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1. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Jan 13, 2010 4:14 AM (in response to jt77474)I don't think there is a way to sort folder names in Lightroom 2.5.
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2. Re: Sort folders by date
Pete Marshall Jan 13, 2010 5:23 AM (in response to jt77474)Folders are shown in alphabetical order Other than changing the folder names this cannot be changed. To sort images by capture date or however else you wish, you can use the various functions of LR. To find all the images within your catalog taken on a particular date..select All Photographs, then from the Library Filter, select, Metadata, Date and then the date you require. If you want all images taken on a particular date to be part of a collection, you can then do this. There are many different ways to catalog and sort images in LR. Folders are not important as far as LR is concerned, they are just the location of the files on your hard disk. Best to ignore them and use the facilities in LR itself.
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3. Re: Sort folders by date
jt77474 Jan 13, 2010 6:09 AM (in response to Pete Marshall)Thanks for your replies. It sounds like sorting the catalogue or making special collections is time consuming and tedious.
I name my folders by month and year. In picasa it's so easy to start at the top, and if I want to hop down from Dec in Oct then I can do that in one simple click. But not if they're alphabetical.
Even if folders are not the best way, I still don't understand why adobe wouldn't implement something as blindingly obvious as the ability to sort by date. Do I seriously have to rename all my folders just to get them to sort as I want? I can do this with betterfilerename, but it's a major hassle.
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4. Re: Sort folders by date
MikeLeone Jan 13, 2010 6:25 AM (in response to jt77474)jt77474 had this to say:
Thanks for your replies. It sounds like sorting the catalogue or making special collections is time consuming and tedious.
Not at all. You have to specify your criteria once, of course, but you'd
have to do that in any circumstance, to limit your views to what you want.
I name my folders by month and year. In picasa it's so easy to start at the top, and if I want to hop down from Dec in Oct then I can do that in one simple click. But not if they're alphabetical.
That's why I name my folders "2010-01-12 Zoo pictures", etc. That way,
they always stay in date order. And I use smart collections to filter by
a keyword for primary subject ("mural", "family event", etc)
Even if folders are not the best way, I still don't understand why adobe wouldn't implement something as blindingly obvious as the ability to sort by date. Do I seriously have to rename all my folders just to get them to sort as I want? I can do this with betterfilerename, but it's a major hassle.
You could make a smart collection that orders by capture date.
Don't forget, one of the main philosophical ideas behind LR is to do
away with the dependence on "folders" as a primary organizational and
searching method. That's what collections and smart collections are for.
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5. Re: Sort folders by date
jt77474 Jan 13, 2010 6:34 AM (in response to MikeLeone)Sure, that's helpful to know the philosophy behind it all.
It's great that LR provides such useful alternatives to folders for those who want to work that way.
But I don't see why that should mean penalising those of us who still value the role of folders. It doesn't explain why the ability to sort should be intentionally crippled. It seems such a basic requirement that bizarrely is missing.
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6. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Jan 13, 2010 7:03 AM (in response to jt77474)Sure, that's helpful to know the philosophy behind it all.
It's great that LR provides such useful alternatives to folders for those who want to work that way.
But I don't see why that should mean penalising those of us who still value the role of folders. It doesn't explain why the ability to sort should be intentionally crippled. It seems such a basic requirement that bizarrely is missing.
If the philosophy underlying the software is to de-emphasize folders in a piece of software, then I don't think is is bizarre that folders are de-emphasized. Lightroom never intended to duplicate the capabilities of other software, nor did it intend to duplicate all of the folder handling methods in the operating system.
If the software doesn't meet your needs (and clearly, there are many people who are not willing to give up folder-based organization methods), then you might not want to continue using Lightroom; or alternatively, you have to live within Lightroom's capabilities; or alternatively, on a positive note, learn to embrace the very powerful capabilities that Lightroom has for organizing your photos that don't involve folders, such as keywords, metadata and collections for doing your organizing.
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7. Re: Sort folders by date
jt77474 Jan 13, 2010 7:19 AM (in response to dj_paige)Why is there even a folders pane at all then? I don't understand why they included it if they're so anti folders.
I can't think of a quicker way to jump to my October pictures than to click once on the folder called October. That's what I do in picasa. One click, that's it. Bingo, magic.
Your method demands clicking on metadata, clicking on something else, scrolling down the window, resizing, losing screen area to the metadate pane.....basically precious time wasted. How can that be the best approach?
Why should I have to spend weeks keywording my images just to make the software usable? I don't deny that a well keyworded catalogue is a useful resource, but why does adobe do our thinking for us and restrict users such as me? Why should I have to rename all my folders with a numerical suffix as a workaround for basic functionality?
Pretty indefensible to me.
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8. Re: Sort folders by date
MikeLeone Jan 13, 2010 7:33 AM (in response to jt77474)jt77474 had this to say:
Why is there even a folders pane at all then? I don't understand why they included it if they're so anti folders.
I can't think of a quicker way to jump to my October pictures than to click once on the folder called October. That's what I do in picasa. One click, that's it. Bingo, magic.
If you make a smart collection that limits itself to capture >= Oct 1,
and <= Oct 31, then all you do is one click on the smart collection
called "October Photos". As you say - bingo, magic.
You had to spend the time to create an October folder, and remember to
put only specific photos in (those taken in October). Not that different
from making the time to set up the smart collection.
Your method demands clicking on metadata, clicking on something else,
scrolling down the window, resizing, losing screen area to the metadate
> pane.....
> basically precious time wasted. How can that be the best approach?
Because you only do those actions once - to set the filter. As opposed
to you having to remember to import the photos into the folder that you
think they belong to (suppose you inadvertently import November photos
into the October folder; now you'd messed everything up, and will have
to manually move photos around. With a smart collection, that worry goes
away).
Why should I have to spend weeks keywording my images just to make
the software usable?
> I don't deny that a well keyworded catalogue is a
> useful resource, but why does adobe do our thinking for us and
> restrict users such as me? Why should I have to rename all my
> folders with a numerical suffix as a workaround for basic
> functionality?
Smart collections and searches give you more than basic functionality.
And you don't have to rename anything. Just make up some smart filters,
and click on those. You will get the same effects - no, you'll get more,
since the smart filters can narrow or expand criteria much more than
just folder names.
Me, I use a combination of methods. I have folders "2009-04-15 Murals",
2009-09-27 Murals", etc. But I also have a smart collection called
"Murals", which shows me only the photos with a keyword of "murals". Now
I don't have to click on each of the folder names in sequence, looking
for a specific mural. I click the smart collection, which shows me all
the murals, regardless of folder location, and I just scroll on down,
until I see the one I want.
That's a lot easier, and less clicking, than clicking and looking
through the dozens of folders I have of mural photos.
Pretty indefensible to me.
Then don't use the software. I mean, really - since you say you're
so adamant that you find these features a hindrance to the way you want
to work, then you'd be better served by using some other software.
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9. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Jan 13, 2010 7:39 AM (in response to jt77474)Lightroom clearly represents a break from the past. And this appears to be intentional on the part of Lightroom designers. Lightroom is not intended to be a file/folder browser. (Note: I do not know any Lightroom designers, and have never spoken to one, and I have read very little of their writings or interviews)
There are many things you can do as soon as you stop thinking in terms of folders as an organizing tool. I can find all my church photos with a single click of the mouse, without knowing what folders they are in, even if they are in 75 different folders. And if I want to limit the search to only churches in Pennsylvania, that's very simple in Lightroom as well, a few mouse clicks. And I almost never want to see my photos from a calendar month, my mind doesn't think that way, but if I did, its a few mouse clicks in Lightroom. Works for me, works for many. How would you find all of your church photos?
Why is there a folder panel in LR? In my opinion, it's not there to help you organize your photos, nor, in my opinion, is it there to help you find your photos. It is there so that when you need to move your photos to somewhere else, you can do it in the Folder Panel. And that's the only purpose of the Folder Panel, in my opinion.
No software does everything for everyone. Lightroom represents trade-offs. Some things are simple to do in LR, other things are difficult or impossible to do in LR. I have said this in other places, so I repeat it here ... if you absolutely are unwilling to give up your old ways of doing things (in this case, your folder based organization), then you will be frustrated with Lightroom. And it sounds like you are frustrated with Lightroom. And you're not alone.
My recommendation to everyone is that if you want to use Lightroom to its full potential, you need to stop thinking in terms of folders, and begin using Lightroom tools, like keywords, metadata and collection. Many people don't like to hear that, or don't believe me.
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10. Re: Sort folders by date
Pete Marshall Jan 13, 2010 7:42 AM (in response to jt77474)File browsers such as Bridge are by far the best way of browsing files and folders as defined by an OS. If you are happy with that then I suggest using Bridge, rather than Lightroom. However for those of us who would rather use a database for large amounts of images, the fact that the database also shows the files location in the operating systems folder structure is just an addition and in reality irrelevant to the functioning of Lightroom. Personally I can do without it and never even look at the folders as I can find images far quicker using LR's hundred and one ways of locating, structuring and labelling the way I want them, rather than the way either Microsoft or Apple have designed for me.
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11. Re: Sort folders by date
jt77474 Jan 13, 2010 7:51 AM (in response to Pete Marshall)It's quite a leap of faith, isn't it? I don't see how a sort option would hurt, but I now understand much better the designers' intentions.
Picasa is no longer any good for me since I bought a nice Dell 3008wfp which has a wide gamut, and picasa has neglected to bother with profiles. Which disgusts me.
But I really dislike how slow lightroom is to load the full screen image. I have a super fast core i7 64 bit system with bags of ram, but still lightroom needs a noticeable fraction of a second to load a full screen image at 2560 x 1600. Picasa has a lag for 'refining', but it's shorter. The best viewer, fastpictureviewer, has no lag at all.
Lightroom's is considerable. It upsets me that the program doesn't 'look ahead' and load the next few images in the viewing order into memory. That strikes me as basic common sense: task manager shows it's hardly taxing my system, so why can't it take the active approach and use some cpu cycles to process the next image before I get to it? I can't stand the lack of responsiveness in lightroom. But I like the way it's color managed!
I wonder if there's a way to get lightroom to 'look ahead'? I have plenty memory and cpu, if only it would choose to use it, instead of waiting for me to advance to the next image and then making me wait while it says 'rendering preview'....Very disappointing
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12. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Jan 13, 2010 8:42 AM (in response to jt77474)There are options that allow you to store full size previews of your photo, so no rendering needs to take place, just locating the previews in the database, which should be pretty fast. There are options that allow you to specify the length of time that full size previews are stored, so you don't have to constantly recreate the previews, if you so desire. http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Lightroom/2.0/WS47E8B7F6-16B7-40db-9B3E-2B7D45DCD418.html
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13. Re: Sort folders by date
jt77474 Jan 14, 2010 3:08 AM (in response to dj_paige)Does this mean lightroom is shipped with inherently slow image rendering defaults? Seems strange, can't think what it's like on a system slower than mine.
I wish they could license or steal the technique used by fastpictureviewer, it really is fast! I'd say fpv is a much easier way to trawl through your memory card of recent shots to weed out keepers and non keepers, much easier than importing, keywording etc. But I can see it's good to change filenames on import.
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14. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Jan 14, 2010 5:09 AM (in response to jt77474)Does this mean lightroom is shipped with inherently slow image rendering defaults?
Wow, are you going to phrase everything about Lightroom in the most unflattering way? A few posts ago, you were killing Lightroom for not giving you a feature you want so you can have the flexibility you want; now Lightroom gives you the option to do things the way you want, so you can choose to do it the way that fits your needs, and you're still not happy.
I wish they could license or steal the technique used by fastpictureviewer, it really is fast! I'd say fpv is a much easier way to trawl through your memory card of recent shots to weed out keepers and non keepers, much easier than importing, keywording etc. But I can see it's good to change filenames on import.
You don't have to import if you don't want a photo, you can simply choose to not import it from the memory card. LR gives you the ability to see your images on the memory card and only import the ones you want. Of course, you don't have to keyword the non-keepers either.
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15. Re: Sort folders by date
dunx Sep 12, 2010 1:30 PM (in response to dj_paige)Whether Lightroom wants to use folders or not, they still exist in the underlying operating system as the location of the actual images. So the folders still exist, and are pretty important if you want to do OS type stuff with your photos. E.g. backing them up to optical media.
Not that you need sorting by textual month to do that, but it is nice to be able to move photos around in folders via Lightroom (to keep the database up to date) and organising by month would be easier if the folders could be sorted. I'd even be happy to be able to drag and drop to reorder the folders...
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16. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Sep 12, 2010 2:03 PM (in response to dunx)Whether Lightroom wants to use folders or not, they still exist in the underlying operating system as the location of the actual images. So the folders still exist, and are pretty important if you want to do OS type stuff with your photos. E.g. backing them up to optical media.
Nothing in Lightroom prohibits you from backing up to optical media
but it is nice to be able to move photos around in folders via Lightroom...
which of course Lightroom lets you do
... and organising by month would be easier if the folders could be sorted.
The filter bar lets you do this without you having to do anything to your folders. It's automatic, you don't have to turn it on. (Assuming your photos have dates associated with them)
I'd even be happy to be able to drag and drop to reorder the folders..
Suggestion: think less about folders, and more about using Lightroom tools. All the things organizing you want (and a whole lot more) are pretty easy if you just stop trying to do them with folders.
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17. Re: Sort folders by date
clvrmnky Sep 12, 2010 6:00 PM (in response to jt77474)jt77474 wrote:
But I don't see why that should mean penalising those of us who still value the role of folders. It doesn't explain why the ability to sort should be intentionally crippled. It seems such a basic requirement that bizarrely is missing.
You are not being penalized. Adding functionality to essentially mimic a file explorer is not in anyone's best interest in a DAM application. If you really depend on the ability to slice across your data based on folder names and folder dates and image dates (remember, the capture dates of the images within a folder do not have to actually be related in any manner) then you will have to spend a lot of time organizing your folders and images just-so. This is out of the purview of Lightroom.
My advice is to spend a day looking at how to use metadata, collections and other DAM tools within Lightroom if you are going to use it. The functionality you want is only a few gestures away from being done. You could have done it while reading this reply!
Otherwise you could pretty much get what you want from a file explorer app and Adobe Camera Raw.
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18. Re: Sort folders by date
c.frans w Sep 13, 2010 2:27 AM (in response to jt77474)When I do my import I use in the right hand panel under Destination ,Organize by Date, Date format 2010/2010-01/2010-01-01 .
I don't use additional words in folder names. I think there are LR users doing this the same way. Then I do all the keywording and (smart) collection use.
To have direct access to a year month or day is easy for me. I search by keyword then. I also think the collections list can become very long to scroll through and you have to remember the name you gave it. I also have scanned all my 35mm film negatives , they are under a year structure 1975/1975-A\001.jpg,and i have years from 2001 (my first digital camera) where I have both 2001/2001-01/2001-01-01 and 2001-A. Filmnegatives have also their year as a keyword.
That's my way of organizing my catalogue with 39000 pictures. (Still have a lot of keywording to do before I can really use collections).
What I mean to say, that nobody prohibits you to use the folder structure you like. As long as Lightroom knows where your pictures are, and you are moving them inside Lightroom.
Have a nice day!
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19. Re: Sort folders by date
dj_paige Sep 13, 2010 5:21 AM (in response to c.frans w)Creating a keyword for year (or year-month) is unnecessary. The filter bar will allow you to find all photos taken in a certain year, or a certain year-month combination, or multiple years, or multiple year-month combinations.
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20. Re: Sort folders by date
Dorin Nicolaescu-Musteață Sep 13, 2010 6:04 AM (in response to dj_paige)But that doesn't sort the folders in a chronological order.
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21. Re: Sort folders by date
c.frans w Sep 13, 2010 6:21 AM (in response to dj_paige)I was talking about my scanned 35mm negatives. They have eventually the scan date in the metadata but not the year I've made them. I know I can change that under Edit capture date /time but I didnot do that (yet). I have scanned all my negatives from 1970- 2004 and they are in my catalogue too. A huge amount of work
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22. Re: Sort folders by date
c.frans w Sep 13, 2010 6:27 AM (in response to Dorin Nicolaescu-Musteață)So what is not chronological about 1970 till 2010 , a folder a year ?
PS Sorry Dorin I see now you've answered djpaige
Message was edited by: c.frans w
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23. Re: Sort folders by date
Dorin Nicolaescu-Musteață Sep 13, 2010 6:28 AM (in response to c.frans w)Sorry, I misread the comments.
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24. Re: Sort folders by date
dunx Sep 13, 2010 7:38 AM (in response to dj_paige)Suggestion: think less about folders, and more about using Lightroom tools. All the things organizing you want (and a whole lot more) are pretty easy if you just stop trying to do them with folders.
Sure - I am fine with using the Lightroom tools, but I don't need to throw out the OS baby with the bathwater. I can use both. All I am saying is that it would be nice if Lightroom could sort folders by month name. Enough people contribute to this thread to express the same thought. Lightroom still imports image files into folders. So why not ask for more functionality where you do find yourself interacting with the filesystem via lightroom?
I don't think anyone here was saying that all other development on Lightroom should stop until this is sorted. Just that it would be nice.
And that you can abstract away folders, but they are still the native storage medium for Lightroom, and thus you can't escape them for everything, including backing up your precious images in the most tried and trusted ways.
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25. Re: Sort folders by date
bcw99 Feb 4, 2012 11:34 AM (in response to jt77474)I have had a look at LR4 and there still seems to be no option for ordering folders by newest first.
I've read this thread and am struck by a certain arrogance by Adobe. Basically, they don't like the idea of us organising files by folder but want us, their paymasters, to use LR catalogs and so on. This is like a couple of years ago when Microsoft decided we shouldn't use folders either. Instead, the actual location of files was to become irrelevant. This failed miserably and they have pretty much given up on that now. But Adobe or the LR development team seem intent on forcing us to use catalogs. This is like many media apps where music for example is stored in playlists defined by genre, artist etc, regardless of the actual file location. This stinks as not all files come preconfigured with this info and manually adding it is a no-no.. I put files in a folder for a reason and expect to find them there. I am not happy faffing around ensuring my music files have been tagged by genre, artist, blah blah. Nor am I happy being forced to use LR catalogs. Everything else about LR is fine. Someone suggested using Bridge instead if we don't like LR catalogs. Great PR that is! As dunx says, if won't be any trouble to do what every other raw tool does (picassa, bibble, etc etc)and let us simply use folders.
Adobe developers don't seem to realise we all have different workflows and their way isn't neccessarily the best for all of us. In my case, I go out shooting and come back with some shots in one location, some in another, some of one subject some of another. As I import them, I put them into appropiately named folders so my OS can be used to organise them, not just LR. In the case of naming folders with the date, that is just cack-handed.
It's like another thread discussing adding layers to LR. There seems a resistance that borders on the religous to avoid layers in LR. Yet Bibble/Aftershot manages it. Pity there are other factors in that program that deters me from switching.
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26. Re: Sort folders by date
PLowe Nov 15, 2013 8:42 PM (in response to jt77474)But in my list of folders on the left panel, they're sorted by name, and I get figure out how to sort that list of folders so the newest ones are at the top. Like it is in picasa basically.
How do I perform this elementary sorting operation?
I've been struggling with this, too, but I think I found a very workable solution.
Under the Catalog Menu (left side of screen with the triangle), select "All Photographs."
Next, go to the View Menu and make sure "Show Filter Bar" is checked.
Under the Date Tab, you'll see a total of all your photos and the year(s) in which they were shot with a triangle next to the year.
Click that down arrow and all your photos will be grouped by month showing a total of the photos taken in a given month.
This will clearly work best if you've imported all your photos into a single Catalog.
It's not exactly what either of us are looking for, but this is a perfectly acceptable workaround for me.
As far as naming each file with a descriptive name, I've shot more than 10,000 photos since the first of the year. Giving each one of them a descriptive name is not a workable solution for me. I organize all my photos in folders by location and date. Now, being able to see all the photos for a given month will allow me to refine selection sets by rating the photos I want to keep and adjusting them accordingly.
Again, it's not a perfect solution given my workflow, but is certainly better than trying to navigate through thousands of pics via folder tabs on the left side of the UI.
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27. Re: Sort folders by date
areohbee Nov 15, 2013 10:28 PM (in response to PLowe)Perhaps AnySource would help:
http://www.johnrellis.com/lightroom/anysource.htm
PS - the author John Ellis may be willing to tweak if not quite there for ya yet.




