10 Replies Latest reply on May 9, 2010 11:49 AM by the_wine_snob

    Splicing Source Clips

    ShotInLight

      Hopefully the answer isn't obvious, as I failed at finding it via forum search and multiple bing/google attempts.

       

      I am a Premiere Pro novice, but working on changing that.

       

      My camcorder records AVCHD clips at roughly 2GB (11 minutes) each.

       

      I recently recorded a series of readings at my son's school (about 17 in all).  Some of the children were nigh inaudible, so I'm trying to use Premiere Pro CS5 to up the gain on the sections that need it.  I actually think I have that part figured out.

       

      The recording was about 22 minutes, spanning 2 MTS files.  I can load them as individual clips and create subclips from the clip panel for tweaking the gain as needed (I'm doing two clips per child, one for performance and one for applause, since the latter is plenty loud enough).

       

      The annoyance I have is that the clip panel resets the time indicator to 0 when I switch to the second clip, and I'm using the sequence/program-monitor panels to navigate the full 22 minute duration (the waveform makes it easy to see applause and jump around), but am unable to make a subclip from my in/out markers in the Program Monitor

       

      Is there a preferred method for joining two (or more) clips in sequence into one clip, so I can work on the full duration as a whole?

       

      I'm currently watching Encoder do an export of the concatenated sequence, but I shudder to think that for every 11 minutes of recording, I need to spend an hour encoding an export simply so I can concatenate clips.

       

      Thanks.

        • 1. Re: Splicing Source Clips
          dradeke Adobe Employee

          I'd have to double check on our detailed AVCHD support, but many file based formats will do the same thing due to the formatting of the media on the camera.

           

          We resolve this issue many times by browsing through the Media Browser panel instead of importing directly into the project.  Have you viewed and loaded the clips via the Media Browser?

           

          Dennis

          • 2. Re: Splicing Source Clips
            the_wine_snob Level 9

            I might be missing exactly what you wish to do, but if I am correct, I think that you will be better served attenuating the Audio with either Keyframes, or with the Audio Mixer (basically adding Keyframes, but Track Keyframes vs Clip Keyframes).

             

            Let's say that you have your two Clips on the Timeline and wish to alter the Audio of one up, and the other one down, with Clip Keyframes, Select one Clip, say the recitation Clip, and open Effects Control Panel. This will reveal the fixed Effects for that Clip, including Volume (for Clips with Audio). Then you can add Keyframes to control the Volume over the Duration of that Clip. These will appear in the mini-Timeline in that Panel, and also, depending on the Keyframe display of the Track, there too. You can attenuate the Volume up/down, as is required, placing Keyframes along that mini-Timeline. You will have great control, and can "ramp" the Volume adjustments for smooth changes in the Volume.

             

            The second method is to use the Audio Mixer to automate those same changes in the Volume. The big differences will be that these Keyframes are attached to the Track, and NOT to the Clip. If you later alter the Clip(s), the changes will stay exactly where you placed them on the Track, regardless of what Clip now appears on that Track. This is best done AFTER all Video editing is done, for obvious reasons. Also, this process, while wonderfully powerful, is a bit more involved, and one should read up on Audio Mixer, and understand exactly how to apply changes, and also exactly what those changes are, and how they are applied.

             

            For a beginning user, I would choose the manual Clip Keyframes method, as one is working with the Clip, and not the Track, and the visual representation is right in front of you. Reading on Keyframing Effects would still be highly recommended.

             

            Here is an example of Audio Keyframes in the PrPro 2.0 Effects Control Panel. CS5 will be similar, but there will likely be some differences:

            Audio_Keyrames_01.jpg

             

            Hope that this helps. Now, if I missed your intent, or your need, just ignore me.

             

            Hunt

            1 person found this helpful
            • 3. Re: Splicing Source Clips
              ShotInLight Level 1

              Dennis,

               

              I'm not clear what loading via the Media Browser will accomplish that loading via the File|Import menu does not.  I just fired up a new project and used the Media Browser to load my two source clips (the ones I'd prefer to have concatenated into one clip).  It seemed to just achieve the same loading results as loading the clips into the Project panel.

               

              Selecting both clips and trying a context menu did not reveal a new option of merging clips.  Only "Import" and "Open in Source Monitor".  Bridge didn't seem to work any better (and Bridge doesn't seem to work with Win7 Libraries all that well, either).

               

              What am I missing?

              • 4. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                ShotInLight Level 1

                Hunt,

                 

                I'll give what you suggested a closer read and try it out, though you did miss the mark on my question.

                 

                I ended up using Clip | Audio Gain to tweak up the gain on the inaudible children, though that did also tweak up the background noise.  It isn't as finely detailed as your suggestion and did yield some sloppy jumps in noise levels between clips, but was sufficient for my purposes (building a DVD for a teacher who was absent that day).  Still, I'll look into Keyframes as a more professional method (baby steps -- this is my second effort in Premiere, my first being a simple import/export from AVCHD to MP4 for posting a movie of a talent show).

                 

                After my export of the concatenated clip completed, I discovered the H.264 Blu-ray resulted in splitting out the video and audio portions.  Not what I'd wanted.  So I just dealt with created subclips from the source monitor (and having one child span clips).  I really do hope there's a way to work with multiple clips as if they were one -- creating subclips from the Sequence would do the trick, with the subclip accommodating having multiple source clip segments.  But that doesn't seem to exist.

                 

                Thanks for the advice, nonetheless.

                • 5. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                  Yes, ALL Audio signal will be affected with the Gain setting. This ARTICLE will give you some general tips, that might help. I have to admit that most of it is based on Adobe Audition, and I have no idea how close Soundbooth (if you have it) will come.

                   

                  Now, my normal workflow is to do the Video editing, and then address my Audio. With your situation, I break from that. I would Import and place the Clip on the Timeline, Rt-click on the Clip and choose Edit in Audition. There, I would do all of my initial Audio work, such as Amplitude and also noise reduction. From there, I do a Save. What this does is first Renders the Audio as a PCM/WAV, which will be used to Replace the source Clip's Audio in the Timeline. Note: you have NOT altered the muxed Audio stream of your original source footage one bit - only the instance of the file on the Timeline. This new, adjusted PCM/WAV will also appear in the Project Panel.

                   

                  As this is for the entire file, when I later edit that Clip, I do not have to further address the Audio, as I have made my corrections already. If I do the Video editing first, then I am dealing with Trimmed instances of the "master Clip," and there will likely be many more Edit in Audition sessions.

                   

                  If I also have a soundtrack, then I go to my normal workflow - that is the last thing that I will do, so that I am scoring the final edit.

                   

                  Hope that helps, and good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  1 person found this helpful
                  • 6. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                    the_wine_snob Level 9
                    After my export of the concatenated clip completed, I discovered the H.264 Blu-ray resulted in splitting out the video and audio portions.  Not what I'd wanted

                     

                    I am addressing this separately.

                     

                    I am a bit confused here, as both DVD and Blu-ray have been mentioned. Are you doing an SD DVD-Video, or a Blu-ray disc (BD)?

                     

                    Are you Exporting and then Importing into Encore for the authoring phase?

                     

                    If one is doing a BD Project and outputting a BD (disc), then Adobe Dynamic Link between PrPro and Encore should work fine.

                     

                    The production of elemental/elementary streams, i.e. one Audio-only and one Video-only files for Import into Encore is not necessarily a bad thing, especially if one is muxing MPEG Audio into one file. Still, if you are getting separate streams, it is likely that you have setup the Export for the Audio and for the Video, but NOT set the Multiplexing correctly. It has its own tab, which will usually appear to the right of the Video and Audio tabs.

                     

                    Hope that this helps,

                     

                    Hunt

                    • 7. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                      ShotInLight Level 1

                      The final target will be DVD.

                       

                      I was exporting to Blu-ray in an attempt to lose as little fidelity as possible during my concatenation operation.

                       

                      All I wanted to do was take two source clips (saved as separate MTS files by the camcorder) and join them as one clip.  It struck me as a reasonable first step, though apparently not.

                       

                      The goal of the blu-ray export was to then load in the exported file as my source clip and do my edits there.  But with the output being split, it didn't work out like I planned.

                       

                      In the face of this, I went back to editing across the two source clips.  Less ideal, but not horribly so.  Because I was using Clip | Audio Gain to normalize the output from the muttering children, I needed to be able to create subclips.  I suspect your suggested use of Keyframes on the timeline would obviate that need and solve all my problems.  That's for my next project though.

                       

                      I'm now up to struggling with Encore.

                      • 8. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                        For Encore, there is a great forum, HERE. You will see some of the same "players," but there are some others there too.

                         

                        BTW - Encore is a great authoring tool, IMHO. With a bit of a background, you will come to love it.

                         

                        Good luck,

                         

                        Hunt

                        • 9. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                          ShotInLight Level 1

                          Thanks for the link to the encore forum.  I'll be wading through that eventually, and doubtless posting beginner questions when I run out of self-help resources.

                           

                          I've started using the Audio Effects of Effect Control to modify the levels on the timeline.  Vastly superior to what I did with the other video I was working on, and also eliminates any need to concatenate source clips.

                           

                          Seems your original response didn't miss the mark after all.

                           

                          Thanks again.

                          • 10. Re: Splicing Source Clips
                            the_wine_snob Level 9

                            When you are ready to tackle Encore, I strongly recommend one book, Jeff Bellune's A Focal Easy Guide to Adobe EncoreDVD 2.0, Focal Press. Though for an earlier version of Encore, 100% of that book still applies. Newer versions have added features, like BD authoring and a strengthened Adobe Dynamic Link, but to learn Encore, there is no better resource - you just need to add beyond that book for the "new stuff," but that is not hard. The Help files are good, and the forum is excellent.

                             

                            Good luck,

                             

                            Hunt