13 Replies Latest reply on Jul 27, 2007 5:51 AM by Philip Tory

    RH Crashes when loading a new topic

    Philip Tory Level 1
      I know, RH has been crahsing for years - why stop now? Well, this is the fourth time this afternoon. I've had this problem on different computers, under Windows 2000 and XP Pro; with RH5 and 6; and I've even seen it on delegates' own computers during training courses.
      When I switch to a new topic, the topic starts to load, and then it gets stiuck on one of the graphics. (I think it is usually a PNG file, but then most of my graphics are). After, say, 15 seconds, I get that MS crash advice screen that confirms what I already know, and offers to send a message to Microsoft. (This time I had a look at part of the content, and it mentioned something about JPG files - but there are no JPGs on the topic. Pity we can't copy the message).
      Can anyone suggest a solution that works? It's one of those things I try to live with, and do frequent Clrt_S Saves while working... but surely there's a better way?
      I have saved a screen shot at the moment of crash, if anyone wants to see it.
        • 1. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
          Paul Griffiths
          I've found the same problem with certain PNG files and X5, and I've noticed that it can depend on the files' provenance. For example, if I save a Visio drawing as a PNG, X5 chokes. If I open that same PNG in PaintShop Pro (I'm using version 8) and then re-save it back to itself (i.e. still as a PNG), X5 has no problems. (However, that's a painful workaround so I've stopped saving to PNG from Visio.) On the other hand, screen captures to PNG using FullShot have never been any problem in X5. Go figure!
          • 2. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
            Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP
            Hi Paul Griffiths

            This is just a "gut feeling" on my part. But as you have seen, all .PNG files are not created equally. What do I mean by this?

            Well, I'm unsure about Visio, but if you look at Adobe Fireworks, it may edit .PNG files. Actually, .PNG is it's native and preferred format. And guess what. Like Photoshop, Fireworks maintains lots of data about the image. And all that data is stored right inside the image format itself! So I'm thinking this could be a large factor in what you are seeing.

            Cheers... Rick
            • 3. RH Crashes when loading a new topic
              Philip Tory Level 1
              Thank you Paul and Rick.

              I always use Paint Shop Pro 7 for the images, which are mostly screen captures (using Alt_Print_Screen and paste), cropped as required. Reduce to 256-colour and save as PNG. (I do not use Visio).

              Is PSP OK? If so, I am no nearer a resolution of the problem, which has happened twice again today...

              Help!!!

              Philip
              • 4. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP
                Hi Phillip

                Hmmm, I don't know anything about PSP. My tool of choice is SnagIt.

                However, if I were in your shoes, I'd be investigating the options available to me from PSP when saving as a .PNG. Obviously there is something about the PSP created .PNG files that seems to freak RoboHelp out.

                Wish I had more to offer... Rick
                • 5. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                  Captiv8r Adobe Community Professional & MVP
                  Hi again

                  Just saw something in your original thread that you may find interesting. You said: This time I had a look at part of the content, and it mentioned something about JPG files - but there are no JPGs on the topic. Pity we can't copy the message

                  The other day, I learned a new trick that was posted to a different list I subscribe to. Next time you see the message, before you click the OK button to dismiss it, try pressing Ctrl+C. Then pop Notepad open and try pasting. You may be surprised to see that the entire message is listed. Apparently this is a rather obscure and undocumented feature of Windows. Click here to read more about this

                  Just a thought... Rick
                  • 6. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                    HKabaker Level 2
                    Philip,

                    I've had problems with .png.

                    I use PSP 8 and PSP 6 and 7 earlier. I like it.
                    The .psp extension is native to PSP (oh, of course, Harvey, doooh). If I remember correctly, MS Word, for example, doesn't see it when importing pictures.

                    I leave it that way (millions of colors) while manipulating the image, save the final version in .psp format and save it again in .gif. (What the heck, how many people have monitors with better than 256 colors in 96 ppi resolution (Win) or 72 ppi (Mac)?)

                    By the way, using the Alt_Print_Screen capture subjects the data to MS Windows image bitmap handling, whatever that may be. I suggest using the PSP screen capture or SnagIt, both of which automatically create a file for each capture.

                    Harvey


                    • 7. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                      HKabaker Level 2
                      Ooops, Rick, I may have seen you standing there, but I have a bad habit of interrupting the person speaking.

                      Thanks for the tip on copying error messages, which I didn't know about. But the command is Control + Insert, I think.

                      Best regards,

                      Harvey
                      • 8. RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                        Philip Tory Level 1
                        Thanks everyone.

                        I don't save in PSP file format except on the odd occasion when I want to preserve the layers etc., and always save to PNG before use.

                        I normally save screen shot images straight to PNG, 256 colour. (You may have noticed that PNG 16-colour images do not display correctly in RH edit mode). I choose PNG format because it makes for smaller files - typically 70% to 50% of the GIF file size. This means smaller Help Guides that my clients can pass to their customers by email or web site download. Also, if the Help Guide is used over a thin client connection, it speeds up the download time for each topic.

                        Is PNG really the problem? Surely the might of Adobe can fix it? (Oooh look, a pig just flew past my window!...)
                        • 9. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                          HKabaker Level 2
                          Philip,

                          You ask, "Is PNG really the problem?"

                          If you take png files out the equation, does the problem persist?

                          It could be something else in the file you're trying to import. I'd suggest starting with a new test project and importing one file at a time until RH crashes.

                          Harvey
                          • 10. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                            Philip Tory Level 1
                            Hi Harvey,

                            Well, I'll try some using GIF for the rest of this project. I've had this problem for 5 years, on a number of different computers, under Windows 2000 and XP Pro; with RH5 and 6; and across dozens of Help projects. So I don't think it's project-dependent.
                            • 11. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                              Linux Rules Level 2
                              Had to try it for myself...you're right, RHX5 crashed when I tried to insert the PNG exported from Visio.

                              I then opened the image in The GIMP (an open source graphics program similar to Photoshop) and followed these steps:

                              > Open PNG image in The GIMP.
                              > From the Menu Bar, select Image>Flatten Image (it does nothing but makes the program think there was a change).
                              > From the Menu Bar, select File>Save As.
                              > Expand the Select File Type (By Extension) and select PNG image.
                              > Click Save.
                              > On the File exists popup, click Replace.
                              > In the Save as PNG popup, select what to save (I usually save resolution and creation time only) and Compression level.
                              > Click OK.
                              > Close The GIMP.

                              Insert PNG into RHX5.

                              Worked great, no problem.

                              Regards,
                              GEWB
                              • 12. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                                HKabaker Level 2
                                Thanks, GEWB, for this info.

                                Philip,

                                As you have seen, Paint Shop Pro automatically flattens layers when saving as .png, as it does for .gif and other non-layered formats.

                                I really like PSP's many options for capturing -- saving the whole screen, the active window only, an area you select before the capture, and so on. (SnagIt and other graphics apps have the same choices.)

                                Alt+Print Screen forces me to do some extra work, cropping before sizing, as I almost never expand an application's window to fill the whole screen.

                                Harvey
                                • 13. Re: RH Crashes when loading a new topic
                                  Philip Tory Level 1
                                  HKabaker / Cativ8tor: It crashed again...
                                  I tried capturing the contents of that "Error message to Microsoft": Doesn't seem to work. I tried Ctrl_C, Ctrl_Insert; Alt_Insert, varioations with Shift key as well; no luck.
                                  Philip