16 Replies Latest reply on May 28, 2010 1:41 PM by Hudechrome-sd9sPI

    Process Menu in Camera Calibration

    Hudechrome-sd9sPI Level 2

      This seems to be some sort of updating for ACR, but I would like to know more of what it is for. If I run a file already run in CS3, set it current, then reopen later in CS3 what are the changes going to do?

       

      Thanks

       

      Lawrence

        • 1. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
          Jeff Schewe Level 5

          If you are referring to the Process Version dropdown in the Camera Calibration pane, tat controls the actually demosiacing, sharpening, noise reduction a and a few other "tweaks". In order to allow users of previous versions of Camer Raw to keep the older renderings, they split the process version into Process 2003 which is basically version 5.6 and earlier and Process 2010 (Current) which has the new demosiacing and noise reduction capabilities...

           

          You will generally want to use Process 2010 if you want the most recent rendering controls. If you have an image you want to maintain the rendering on, keep the Process 2003 version. By default, Camera Raw 6.x will keep Process 2003 for any images whose settings have been "touched" (meaning other than default settings). By default, new images that have never had settings adjusted will default to the Process 2010 version.

          • 2. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
            Hudechrome-sd9sPI Level 2

            Thanks, Jeff. So if I open a .nef which has corrections applied in the earlier versions, then drop to 2010 and do nothing else, will the new tweaks take over so far as what i called for earlier, or do I have to make some extra chage to the file to now have the 2010 version?

             

            I hope I am making myself clear! (sinking in a gentle pool of wine....)

            • 3. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
              Jeff Schewe Level 5

              Yes, a file that has already had settings apply are defaulted into Process 2003. Changing to Process 2010 and hitting done changes the process settings and nothing else.

              • 4. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                Level 4

                Tangential to this felicitous thread:

                 

                ACR 5.7 seems to automatically open a file that has already had settings applied in a previous version of ACR with the new rendering (presumably the equivalent of what is called "20010" in ACR 6.x).  One can notice the changes (for the better) happening upon opening an old file.

                 

                No need and even no possibility to switch manually between versions.

                 

                In any event, a most welcome improvement in ACR 5.7.  Kudos to the team.

                 

                 

                 

                Wo Tai Lao Le

                我太老了

                • 5. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                  dorin_nicolaescu Level 5

                  ... except for one little thing.

                   

                  As Jeff mentioned in another thread, ACR 6.1 has had it's sharpening tweaked (light halo dampening, in particular). This brings a little bit of incompatibility between 5.7/6.0 PV 2010 and 6.1/LR3 final. Sharpening will have to be tweaked a bit.

                  • 6. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                    Yammer Level 4

                    The way I understood it, from a post by Eric Chan, New Demosaicing and Process 2010 are separate but connected.

                     

                    5.7 introduced the new demosaicing method, but not the new process. That is why there are no new detail controls, and no process warning. Images converted in 5.7 are sharper, containing no (hidden) base luminance noise reduction. The new demosicing method was the foundation for the new process method arriving in...

                     

                    6.0 introduced Process 2010, a new method of sharpening and noise reduction (amongst other things) with extra controls. Also, it may be possible that the new demosaicing method was necessary to facilitate the new lens correction features in 6.1.

                     

                    Please correct me if I am wrong. This is just the way I have come to understand it.

                    • 7. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                      dorin_nicolaescu Level 5

                      5.7 introduced the new demosaicing method, but not the new process. That is why there are no new detail controls, and no process warning.

                      5.7 has no UI for PV 2010, but it will interpret correctly files with PV2010 settings. This is to make the upcoming LR3 compatible with Photoshop CS4 (which cannot use ACR 6).

                       

                      6.0 introduced Process 2010, a new method of sharpening and noise reduction (amongst other things) with extra controls.

                      Yes.

                       

                      Also, it may be possible that the new demosaicing method was necessary to facilitate the new lens correction features in 6.1.

                      I don't think so. ACR had forced (no UI) lens correction for selected cameras since 5.2, I think.

                      • 8. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                        Level 4

                        dorin_nicolaescu wrote:

                         

                        ... except for one little thing.

                         

                        As Jeff mentioned in another thread, ACR 6.1 has had it's sharpening tweaked (light halo dampening, in particular). This brings a little bit of incompatibility between 5.7/6.0 PV 2010 and 6.1/LR3 final. Sharpening will have to be tweaked a bit.

                         

                        Dorin, I assume you mean "sharpening will have to be tweaked a bit" when opening in ACR 6.x a file previously processed in ACR 5.7.

                         

                        What I was envisioning in my previous post is a scenario totally devoid of any version of ACR 6.x, as CS5 does not run on my machine anyway.

                         

                         

                        Wo Tai Lao Le

                        我太老了

                        • 9. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                          dorin_nicolaescu Level 5

                          Dorin, I assume you mean "sharpening will have to be tweaked a bit" when opening in ACR 6.x a file previously processed in ACR 5.7.

                          No, I mean from 6.0/LR beta to 6.1/LR final. Sharpening has been slightly modified from 6.0 to 6.1.

                           

                          Look here for samples: http://forums.adobe.com/thread/638608

                          • 10. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                            Level 4

                            Yammer P wrote:

                             

                            The way I understood it, from a post by Eric Chan, New Demosaicing and Process 2010 are separate but connected.

                             

                            5.7 introduced the new demosaicing method, but not the new process. That is why there are no new detail controls, and no process warning. Images converted in 5.7 are sharper, containing no (hidden) base luminance noise reduction. The new demosicing method was the foundation for the new process method arriving in...

                             

                            6.0 introduced Process 2010, a new method of sharpening and noise reduction (amongst other things) with extra controls. Also, it may be possible that the new demosaicing method was necessary to facilitate the new lens correction features in 6.1.

                             

                            Aaah!  Thank you for bringing up the distinction between the new demosaicing (rendering) in ACR 5.7 and the separate "Process 2010" in ACR 6.x, Yammer P.

                             

                            As I was envisioning an ACR 5.7 environment exclusively, it is becoming clear to me that ACR 5.7 has the new demosaicing (rendering) but NOT the new "Process 2010" of  ACR 6.x.

                             

                            If I'm misconstruing anything, anybody please correct me.

                             

                             

                             

                            Wo Tai Lao Le

                            我太老了

                            • 11. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                              Level 4

                              dorin_nicolaescu wrote:

                               

                              Dorin, I assume you mean "sharpening will have to be tweaked a bit" when opening in ACR 6.x a file previously processed in ACR 5.7.

                              No, I mean from 6.0/LR beta to 6.1/LR final. Sharpening has been slightly modified from 6.0 to 6.1.

                               

                              Look here for samples: http://forums.adobe.com/thread/638608

                               

                               

                              Thank you, Dorin.  Glad I asked. 

                               

                              This doesn't concern me since I'm staying with CS4 and do not use Lightroom at all (positively hated it).

                               

                               

                              Wo Tai Lao Le

                              我太老了

                              • 12. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                                Hudechrome-sd9sPI Level 2

                                Well, now that the waters are muddied a bit, let me jump back in on a couple of points. First, I skipped to CS5 from CS3.so any previously opened files will be that vintage. If I open one in CS5 and do not change the setting from 2003 to 2010, but then continue to open in PS, vs changing nothing but the vintage state, I assume from Jeff's remarks that nothing technically will be changed in that file. But it begs the question about why do that, and why the little warning below the image?.

                                 

                                I suppose I could open a file in CS3, save it as a tiff, close that version, open in CS5, change to 2010, save as a tiff and compare.

                                 

                                Point 2:

                                 

                                "I don't think so. ACR had forced (no UI) lens correction for selected cameras since 5.2, I think."

                                 

                                Forced lens correction? Really? So what happens to files that first are treated in DXO for those parameters? Double correction behind your back? If true, is this happening in CS5? Can it be stopped? In another thread, I brought up my misgivings depending on casual corrections by the general public for this work, vs the lab controlled, multiple measurements over the entire range of zoom and magnification, using many samples, from a source like DXO. If double correction is de rigueur in CS5 with previously corrected lenses and cannot be stopped, I am royally screwed! And I'll demand my money back!

                                 

                                I can't have it. At all.

                                 

                                When first running the stitch program inCS5, a dialog screen opened up looking for corrections, finding none available, disappeared on it's own and hasn't been seen since. I don't know if an option to ignore those corrections will be an option should it show again.

                                 

                                FWIW, running Photomerge with a set of corrected images vs without does show differences, but to the eye one cannot tell which is which, unless of course, one is comparing to the original scene itself. I've done this multiple times and sometimes I preferred the corrected, sometimes the uncorrected, others it didn't matter.

                                 

                                Maybe this needs to be a separate thread, but since I am the OP, I guess I'll allow the subject!

                                • 13. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                                  Jeff Schewe Level 5

                                  Hudechrome wrote:

                                   

                                  Forced lens correction? Really? So what happens to files that first are treated in DXO for those parameters? Double correction behind your back? If true, is this happening in CS5?

                                   

                                  It's for a few point and shoot cameras such as the Canon s90 and a Panasonic and a Samsung I think...no, you can't turn it off but I suspect DxO wouldn't correct for those cameras and I suspect you wouldn't be using them, correct? So, it's a non-issue for you.

                                  • 14. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                                    Hudechrome-sd9sPI Level 2

                                    Thanks for the clarification, Jeff.

                                     

                                    Question: That search instigated with the first use of Photomerge in CS5, suppose it did find a correction entry for my camera system. (It happened so fast but it seems that it did ID the D90, can't be sure from a single shot event like that) Will the correction be auto, and can I disable it?

                                     

                                    Question: Why have I not seen it since?

                                     

                                    Curious minds want to know! (At least mine, anyway.)

                                    • 15. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                                      Jeff Schewe Level 5

                                      Hudechrome wrote:

                                       

                                      Will the correction be auto, and can I disable it?

                                       

                                      Photomerge has options for corrections for distortion and vignetting. You can turn them on or off.

                                      • 16. Re: Process Menu in Camera Calibration
                                        Hudechrome-sd9sPI Level 2

                                        Good!

                                         

                                        Then I'll be less adamant from my soapbox!