14 Replies Latest reply on May 31, 2010 9:46 PM by CupertinoFruit

    type has large invisible box around it

    MaxieJoe

      I'm using Illustrator 10 and used version 9 until very recently. Yes, I'm WAY behind the times. I'm stumped by something that's probably as clear but it's not to me. I'm using a Macintosh G4, OS 10.4.11.

       

      When I move type or an object, a box goes with it. This isn't the bounding box. I've turned that off. This is something that is not visible until I start to move it and it doesn't have the "handles" seen in bounding boxes. With objects, the box is small, touching the edges of the object. With type, it's quite large, much larger than the font on all sides. (I'm doing a poster where I'm using individual large letters.) And this box, altho not visible until I start to move something, keeps me from selecting something near it that happens to fall within that invisible (until moved) area. What I'm having to do is lock the object with the huge box surrounding it so I can select nearby objects. This is time-consuming and maddening.

       

      WHAT is this thing and how do I get rid of it?

        • 1. Re: type has large invisible box around it
          Jacob Bugge MVP & Adobe Community Professional

          Joe,

           

          Does it not coincide with the Bounding Box when you turn it on?

           

          Live Type is not just the actual letters: having the Em height, it incorporates the ascenders and descenders, as well as the distances between letters and lines (in case of more lines; as you can seewith multiple lines, changing the the leading changes the size of the box). This belongs to the Live Type whether you show or hide the Bounding Box.

           

          If you tire of that, you may use the JETSetCapHeight script made by James, here: http://www.illustrationetc.com/AI_Javascripts/TextScripts.htm

           

          or you may Type>Create Outline, but that will kill the Live Type.

          • 2. Re: type has large invisible box around it
            MaxieJoe Level 1

            I'm not sure just what you mean by "coincide" with the Bounding Box. I have Bounding Box turned off but I still see this LARGE box. I know nothing about Live Type. I'll have to read up on it. Where can I find simple info? I'm not a technical sort and need simple explanations.

             

            But this invisible box is way larger than the letter, extending top, bottom and sides WAY beyond any ascenders or descenders. It's like a letter in the center of a huge box. I've used Illustrator for years and have never seen this.

             

            I do use Create Outlines but on this project I want to keep the actual fonts until I'm sure I don't want to change them to something else.

            • 3. Re: type has large invisible box around it
              JETalmage Level 6

              Is this a Point Type object or an Area Type object?

              Does the text object have any Effects (drop shadows, etc.) applied to it?

              Select one of the text characters. Look at the Characters palette. What is its size? What is its leading (line spacing)?

              Turn on the Type>Show Hidden Characters command. Are there any invisible characters (paragraph returns, unnecessary spaces, tabs) in the text object?

               

              Turn Bounding Box dislpay back on, select the text object and post a screenshot so others can see what you're doing.

               

              JET

              • 4. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                MaxieJoe Level 1

                It's a point type. No special effects. Size of one of the fonts is 206 pts with auto leading. When I turned on Show Hidden Characters, there are a bunch of blue things that look like infinity signs. I've never used that feature before so have no idea what these are. I'm attaching a screen shot showing both the bounding box and these infinity things.

                Picture 56.png

                • 5. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                  JETalmage Level 6

                  The infinity symbol is what earlier versions of Illustrator (probably prior to the "new" text engine in, as I recall, AICS) used to denote end of text in the object. Now a hidden pillcrow appears.

                   

                  The size of your text objects is normal. To be able to 'select through' the text objects, turn on the Preference setting, Type Object Selection By Path Only.

                   

                  JET

                  • 6. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                    MaxieJoe Level 1

                    OK!!!! The 'select through' in Preferences fixed my being able to select objects/fonts that are close to each other. Thanks! So, is there no way to remove the giant box that moves with type whenever it's moved? I guess as long as I can easily select a font, I should be happy and not worry about it.

                    • 7. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                      Wade_Zimmerman Level 6

                      Command Shift B or View>Hide Bounding Box but that will hide the bounding box for all objects.

                       

                      However you can toggle with the keyboard short cut above.

                      • 8. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                        MaxieJoe Level 1

                        But what about the other "invisible" box that surrounds images and type that's not the bounding box? The bounding box is visible when you set the command to see it, but this other one is only seen when an object or font is moving. I guess it's really no biggie, but I just don't recall ever seeing it before. It's the one that was keeping me from selecting objects near it until I reset preferences: "to 'select through' the text objects, turn on the Preference setting, Type Object Selection By Path Only"

                         

                        Can I set something so I don't see that box but only see the path? What's the reason for the huge box surrounding a font? Seems unnecessary to me.

                        • 9. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                          Jacob Bugge MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                          Joe,

                           

                          What's the reason for the huge box surrounding a font? Seems unnecessary to me.

                           

                          The first post held an answer to that (the Em height/ascenders/descenders part, and the script link).

                           

                          But what about the other "invisible" box that surrounds images and type that's not the bounding box? The bounding box is visible when you set the command to see it, but this other one is only seen when an object or font is moving. I guess it's really no biggie, but I just don't recall ever seeing it before.
                          Nor do I; it is still selectable with the Bounding Box off, but the bounds should not be showing in any version, as far as I know.
                          It's the one that was keeping me from selecting objects near it until I reset preferences:
                          This belongs to the Live Type whether you show or hide the Bounding Box, as mentioned in the first post.

                           

                          Does the invisible box coincide with the Bounding Box?

                          • 10. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                            MaxieJoe Level 1

                            The "invisible" box is many times larger than the bounding box when I type just one letter. See sample here. It's far beyond the ascenders and descenders. And the other sample shows the size of the "invisible" box with several words.

                            Picture 59.png Picture 57.png

                            • 11. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                              Jacob Bugge MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                              Joe,

                               

                              What happens if you tick Reduce to Basic Appearance in the Appearance palette/panel, with the Type selected?

                              • 12. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                                MaxieJoe Level 1

                                "What happens if you tick Reduce to Basic Appearance in the Appearance palette/panel, with the Type selected?"

                                 

                                Don't see that option.

                                Picture 58.png

                                • 13. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                                  Jacob Bugge MVP & Adobe Community Professional

                                  Joe,

                                   

                                  It is the one in the middle (of the bottom), text appearing on mouseover.

                                   

                                  But it seems to be greyed out, (the whole Appearance) implying that it does have the basic appearance with nothing added that might explain the bloating of the box.

                                   

                                  Still pondering.

                                  • 14. Re: type has large invisible box around it
                                    CupertinoFruit Level 3

                                    Is it possible for you to share this file with folks here in this forum so that we can troubleshoot?