9 Replies Latest reply on Mar 14, 2010 11:02 AM by the_wine_snob

    fade out fade in - finesse

    Level 4

      Hi

       

      I've noticed that sometimes , using CS3, I do a fade out and fade in ( not from effects but done manually with keyframes) ..sometimes I see some pixelation during the transition...sometimes I don't see as much of that...but I sorta want it to be extremely smooth and with no pixelation...like you don't see ANY blotchy areas ...know what I mean??

       

      I sometimes think this might be due to having nothing in background if the fade is using still images (eg layered psd text with titles  with still images ) and sometimes it happens with video ....

       

      This is not a big issue with me at the moment but at some point re: raising the bar on quality it might be... and I'm just wondering if there is a sort of trick or tips or something regarding making transitions so smooth you don't see anything like splotchy or pixel-y stuff during the transistion...

       

      I'm thinking that if there are 2 clips butted together and you do a transition maybe it's smoother if you have black video or something "behind" it ??? something for it to fade from and to --- in between ---those frames in the tweening process ---like "behind" ( lower level of video ? ) the transition.

       

      Don't know how to explain, but if I was using gels on an animation I would maybe have some "background" instead of "nothing" during my transition...

       

      Is that what's happening programatically with CS3?

       

      Rod

        • 1. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
          shooternz Level 6

          Your understanding of transitions needs a little working on.

           

          This all used to be more obvious and clearer in NLEs when it took two layers of Video (physically) overlapped to create a transition.  Modern LEs use single layer transitions  to "automate" this ..and in doing so..hide the actual process.

           

          Bill Hunt has frequently posted the fundamental diagram of the Overlap and how handles fit into the process.

           

          You need to study that in depth..then you need to think about exactly what is happening at an image level.

           

          Regarding Dissolves /fades :

           

          A full density (100%) image fades to a no density (0%) image over the duration of your transition (ie a fade out)

           

          (NO density is transparent film like cellophane)

           

          Inversely  : A no density image fades up to a 100% image density  over the duration of your transition (ie a fade in)

           

          If the two are overlapped (handles) they are allowing 0-100% transparency progressively over duration of time.

           

          Same principle applies even when you are manualy creating OPACITY

           

          BTW - do not get caught out by the weird way OPACITY works in PPRO.  It automatically creates a keyframe as soon as you adjust it.  This can create unknown and unwanted KFs.

          • 2. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
            Level 4

            Ok...thanks shooternz...

             

            Here's what I'm thinking now...

             

            My situation is: I have a still image on video 1 layer...text from psd layered (transparent background so all I have is text layer) on video 2...the text is right on top of still image on video 1...and I also have another still image on layer 1 butted up against the first still image...they dont overlap.

             

            I fade in still image on video 1, then fade in text on layer 2, then fade out text on layer 2, then fade out image on layer 1...and the pixelation is happening ( sometimes, not always ...and it varies as to obviousness of it I think depending on the time it takes to do the fade )...on the still image.

             

            Sooo, what I'm thinking is maybe if I put the still on layer 2 and the text on layer 3..and black video on layer 1 ( under the still image ) then maybe whatever's going on mathematically re: fade and pixel resolution from one image to other (since there's nothing under layer 1 maybe the image fade gets confused and doesn't know what it's fading to or from ????...and you see the blotchy stuff ???) ....is a matter of the programming ( math ...all of a sudden there's no reference to an underlayer to "go to" ?)...

             

            I don't know, will do a test...put black video on 1, image on 2 and text on 3 and then do just the image on 1, text on 2, and see if there's a difference.

             

            know what I mean?

             

            Thanks for what you said, I think I "kinda" know what's up with what you mean about overlap and handles , but that's not my situation in this case...although it is definitely related.  Interesting situation..

             

            Have you sometimes got pixelation or blotchy sorta areas in transitions for fades on text and video on layers? Or is it just me ?

             

            Rod

            • 3. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
              shooternz Level 6

              Post a screen shot of the timeline if you can. That would help us understand how you have set it up.

              • 4. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                Level 4

                Shooternz,

                Thanks much for helping and I will have to get back to this later on. I

                deleted everything with that safari project (except some source assets I can

                use again later...and the folders and so on for workflow later ). I'm

                supposed to get new video source files next week from captured tape and

                start the project over - and I can upload screenshot then...

                Deleted all the project and scratch disk stuff ...

                 

                Thanks again and will revisit later.

                 

                Rod

                • 5. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                  I'm thinking that if there are 2 clips butted together and you do a transition maybe it's smoother if you have black video or something "behind" it ??? something for it to fade from and to --- in between ---those frames in the tweening process ---like "behind" ( lower level of video ? ) the transition.

                   

                  Provided that the Opacity of the combined Clips is 100%, you do not need anything for the other to "fade into."

                   

                  Maybe you are setting your Opacity (assume that this is how you are doing the fade), in a non-equal, non-linear fashion, so that you are not getting a sum of 100% for the two, at certain points. You cannot exceed 100%, but if your "ramps" do not match up perfectly, you can certainly go under 100%.

                   

                  For Cross-Dissolves between two adjacent Clips (still, or video), I use the Cross-Dissolve Transition and then alter it, as I need for Duration. I usually Keyframe Opacity, on over-laying Clips, where there IS a still, or motion Asset below that. Titles and PiP are two such cases.

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  • 6. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                    Level 4

                    Hi,

                     

                    Thanks Bill...everyone...I don't have anything on timeline now...but used psd to draw rough diagram of what it is...

                     

                    still on bottom, title on top, using opacity to fade in/ out..

                     

                    Between the stills I sometimes get varying degrees of blotchy areas like pixelation..  weird...

                     

                    Seems to depend on the image a little and maybe how fast the fade is...I'm not sure..

                     

                    I'm just trying to get it real smooth if possible....so you don't see that blotchiness...but I wont be starting a new project till after tue or so as I'm gonna install ram and hd monday and get source video material sometime after that...

                     

                    transition sample.jpg

                    Rod

                    • 7. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                      Rod,

                       

                      So long as your Opacity Fade-out ramp matches your Opacity Fade-in ramp, things should be smooth.

                       

                      Does the application of the Transition>Cross-Dissolve yield better results? The Ramps will match with it, and you can adjust the Duration of that Transition, as is required.

                       

                      Good luck,

                       

                      Hunt

                      • 8. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                        Level 4

                        I kinda want the still to fade in first, then the title, then the title

                        fades out, then the still fades out...in actual fact, I have 2 titles per

                        still in the last project (that might change)..but it was as follows..

                         

                        still fade in

                        title fade in , title fade out

                        title fade in , title fade out

                        still fade out

                        next still fade in

                         

                        since its the still doing the weird stuff, I'll try using the effect cross

                        dissolve and check if that is better...good idea...apply the cross just

                        between the stills...

                         

                        Thanks...will try !  Wont try till I get new video stuff....probably next

                        week.

                         

                        Rod

                        • 9. Re: fade out fade in - finesse
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          The application of the Cross-Dissolve to the stills (Video Track 1) will get you what you want. Then, you can animate your titles, as you require.

                           

                          Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

                           

                          Hunt