22 Replies Latest reply on Aug 8, 2007 5:28 AM by Newsgroup_User

    Seamless tiles

    meister007
      Hi, I am trying to learn how to create seamless tiles for the backgrounds of my flash sites. I can create the tiling effect but not a seamless one that looks good. I have seen many tiles on the web but I would like to have a go at making my own as I really want something very subtle. I was even thinking about using the textures in fireworks to create the tiles with. Is this possible?
      I have found many tutorials on tiling for photoshop and some really old versions of fireworks.... Does fireworks 8 have any new features that can help me with this? I would really appreciate any advise on this topic and if you can point be in the direction of some good tutorials that would be great. Thanks so much
        • 1. Re: Seamless tiles
          pixlor Level 4
          Most programmatic tile-making functions I've seen take pixels from the opposite sides and combine them. For example, they combine what's on the left with what's on the right and so on. Conceptually, the manual way to make a tile is not all that hard.

          Create a new image, with even dimensions. Start a composition, avoiding the edges (other than a background color or random noise. Quarter the image and swap the contents of the diagonal corners: upper right with lower left and upper left with lower right. (Fireworks guides and slices are great for this part.) Patch, blend, design, or whatever over the vertical and horizontal middle regions. You now have a seamless tile.

          If you think the ends of of the horizontal bisecting line needs some work. swap left and right halves and retouch. If you think the ends of the vertical bisecting line needs work, swap top and bottom halves and retouch. If both ends need work, choose either the left/right or top/bottom swap-and-retouch, then swap the quarters again and retouch.

          Um...if that doesn't make sense, I can post an awful example. :P
          • 2. Re: Seamless tiles
            Level 7
            There are a bunch of tutorials by Linda Rathgeber under the 'Also Available
            section of this page...

            http://www.projectseven.com/tutorials/images/index.htm

            Peter
            ________________
            "meister007" <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote in message
            news:f95q7o$fle$1@forums.macromedia.com...
            | Hi, I am trying to learn how to create seamless tiles for the backgrounds
            of my
            | flash sites. I can create the tiling effect but not a seamless one that
            looks
            | good. I have seen many tiles on the web but I would like to have a go at
            | making my own as I really want something very subtle. I was even thinking
            | about using the textures in fireworks to create the tiles with. Is this
            | possible?
            | I have found many tutorials on tiling for photoshop and some really old
            | versions of fireworks.... Does fireworks 8 have any new features that can
            help
            | me with this? I would really appreciate any advise on this topic and if
            you
            | can point be in the direction of some good tutorials that would be great.
            | Thanks so much
            |


            • 3. Re: Seamless tiles
              Level 7
              On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:41:36 +0400, pixlor <webforumsuser@macromedia.com>
              wrote:

              > Create a new image, with even dimensions. Start a composition, avoiding
              > the
              > edges (other than a background color or random noise. Quarter the image
              > and
              > swap the contents of the diagonal corners: upper right with lower left
              > and
              > upper left with lower right. (Fireworks guides and slices are great for
              > this
              > part.) Patch, blend, design, or whatever over the vertical and horizontal
              > middle regions. You now have a seamless tile.

              If you are Windows user, there's a freeware plugin for "Offset" function,
              making this process much easier:

              http://www.playingwithfire.com/color/ilya_tiler.html

              --
              Ilya Razmanov
              http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
              • 4. Re: Seamless tiles
                Level 7
                Where would that go in CS3, Ilya?

                --
                Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                Adobe Community Expert
                (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
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                "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                news:op.twm0h0cc6e3g07@toadie...
                > On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 07:41:36 +0400, pixlor <webforumsuser@macromedia.com>
                > wrote:
                >
                >> Create a new image, with even dimensions. Start a composition, avoiding
                >> the
                >> edges (other than a background color or random noise. Quarter the image
                >> and
                >> swap the contents of the diagonal corners: upper right with lower left
                >> and
                >> upper left with lower right. (Fireworks guides and slices are great for
                >> this
                >> part.) Patch, blend, design, or whatever over the vertical and horizontal
                >> middle regions. You now have a seamless tile.
                >
                > If you are Windows user, there's a freeware plugin for "Offset" function,
                > making this process much easier:
                >
                > http://www.playingwithfire.com/color/ilya_tiler.html
                >
                > --
                > Ilya Razmanov
                > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                • 5. Re: Seamless tiles
                  Level 7
                  On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 17:08:10 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                  <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:

                  > Where would that go in CS3, Ilya?
                  >

                  I don't quite understand your question. Are you asking for installation
                  instructions? Or menu this plugin will go to? In case of the former, I may
                  describe my favorite "shortcut trick". In case of the latter, I should
                  warn you that this filter is not scriptable and will not work as "Live
                  effect"; it will only show up in filters menu on the top of FW screen.

                  --
                  Ilya Razmanov
                  http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
                  • 6. Re: Seamless tiles
                    Level 7
                    meister007 wrote:


                    > I have found many tutorials on tiling for photoshop and some really old
                    > versions of fireworks.... Does fireworks 8 have any new features that can help
                    > me with this? I would really appreciate any advise on this topic and if you
                    > can point be in the direction of some good tutorials that would be great.
                    > Thanks so much
                    >

                    Here's one

                    http://www.playingwithfire.com/seamless.pdf


                    --
                    Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
                    --------------------------------------------------------------
                    http://www.projectseven.com
                    Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
                    CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
                    http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
                    --------------------------------------------------------------
                    • 7. Re: Seamless tiles
                      Level 7
                      I do not see an XTRAS folder in the folder hierarchy for FWCS3, on my WXP
                      box, or my Vista box.

                      --
                      Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                      Adobe Community Expert
                      (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
                      ==================
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                      "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                      news:op.twm3zcbv6e3g07@toadie...
                      > On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 17:08:10 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                      > <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                      >
                      >> Where would that go in CS3, Ilya?
                      >>
                      >
                      > I don't quite understand your question. Are you asking for installation
                      > instructions? Or menu this plugin will go to? In case of the former, I may
                      > describe my favorite "shortcut trick". In case of the latter, I should
                      > warn you that this filter is not scriptable and will not work as "Live
                      > effect"; it will only show up in filters menu on the top of FW screen.
                      >
                      > --
                      > Ilya Razmanov
                      > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                      • 8. Re: Seamless tiles
                        meister007 Level 1
                        Just managed to create my first tile. Its not bad for starters! Thanks for the help. I was not able to use llya's plug in as I could not find the XTRAS folder in fireworks. Do I need to have freehand mx for this?
                        Thanks again
                        • 9. Re: Seamless tiles
                          pixlor Level 4
                          quote:

                          Originally posted by: meister007
                          Just managed to create my first tile. Its not bad for starters! Thanks for the help. I was not able to use llya's plug in as I could not find the XTRAS folder in fireworks. Do I need to have freehand mx for this?
                          Thanks again


                          Congratulations!

                          The tutorial Linda Rathgeber linked to ( http://www.playingwithfire.com/seamless.pdf) is a detailed tutorial of the same basic method I described perhaps too briefly. The concept will work in any graphics program, although not every program has the ease of Firework's slices. You aren't limited to vector shapes, either. If you had an image of clouds that you wanted to cut and paste from, the quarter/swap/retouch method would work there, too.
                          • 10. Re: Seamless tiles
                            Level 7
                            On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 18:49:33 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                            <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:

                            > I do not see an XTRAS folder in the folder hierarchy for FWCS3, on my WXP
                            > box, or my Vista box.
                            >

                            I don't remember about CS3, but in MX it was called "Plug-Ins". Doesn't it
                            have such a folder? I'm sorry, I don't remember all the "factory"
                            locations for all the hosts - the exact location is host-specific, not
                            plugin-specific, so host manual should be more appropriate source of info
                            than my memory. Did you try searching for "plug" or "xtra" in help file?

                            In any case, I beleive that option for manually configuring "Preferences"
                            should be there, did you try that?

                            --
                            Ilya Razmanov
                            http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
                            • 11. Re: Seamless tiles
                              Level 7
                              Ilya:

                              There is a Plugins folder here -

                              C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins

                              on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?

                              --
                              Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                              Adobe Community Expert
                              (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
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                              "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                              news:op.twovpxg86e3g07@l2.ioc.ac.ru...
                              > On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 18:49:33 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                              > <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                              >
                              >> I do not see an XTRAS folder in the folder hierarchy for FWCS3, on my WXP
                              >> box, or my Vista box.
                              >>
                              >
                              > I don't remember about CS3, but in MX it was called "Plug-Ins". Doesn't it
                              > have such a folder? I'm sorry, I don't remember all the "factory"
                              > locations for all the hosts - the exact location is host-specific, not
                              > plugin-specific, so host manual should be more appropriate source of info
                              > than my memory. Did you try searching for "plug" or "xtra" in help file?
                              >
                              > In any case, I beleive that option for manually configuring "Preferences"
                              > should be there, did you try that?
                              >
                              > --
                              > Ilya Razmanov
                              > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                              • 12. Re: Seamless tiles
                                Level 7
                                Err - it's an 8bf file?

                                off.8bf

                                --
                                Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                                Adobe Community Expert
                                (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
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                                "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                                news:op.twovpxg86e3g07@l2.ioc.ac.ru...
                                > On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 18:49:33 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                > <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                                >
                                >> I do not see an XTRAS folder in the folder hierarchy for FWCS3, on my WXP
                                >> box, or my Vista box.
                                >>
                                >
                                > I don't remember about CS3, but in MX it was called "Plug-Ins". Doesn't it
                                > have such a folder? I'm sorry, I don't remember all the "factory"
                                > locations for all the hosts - the exact location is host-specific, not
                                > plugin-specific, so host manual should be more appropriate source of info
                                > than my memory. Did you try searching for "plug" or "xtra" in help file?
                                >
                                > In any case, I beleive that option for manually configuring "Preferences"
                                > should be there, did you try that?
                                >
                                > --
                                > Ilya Razmanov
                                > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                                • 13. Re: Seamless tiles
                                  Level 7
                                  Murray *ACE* wrote:
                                  > Ilya:
                                  >
                                  > There is a Plugins folder here -
                                  >
                                  > C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins
                                  >
                                  > on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?

                                  Yes, dll or 8bf (Photoshop's plugin format), that is where you should
                                  drop the file.

                                  --
                                  Stéphane Bergeron
                                  reach : connect : communicate
                                  http://www.webfocusdesign.com
                                  blog : tutorials : articles : gallery
                                  http://www.pixelyzed.com
                                  • 14. Re: Seamless tiles
                                    Level 7
                                    Thank you, Stéphane!

                                    --
                                    Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                                    Adobe Community Expert
                                    (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
                                    ==================
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                                    http://www.projectseven.com/go - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
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                                    "Stéphane Bergeron" <news@webfocusdesign.com> wrote in message
                                    news:f99sge$cgg$1@forums.macromedia.com...
                                    > Murray *ACE* wrote:
                                    >> Ilya:
                                    >>
                                    >> There is a Plugins folder here -
                                    >>
                                    >> C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins
                                    >>
                                    >> on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?
                                    >
                                    > Yes, dll or 8bf (Photoshop's plugin format), that is where you should drop
                                    > the file.
                                    >
                                    > --
                                    > Stéphane Bergeron
                                    > reach : connect : communicate
                                    > http://www.webfocusdesign.com
                                    > blog : tutorials : articles : gallery
                                    > http://www.pixelyzed.com


                                    • 15. Re: Seamless tiles
                                      Level 7
                                      On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17:15:33 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                      <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:

                                      > Err - it's an 8bf file?
                                      >
                                      > off.8bf
                                      >

                                      Well, I see the questions are already answered, so just a bit of info for
                                      future cases: Photoshop-compatible plugins have an extensions starting
                                      with "8b". The last char correspond to plugin type: "f" for filters, "i"
                                      for input/output (file formats) and so on. Filters seem to be the only
                                      type of plugins FW support, so if you see someting .8bf, this is something
                                      you can (most likely) use; if you see .8b(some other char), it's not for
                                      you :-)

                                      --
                                      Ilya Razmanov
                                      http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
                                      • 16. Re: Seamless tiles
                                        Level 7
                                        On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17:14:26 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                        <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:

                                        > Ilya:
                                        >
                                        > There is a Plugins folder here -
                                        >
                                        > C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins
                                        >
                                        > on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?
                                        >

                                        It should be the place.

                                        However, I personally prefer "shortcut trick". Very handy if you use
                                        several image editors or going to upgrade your FW. It works like this: you
                                        install all your plugins somewhere like "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins" and
                                        subdirs below it, that is, outside FW and PS. Then, within FW plugin dir,
                                        you create a shortcut to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins". Next time you start
                                        FW, it finds the shortcut and goes to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins"
                                        continuing search for plugins.

                                        This trick work with Photoshop as well. Also I was told it works with
                                        Painter.

                                        This way, you keep all the plugins outside FW or PS. If you decide to
                                        remove current version of FW or PS, plugins will stay intact, and you can
                                        use it with another program or another version.

                                        --
                                        Ilya Razmanov
                                        http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
                                        • 17. Re: Seamless tiles
                                          Level 7
                                          Thanks, Ilya!

                                          --
                                          Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                                          Adobe Community Expert
                                          (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
                                          ==================
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                                          http://www.projectseven.com/go - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
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                                          ==================


                                          "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                                          news:op.two1fub86e3g07@l2.ioc.ac.ru...
                                          > On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17:15:33 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                          > <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                                          >
                                          >> Err - it's an 8bf file?
                                          >>
                                          >> off.8bf
                                          >>
                                          >
                                          > Well, I see the questions are already answered, so just a bit of info for
                                          > future cases: Photoshop-compatible plugins have an extensions starting
                                          > with "8b". The last char correspond to plugin type: "f" for filters, "i"
                                          > for input/output (file formats) and so on. Filters seem to be the only
                                          > type of plugins FW support, so if you see someting .8bf, this is something
                                          > you can (most likely) use; if you see .8b(some other char), it's not for
                                          > you :-)
                                          >
                                          > --
                                          > Ilya Razmanov
                                          > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                                          • 18. Re: Seamless tiles
                                            Level 7
                                            Nice. I'll do that right away!

                                            --
                                            Murray --- ICQ 71997575
                                            Adobe Community Expert
                                            (If you *MUST* email me, don't LAUGH when you do so!)
                                            ==================
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                                            http://www.projectseven.com/go - DW FAQs, Tutorials & Resources
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                                            ==================


                                            "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                                            news:op.two1rfzg6e3g07@l2.ioc.ac.ru...
                                            > On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17:14:26 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                            > <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                                            >
                                            >> Ilya:
                                            >>
                                            >> There is a Plugins folder here -
                                            >>
                                            >> C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins
                                            >>
                                            >> on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?
                                            >>
                                            >
                                            > It should be the place.
                                            >
                                            > However, I personally prefer "shortcut trick". Very handy if you use
                                            > several image editors or going to upgrade your FW. It works like this: you
                                            > install all your plugins somewhere like "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins" and
                                            > subdirs below it, that is, outside FW and PS. Then, within FW plugin dir,
                                            > you create a shortcut to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins". Next time you start
                                            > FW, it finds the shortcut and goes to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins"
                                            > continuing search for plugins.
                                            >
                                            > This trick work with Photoshop as well. Also I was told it works with
                                            > Painter.
                                            >
                                            > This way, you keep all the plugins outside FW or PS. If you decide to
                                            > remove current version of FW or PS, plugins will stay intact, and you can
                                            > use it with another program or another version.
                                            >
                                            > --
                                            > Ilya Razmanov
                                            > http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                                            • 19. Re: Seamless tiles
                                              Level 7
                                              I have also been using this method for some time now, the only difference
                                              that I've noticed, is that it can slow down your initial start up time a
                                              little. But it's well worth it.

                                              Peter
                                              _____________________
                                              "Ilya Razmanov" <ilyich@ioc.ac.ru> wrote in message
                                              news:op.two1rfzg6e3g07@l2.ioc.ac.ru...
                                              | On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17:14:26 +0400, Murray *ACE*
                                              | <forums@HAHAgreat-web-sights.com> wrote:
                                              |
                                              | > Ilya:
                                              | >
                                              | > There is a Plugins folder here -
                                              | >
                                              | > C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins
                                              | >
                                              | > on WXP, and on Vista. Is that where I should drop this dll?
                                              | >
                                              |
                                              | It should be the place.
                                              |
                                              | However, I personally prefer "shortcut trick". Very handy if you use
                                              | several image editors or going to upgrade your FW. It works like this: you
                                              | install all your plugins somewhere like "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins" and
                                              | subdirs below it, that is, outside FW and PS. Then, within FW plugin dir,
                                              | you create a shortcut to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins". Next time you start
                                              | FW, it finds the shortcut and goes to "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins"
                                              | continuing search for plugins.
                                              |
                                              | This trick work with Photoshop as well. Also I was told it works with
                                              | Painter.
                                              |
                                              | This way, you keep all the plugins outside FW or PS. If you decide to
                                              | remove current version of FW or PS, plugins will stay intact, and you can
                                              | use it with another program or another version.
                                              |
                                              | --
                                              | Ilya Razmanov
                                              | http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters


                                              • 20. Re: Seamless tiles
                                                Level 7
                                                Ilya Razmanov wrote:


                                                > However, I personally prefer "shortcut trick". Very handy if you use
                                                > several image editors or going to upgrade your FW. It works like this:
                                                > you install all your plugins somewhere like "C:\Program Files\Plug-Ins"

                                                Yup. Excellent advice, Ilya. That's what I've done too.

                                                --
                                                Linda Rathgeber [PVII] *Adobe Community Expert-Fireworks*
                                                --------------------------------------------------------------
                                                http://www.projectseven.com
                                                Fireworks Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/fireworks/
                                                CSS Newsgroup: news://forums.projectseven.com/css/
                                                http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/
                                                --------------------------------------------------------------
                                                • 21. Re: Seamless tiles
                                                  Level 7
                                                  On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 19:58:06 +0400, PJR
                                                  <flash@SLICEreclusivebillionaire.com> wrote:

                                                  > I have also been using this method for some time now, the only difference
                                                  > that I've noticed, is that it can slow down your initial start up time a
                                                  > little.

                                                  I don't know about CS3 since I've only made a brief tests, but previous
                                                  versions of FW did not cache plugin info like PS, PSP or GIMP do. That
                                                  made FW plugin search at startup considerably slower than that for PS
                                                  anyway. It is boring for me as a plugin developer since I have to restart
                                                  often, but I can leave with that as a graphics designer - working with
                                                  graphics takes much longer that starting FW, so a couple of additional
                                                  seconds for startup doesn't really matter.

                                                  > But it's well worth it.

                                                  Not only it makes upgrading FW easier, but also adds some plugin
                                                  management capabilities to it.

                                                  --
                                                  Ilya Razmanov
                                                  http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters
                                                  • 22. Re: Seamless tiles
                                                    Level 7
                                                    On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 21:26:51 +0400, meister007
                                                    <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                                                    > I was not able to use llya's plug in as I could not find the XTRAS
                                                    > folder in fireworks.

                                                    See other replies made by Murray and Stephane - it should be something like

                                                    C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Fireworks CS3\Plug-Ins

                                                    that is, the folder is called "Plug-Ins" rather than "Xtras" now.

                                                    > Do I need to have freehand mx for this?

                                                    No.

                                                    --
                                                    Ilya Razmanov
                                                    http://photoshop.msk.ru - Photoshop plug-in filters