10 Replies Latest reply on Jan 20, 2010 5:17 PM by Chris0089

    Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)

    Chris0089 Level 1

      Apologies if this question has been answered before; I looked through a lot of threads about numbering and lists.

       

      My question is whether you can change the numbers in an ordered list to appear left justified. Currently, when a numbered listed goes into double digits, it looks like this:

       

        9.  Step 9

      10.  Step 10

       

      Would it be possible to make it look like this, with the 1 in 10 directly under the 9 instead of to the left:

       

      9.   Step 9

      10. Step 10

       

      I have tried changing different settings but am not sure how to go about it.

       

      If this is not possible, is there a setting to allow numbers/characters to appear in the margin area of a topic?  In my project, we don't indent any of our lists - they need to line up with the paragraph above (which is not indented and start at 0 pt).  This seemed to work in RoboHelp 5, but we have upgraded to 8 and now the 1st digit is cut off when you get to step 10.  For example:

       

      Appearance in RH5:

       

        Paragraph text.

        1.  Step 1, etc

        9.  Step 9

      10. Step 10

      11. Step 11

       

           You can see both digits in the number 10 in design view as well as in the published webhelp.  The first digit is to the left of everything (even to the left of the "Normal" paragraph style which is 0pt), but you can still see it.  However, in RH8, you can see both digits in design view, but not in preview or in webhelp.  In preview/webhelp, it looks like this, with the first digit being cut off:

       

      Paragraph text.

      1.  Step 1, etc.

      9.  Step 9

      0.  Step 10

      1.  Step 11

       

          Is there any way to change this so the first digit appears in the preview/webhelp?

       

      Thanks very much and please let me know if I haven't been clear.

       

      Chris

        • 1. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
          lmarden Level 2

          Hi Chris.

           

          I know you are looking for a solution to this numbering problem, and frankly, I don't have one. But since this isn't the first numbering / outline position issue I have seen with RH, especially RH8, I had to interject a question.

           

          Why are you even numbering instructions? Have you considered not doing so?

           

          I know you are probably thinking I am an idiot - but here's the thing. In the past 15+ years I have been in the wonderful world of help authoring, I have NEVER numbered a set of instructions, unless ordered to do so - and I usually could convince my opponent that it wasn't necessary. And guess what? No end user has EVER complained that the process they were following didn't work because they did the last thing first, or the third thing eighth, or whatever.

           

          I have always used bullets. Sometimes, I will use checkboxes as the bullets - but that's as fancy as I get. I do indent my Procedure style a little too. But that's it. Although end-users can be hysterically silly sometimes, I think that they do now have the presence of mind to follow a set of instructions in the order that they are given.

           

          OK, that's my two cents. Off my soapbox. But seriously. Consider how much effort you are taking to force instructions into a format that probably isn't necessary.

           

          Good luck, if you decide to press on.

          • 2. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
            Chris0089 Level 1

            Thanks very much for your suggestion.

              It would be nice if we could do it that way but unfortunately we have standards and that

            is the standard that all of our procedures must follow. Plus, a number our procedures do get very complex, and we have if/then tables where you might proceed to step 8 if certain conditions are met, vs. step 9 if other conditions are met.  I am hoping that even if the solution/workaround with the numbering is cumbersome, it will still be better than changing our over 1,000 procedures from numbers/letters to bullets (if I was even able to do so).  It would be incredibly time consuming to update each one and review it for step references.

             

            Chris

            • 3. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
              Peter Grainge Adobe Community Professional (Moderator)

              The normal way of writing a column of figures is that they are right aligned (try adding up a column of figures that is left aligned). I think this is why numbered lists follow that convention.

               

              To avoid numbers being cut off, you have to have a margin-left in your CSS that is sufficient to avoid the problem. This can mean single digit steps are indented further than you want. In the words of a former developer I worked with B*****d that one (meaning you have to live it).

               


              See www.grainge.org for RoboHelp and Authoring tips

              Follow me @petergrainge

              • 4. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                Chris0089 Level 1

                Peter Grainge wrote:

                 

                The normal way of writing a column of figures is that they are right aligned (try adding up a column of figures that is left aligned). I think this is why numbered lists follow that convention.

                 

                To avoid numbers being cut off, you have to have a margin-left in your CSS that is sufficient to avoid the problem. This can mean single digit steps are indented further than you want. In the words of a former developer I worked with B*****d that one (meaning you have to live it).

                 


                See www.grainge.org for RoboHelp and Authoring tips

                Follow me @petergrainge

                 

                Thanks Peter.  Do you know why we are able to view the double digit numbers in X5?  It seems as if X5 lets you utilize the margin area to display that extra digit, but X8 doesn't.  Is there a difference with the HTML code? Trying to figure out if there is a way we can trick it to make it work like X5. I know we were a few versions behind so I'm not sure if we would have encountered this same issue with X6 or X7.

                 

                thanks again!

                • 5. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                  Peter Grainge Adobe Community Professional (Moderator)

                  Probably down to stricter adherence to standards.

                   

                  BTW. X was dropped at X5. It is now RoboHelp 6, 7 and 8.

                   


                  See www.grainge.org for RoboHelp and Authoring tips

                  Follow me @petergrainge

                  • 6. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                    MergeThis Level 4

                    I guess if you really, really, really, really need those numbers to appear that way, you could (with a lot of work) create gif files of all the numbers you'll need, then place them in Column 1 of a borderless table to match the steps in Column 2. You might even be able to hijack the numbers from whatever graphics apps you might have handy instead of creating your own (I know SnagIt has several styles of number callouts, for instance).

                     

                     

                    Good luck,

                    Leon

                    • 7. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                      RobWer1

                      I also would like a solution to this problem. Have you worked this out yet Chris?

                      I have settled for the indent to the right when the list reaches double digits only because i am so happy to have finally resolved another issue of hanging indents which had been bugging me but i would like to sort this one out too if possible.

                      • 8. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                        Chris0089 Level 1

                        Hi Rob.  Unfortunately not.  I have tried to find some html code that might allow me to have left-aligned numbers, but so far I haven't had much luck.  I did find this code but it seems to cause too many other problems (for example lines do not wrap correctly): ol { list-style-position: inside }.

                         

                        I'll continue to look for a solution and will let you know if I find anything. Please do the same if you find a solution in the mean time.

                         

                        Chris

                        • 9. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                          RobWer1 Level 1

                          Chris,

                          I found it extremely dififcult to satisfactorily wrap text in my 1st level bullets, numbers and checkmark styles and then for second level bullets plus 2 levels of indent styles. I repeated the steps many times with different settings in RH to create RH styles and map them with the FM styles but couldn't get the wrapping right.

                           

                          After the v8.0.2 update i found suddenly, when creating new Robohelp styles and mapping them to FM styles, that the wrapping issue was resolved. Can't figure out what or why but for the settings i use the following:

                          • Convert the autonumber to text
                          • Create character styles to match the ones in FM (for bullets)
                          • Set left indent and hanging indent.

                          Seems to be working but i dont understand why now and not before.

                           

                          <sigh> It all seemed so much easier to control and more stable with Webworks Pro although i understand that Css is the key with robohelp so i will persevere.

                          • 10. Re: Position of Numbers in List (RoboHelp 8 HTML)
                            Chris0089 Level 1

                            I have found some helpful code for making the numbers left-aligned: http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum83/9056.htm. Scroll down to the 3rd post for the code.

                             

                            Using that code, the numbers are left-aligned and it works very well.  This is still a time consuming solution because each topic will have to be updated, but it's the best solution I've found so far.  Also, you do see the new class (left-align) as a list style under Styles and Formatting.  So you wouldn't need to edit the html code for each topic, but could select your list and apply the left-align style for steps 1-9 for each topic.

                             

                            Note that when using the above code, the list itself is still indented.  We can't have our lists indented, and if you play around with the em measurements, you can get around that too.

                             

                            I'll continue to update if I find a solution that works even better (or wouldn't involve editing each topic).

                             

                            Chris