is, now I can pop any image out and put another in, and the "space" on the webpage is happy with the size, otherwise the entire page changes it's design...like putting too big a thing in any "table" "cell"  (ms word tables, etc).  In your case, with some aspect ratios that wouldn't maybe accomodate a width or height dimension, you would want a larger size so you don't fall short...like pasting into a place where you otherwise would have run out of image in one dimension if the image wasn't large enough.

                                                                     

                                                                    I got to the part where you mention "frame size and PAR" and didn't know what "PAR" stands for. I did my usual google search when confronted with that sort of thing...

                                                                    Found this interesting thing..

                                                                    http://www.transcoding.org/transcode?Calculating_Frame_Size_And_Aspect_Ratio

                                                                     

                                                                    I copy that sort of stuff into WORD. Then I have to do a quick reformat and save it to my desktop for printing later...and it goes in my "BOOK".  You have no idea how much stuff I have got in the past couple weeks !  During the reformat, believe it or not, I read part of the thing, and remember some of it...so when I have a question that relates to something I've printed out I know I have the answer somewhere in the "book".

                                                                     

                                                                    Things have been working out well here....and I like the socializing too a little...in between doing the tutorials and and so on...this excercise was good for me to learn how to do a little movement and scaling and so on....and got more into the quality issues... I had never used anything in the media encoder before today.

                                                                     

                                                                    Rod

                                                                    • 31. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                      Rod,

                                                                       

                                                                      You bring up an interesting point regarding vertical and horizontal images. This often comes up when one is discussing what are basically SlideShows in an NLE. As our video Frame is a horizontal rectangle, to some degree, or another, what does one do with those vertical images - the ones that looked so good, printed and hanging on the wall?

                                                                       

                                                                      There are several basic ways to handle them:

                                                                       

                                                                      1.) Crop a horizontal portion from the vertical image (sometimes works, and sometimes does not

                                                                       

                                                                      2.) Allow black bars around the vertical image and size it so that its height equals the height of the Frame (can be OK, but not really what we usually want)

                                                                       

                                                                      3.) Create a "background" that fills the horizontal Frame, and then overlay the vertical image onto that, as in #2, but with no black bars.

                                                                       

                                                                      Personally, I like #3, followed by #1, when I can crop. One can even have some fun with the "background" image. I go for an abstraction and usually will "soften" its look by reducing the contrast, saturation and probably a good dose of blur. All I want is something to fill the black bar spaces. HERE is a mini-tutorial that I did for animating the "creation" of a background image to use with vertical (and horizontal, though they take up the entire screen, so you do not see the background behind them) images in a SlideShow.

                                                                       

                                                                      Just wanted to add that, since we are talking about still images and you mentioned the vertical and horizontal frames in the Web site.

                                                                       

                                                                      Hunt

                                                                      • 32. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                        Level 4

                                                                        Bill,

                                                                         

                                                                        in the beginning did you draw a path and make selection at the tree line to start your radial fill adjustment layer...??  It looks pretty isolated at first...like not bleeding into the tree line...or was that blending ? Or am I seeing things ?

                                                                        what a brilliant piece of work !  Beautiful !

                                                                        Did you use a grip stand and stick those branches and leaves in the left foreground or was that natural ?
                                                                        (you see my warped sense of humor due to movie crew experience)  "Hey, you over there, get some tree branches, quick !"

                                                                        What a great piece this is...I wish I could have the video as a part of my tutorials here on the computer..

                                                                        But I will definitely re-visit this site to check on the details of how you did this...

                                                                        What a cool idea...  !!!!

                                                                        Rod

                                                                         

                                                                        I just spent 3 hours in computer cookie hell

                                                                         

                                                                        Last night I went on a " kill all the cookies " rampage   (due to some problems with certain web sites)

                                                                         

                                                                        I did smoething bad to adobe cookies for these forums and my forum mail...

                                                                         

                                                                        I am now a new robodog....went from robodog1 to robodog2....new email address to accomodate this new dog...geez what a royal pain in butt !

                                                                         

                                                                        One thing became apparent right away....these forums are ESSENTIAL for me to learn this program quickly and to utilize the BEST workflows, concepts, artistic elements and technical knowhow....  Or believe me, I would not have spent all this time when I have tons of other things to do, to just get back on line to these forums...  ugh, what a nightmare that was...

                                                                         

                                                                        Im off to do stuff....

                                                                        Thanks again for your link to that great piece of work you did...a great photo and then on top of that a great transition, all with a definite purpose ...goes to show you,   real art can in fact be practical and utilitarian as well as beautiful !  who woulda thought in this day and age of abstract nonsense ?

                                                                         

                                                                        Rod

                                                                        • 33. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                          the_wine_snob Level 9
                                                                          in the beginning did you draw a path and make selection at the tree line to start your radial fill adjustment layer...??  It looks pretty isolated at first...like not bleeding into the tree line...or was that blending ? Or am I seeing things ?

                                                                           

                                                                          What I think you are seeing is the limitation of the FLV that is uploaded. It appears that the sky area is a bit posterized in that example. In PrPro, or in the Exported AV file, it is far smoother, with less of that "banding."

                                                                           

                                                                          Did you use a grip stand and stick those branches and leaves in the left foreground or was that natural ?
                                                                          (you see my warped sense of humor due to movie crew experience)  "Hey, you over there, get some tree branches, quick !"

                                                                           

                                                                          In that case, they were just as I found them. Now, when doing ads for my real estate clients, I almost always traveled with a box of "branches." As many of these developments had new landscaping and tiny trees. I kept a bunch of different ones, and always haunted the silk flower places in search of more. I went with examples that were likely to be seen in Colorado, and had a ton of various evergreen branches. Many assistants got their start in the biz by fluffing up my evergreen branches! Oh, and carrying my 4x5 kit, plus dozens of stands, all over the Front Range and the High Country. Good start for 'em too.

                                                                           

                                                                          I am now a new robodog

                                                                           

                                                                          Yeah, some of the various things relating to the Adobe I.D. and cookies for browsers can be frustrating. The Adobe Web team is working on some, but others might be with us.

                                                                           

                                                                          Welcome New RoboDog!

                                                                           

                                                                          Hunt

                                                                          • 34. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                            DonAndress Level 1

                                                                            Rod,

                                                                            robodog1 or robodog2

                                                                            I tried to apply your suggestion with making the image smaller before importing, in PS, and it works perfectly!

                                                                            Finally got the edges sharper. Thanks a hundred, man.

                                                                             

                                                                            Also Curt's solution works well but in that case all image gets blurred.

                                                                             

                                                                             

                                                                             

                                                                            Regarding codecs, I established that it's best to use:

                                                                            • Huffyuv for moving pictures
                                                                            • Lagarith for not moving titles
                                                                            • DV for the actual movie ('cause the source was DV and there's no further conversion)

                                                                             

                                                                            Then I will use Avisynth to join all above pieces together and convert to MPEG2 and put on DVD.

                                                                            That way I avoid artifacts and quality deterioration.

                                                                             

                                                                             

                                                                            So thank you all for your time and help!

                                                                            • 35. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                              Level 4

                                                                              Hi

                                                                               

                                                                              Bill , that sample is just soooo cool.

                                                                               

                                                                              I like it so much it is going to be part of "the book"... my quickly growing compilation of materials, notes, observations, advice and so on...pertaining to using Premiere - and related to editing in general re: using the program.  That is sooo cool.  I don't know if you recall, but when I first got on this forum I was curious about using individual frames (animation type use) and did export an FLV back then...someone recommended using sequence renamer, which I got...

                                                                              Anyway, your explanation of working on it and the sample video is just perfect ...so it goes in the book....

                                                                               

                                                                              Thanks.

                                                                              Rod

                                                                               

                                                                               

                                                                              ps I lived in Denver 1970-75, working seismograph in Wyoming for 2 of those years (keeping apt with wife in Denver while working up there)...was quite the experience....  talk about tramping around...  Was a junior observer (in the truck with the recording stuff) but worked the line a lot too...Nice out there.

                                                                              • 36. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                                Level 4

                                                                                Good going Don !

                                                                                 

                                                                                : )

                                                                                 

                                                                                Thanks about codec info....goes in my book...haha..

                                                                                 

                                                                                I better spend an hour or so printing the stuff up I've been collecting on my desktop..get organized ...

                                                                                (for some reason I just thought of Jonathan Winters running around in the bar in " It's a Mad Mad Mad World", saying, "We gotta get Organized here, Come on you guys, We gotta get Organized !" )

                                                                                 

                                                                                You gotta check out Hunt's liink up a ways on this thread..about using "actions" (like macros) for handling a bunch of images at the same time...it really helps a LOT to do that stuff....though I've only done hundreds of images like that....not THOUSANDS...but it's all the same ...

                                                                                 

                                                                                Well great going..and please upload a sample of what you do when you get done OK ???  I really like the timing you have for the fades and motion and so on...plus the images themselves...would love to see what you end up doing...

                                                                                 

                                                                                Rod

                                                                                • 37. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                                  Believe me, the real, uncompressed results are much better, than the FLV display in the tiny player, but HEY, Muvipix allows me to write articles and attach examples, and they are all great people. Give the steps a try. Note: your initial image might well require different treatment, maybe not a sunrise, but the general steps will be about the same, just different Adjustment Layers, and different Filters.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Thanks for the kind words.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  I lived in Denver 1970-75, working seismograph in Wyoming for 2 of those years (keeping apt with wife in Denver while working up there)...was quite the experience....  talk about tramping around.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  In 1975 I was either hanging out of a helicopter with a CP-16, or a Hassleblad, and shooting Gulf exploration and production. It was not until 1980 that we moved from New Orleans to Denver, so my wife could do grad school at CU Denver in Hospital Administration. When I arrived, I was surprised that many of my clients had followed me. Companies like NICOR and Louisiana Land & Exploration, had developments in the Anadarko Basin. All of a sudden I was shooting for "old friends."

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Luckily for me, when oil & gas exploration suddenly stopped, my partner was up to his gills with HP, and I gave up my helicopters for studio work. By the time that high-tech died in the Front Range, I had a bunch of high-end real estate clients, so I gave up the studio for custom homes in the mountains. Sometimes, I feel like have a lucky charm somewhere.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  At least we arrived in Denver, when the "food scene" exploded, and got to experience that. Wine selections went from Bali Hi to Ch. Latour, almost over night. Now, I was still the only gentleman to wear a tux for opening night at the theater, or the opera, but then I did come from New Orleans!

                                                                                   

                                                                                  You preceded me by a few years, so you saw a different Denver, than we did.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Let me know how the experiments with your "background" image goes. Remember, my comments were based on my image, and another would get a different treatment, albeit similar.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Good luck,

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Hunt

                                                                                  • 38. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                                    Level 4

                                                                                    Hi...

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Yep, sounds like you got lucky going from one thing that was on its way out, to something on its way in...

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Some of those foothills were getting mighty fancy by the time I left in 1975, and I kept in touch with some artists when I got back to NY.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    One friend (wood sculpture, fine stuff) did things on consignment for a gallery in boulder , $$ up front, and that guy sold Bill's work for about 10 times what he commissioned it for.  Amazing.  We used to play softball every weekend in Cheeseman park. I had a pickup. The park people were so cool, I could drive right onto the fields and transport dirt around to fill in the bases that had puddles from a recent rain...that sort of thing. Was cool...crowd of people would choose two new captains for every game...those captains would choose their players (girls and guys)...so everyone got to play.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Fun.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    I worked for CGG (campagnie geophysiqe de generale ) and petty ray up in wyoming, Idaho. Nice country and saw some great stuff off the road like that...you know...

                                                                                     

                                                                                    : )

                                                                                     

                                                                                    we were lucky to do that sort of thing.  Saw things that are harder and harder to see ....old ranches and so on on thousands of acres of BLM property..

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Anyway, back to the video .

                                                                                     

                                                                                    That was great the way you used the pumpkins !   LOL.... Didn't notice at first conciously...  But they draw you into the buildings and keep those buildings coherent as a "place where one family lives"...pumpkins will do it every time, especially when they are 8 feet in diameter !

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Great job.

                                                                                    Rod

                                                                                     

                                                                                    I have a confession to make.  I captured it with Fraps.  Unfortunately you don't get sound with fraps, and you also get the stupid player controls and player window with the video.

                                                                                    Soooo, I went to Premiere (another first for me...had to figure this out ) and used an 8 point matte and blacked out the the player controls so it looks cleaner ...

                                                                                    Then I went to my brothers music thing (on soundclick) and ripped of a song called "mellow"...

                                                                                    His song was longer than the video so I saved an endframe and stuck it on the end and faded it out as the song ends...

                                                                                    haha...I'm nuts...I know...

                                                                                    If you want to see the product of this crazy behaviour it's here:

                                                                                    http://rodneybauer.com/whiteboard2.htm

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Rod

                                                                                    I sent to my mother to show her how cool Kirk's music sounds with a video...   I'm going to just put it on a CD so I can put it in my book along with your notes (article)... since I use plastic sleeves for the pages a disk will fit in nicely...

                                                                                     

                                                                                    Thanks !

                                                                                     

                                                                                     

                                                                                    http://rodneybauer.com/whiteboard2.htm

                                                                                    • 39. Re: Problem with exporting moving still images
                                                                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                                      Rod,

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Really liked the Audio. The prelude was similar to what I used in the actual piece - a mellow bluegrass piece, as this was from Walland, TN, USA. Maybe it was the banjo (or similar) intro from your brother's music?

                                                                                       

                                                                                      I look upon that as a tribute. Thanks for sharing.

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Hunt

                                                                                       

                                                                                      PS -

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Saw things that are harder and harder to see ....old ranches and so on on thousands of acres of BLM property.

                                                                                       

                                                                                      For twenty years, my partner and I chronicled the demise of the very High Country. Mines, mills and towns, that had once flourished, but were now falling into ruin. He'd gotten a bit of a start on me - about 20 extra years! We had a couple of dozen locations in the San Juans, but also other areas, that we would photograph, every year, to show the destruction of both man, and the elements in a hostile environment. Las Animas was a perfect example of this. Actually, I chalked up over 100,000 miles off-road in my years. Traded in that Landcruiser at over 400,000 miles, and it had gone over all but two passes in CO, at some time in its life. Had it had a winch, it'd have made at least one other. That would leave but one...

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Now, my newer Landcruiser has never tasted even a good wagon road, but I live elsewhere now. I miss those days in Colorado above treeline. I would not trade those for all the great wines known to mankind.

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