9 Replies Latest reply on Apr 18, 2010 7:28 AM by the_wine_snob

    Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps

    KPO Studios Level 1

      Sorry if this has been addressed before but I couldn't find the answer.

       

      I'm using a Sony HDR-FX1000 camera with an external compact flash card recording device (Sony also) and I have selected 1080i 24p in the camera to shoot in.  When I pull in the .m2t files from my compact flash card into my Adobe Premier Elements 3.0 the file data shows that the frame rate is 29.97 fps.

       

      Why does Premier Elements 3.0 show 29.97fps when I selected 24p in the video camera?

       

      What should 24p spec look like in Premier Elements? Like 24.0fps?

        • 1. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          Welcome to the forum.

           

          Unfortunately, 24p is not directly supported. Some have had luck by rewriting Presets in later versions of PrE, but I've not heard of any of these for PrE 3.

           

          There are several recent threads here on 24p Presets, and IIRC, some have links to custom Presets, but I think that most were done for PrE 7 & 8.

           

          There has been speculation that PrE 9 will likely fully support it, but none of us "users" know for sure - just guesses.

           

          Good luck,

           

          Hunt

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
            KPO Studios Level 1

            Interesting, so even if I move up to PrPRO I'll still have an issue with editing in 24p?

             

            How does PrE change the captured video data frame rate from 24fps to 29.97fps?

             

            Am I correct in that selecting 1080i 24p in my camera should produce a 24.0fps frame rate?  If so, is it possible that other video editing programs (say like Final Cut) can work with 24 fps files?

             

            I'm still interested in getting my PrE to use 24fps and if I need to upgrade I will. Although, my recorded video data from a given shoot is being processes by another editor that uses Final Cut.

             

            Thank you for the help

            KPO

            • 3. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
              the_wine_snob Level 9
              Interesting, so even if I move up to PrPRO I'll still have an issue with editing in 24p?

               

              No. PrPro offers what is termed a Desktop Preset, which allows the user to adjust nearly every parameter in the Project/Sequence, to match the footage. PrE has a limited set of Presets, for the most popular attributes only, and there is not yet a Desktop Preset with adjustable attributes.

               

              This ARTICLE might be of use. Jim Simon and Dan Isaacs discuss Film Look, of which 24p is often part.

               

              Good luck,

               

              Hunt

              • 4. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                KPO Studios Level 1

                Wow that article was over the top for me, but thanx.

                 

                I think you addressed my issue though, I need to move up to PrPRO to get all the functionality. I now understand why PrE would not support my 24p files, that's why it's 1/6 the cost of PrPRO.

                 

                Thanx, KPO

                • 5. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                  the_wine_snob Level 9
                  I now understand why PrE would not support my 24p files, that's why it's 1/6 the cost of PrPRO.

                   

                  You are correct. Too many PrE users never take that price difference into account and complain that PrPro offers feature X, so PrE should too. Obviously, many features make their way between the two programs, but all cannot. Some things to consider is that PrE got AVCHD and VOB Import support, before PrPro did. Maybe in the future, 24p will make its way to PrE, and that would be great, especially if Adobe could add the customizable Desktop (never liked that name, but it's been around for a long time - "Custom" would be better IMHO) Preset.

                   

                  Many users, who moved from PrE to PrPro complain that Encore, the DVD/BD authoring program included, does not do the semi-automatic Menu creation and navigation creation, like the less-expensive program. They miss that simple solution. However, many PrE users bemoan that they can't do some of the custom navigation possible in Encore.

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  1 person found this helpful
                  • 6. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                    KPO Studios Level 1

                    I see this forum is going to be a great source of info for me as I move forward.

                     

                    You said, "Some things to consider is that PrE got AVCHD and VOB Import support,  before PrPro did."  Does this mean that the current version of PrPRO does not support AVCHD or were you refering to older versions? I'm considering purchasing PrPRO but I defently want it to support AVCHD. My next camera purchase will be a AVCHD format.

                     

                    ALso, what does VOB stand for?

                     

                    Thanx, KPO.

                    • 7. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                      Well, CS5 will have a native AVCHD Preset (and probably one with DD 5.1 SS ?), and CS4 allows one to match the Desktop up to the footage.

                       

                      For smooth editing of AVCHD, you will want a very fast Quad-core, or higher-end i7 CPU. Having multiple physical HDD's will be a big benefit too. Just some things to consider with AVCHD.

                       

                      VOB = Video Object, which is the building block of a DVD-Video. This ARTICLE will give you some background on them. PrE has had the direct Import of 100% DVD-compliant VOB's for several versions, while PrPro just added that in CS4.2. Before that, the only course of action was ripping, or otherwise extracting the contained MPEG-2 AV file.

                       

                      Hope that helps,

                       

                      Hunt

                      • 8. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                        KPO Studios Level 1

                        Also sounds like I would need a 64bit OS to run the CS5 version. I'm still running Windows XP (32bit) and have been gun shy of Vista and/or Windows 7. What I have is finally working once I figure out what it can and can not do.

                         

                        I was just on The Digital Video Info Network forum for my camera HDR-FX1000 and discovered that it always records HDV on tape at 60i, which I'm guessing is 29.97fps. The reason I ask this here is they also said to full edit in 24p/30p I need to set up the editing program (PrE) to work with progressive scanned video data.

                         

                        I went back to my PrE 3.0 and noticed there are some setting options in the begining for HDV. As you may know there are selections for:

                         

                        - HDV 1080i 30 (Sony 60i)

                        - HDV 1080i 25 (Sony 50i)

                        - HDV 720i 30

                         

                        Now I tried to experiment with shooting short clips on my camera set at default (progressive options not selected), then at 24p and at 30p, all at 1080i also.

                         

                        I set my PrE 3.0 to the first option above but the captured video data still shows a frame rate of 29.97fps as i did the 24p setting but you already addressed that issue.

                         

                        Is the frame rate suposed to change when I select the options above because in the discriptions in the window for each setting above they display a 29.97fps except the 1080i 25 (Sony 50i).

                         

                        Ooops, I think I just answered my own question. I just noticed that there are no progressive symbols in the settings above. Is that my issue?

                        • 9. Re: Import issues with frame rates for HDV, 24p -vs- 29.97fps
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          You have found the problem yourself - the i vs the p.

                           

                          As for CS5 being 64-bit, that is correct. With the Master Collection, or the Production Premium suites, there will be 32-bit versions of PrPro, PS and AE included, but they are designed for Win7-32, so do not know how well, or how poorly, they would run under XP.

                           

                          As with many, I will be building a new workstation w/ Win7-64 to accommodate PrPro CS5 and even upgrading my beloved Quadro FX4500 to take advantage of the Mercury Playback Engine (MPE).

                           

                          Good luck,

                           

                          Hunt