1 2 Previous Next 49 Replies Latest reply on Sep 30, 2010 1:15 PM by Jarliei

    New Sequence / General

    Jarliei Level 1

      My camera is a Panasonic HDC-HS9 camcorder.

      Panasonic Help Line advised that the Time Base should be set to 23.976 fps.

      My clips taken with that camera, shows a Frame Rate of 25 fps.

      Which setting should I apply?

        • 1. Re: New Sequence / General
          shooternz Level 6

          25fps IMHO

           

          Try dropping a clip on the NEW ITEM ICON and see what sequence it produces.

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: New Sequence / General
            Jim_Simon Level 8

            25 is the European standard frame rate.  23.976 (a.k.a. 24p) is the American/Hollywood standard frame rate.  Based on where you live, you should be able to deduce the correct settings.

            • 3. Re: New Sequence / General
              Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Do what Craig suggested (drop on new sequence).  But you should also get this sorted out for the future.

               

              Panasonic Help Line advised that the Time Base should be set to 23.976 fps.

              My clips taken with that camera, shows a Frame Rate of 25 fps.


              What do they mean by "should be SET TO"?  That it has multiple options?

               

              How do you know your clips are 25fps?

               

              I think you should call the panasonic line and ask them for more information about how you shot in 25fps.

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: New Sequence / General
                Jarliei Level 1

                Stan,

                What do they mean by "should be SET TO"?

                When I spoke to the Panasonic “Technical Expert” it did seem to me that he was somewhere up there in space with the fairies, he did say “Should” and I was thinking, “Right Mr Expert, what other miracles are in stow for us today?”. Hence the reason for my post, I was not comfortable with what I have heard.

                See also Jim Simon and Craig postings – 25 European 24 American settings, seeing that the Panasonic Astronaut and I reside in Australia which one will expect him to know, the 24 setting was indeed incorrect. Thank you both Craig and Jim.

                ....That it has multiple options?

                The Timebase has multiple options available as follow,

                23.976 ; 25.00 ; 29.97

                How do you know your clips are 25fps?

                The Clip data shown in the Project Panel also include the Frame Rate, in my case, all of them show it to be 25.00 fps.

                I think you should call the panasonic line and ask them for more information about how you shot in 25fps.

                I certainly shall, and at the same time I shall ask them to confirm their advise for other settings, viz

                1080p Anamorphic.

                Audio Sample rate 32000 Hz.

                Many thanks

                • 5. Re: New Sequence / General
                  Jim_Simon Level 8
                  at the same time I shall ask them

                   

                  You'll probably have better luck asking here.

                  • 6. Re: New Sequence / General
                    Jarliei Level 1

                    First question first

                    How do you guys get to highlight citations background?

                     

                    Otherwise, in reply to your post.

                    I’ll give Panasonic another go later on this morning; somebody there must have the right information.

                    Saying that, and considering the numerous number of cameras old and new that are in people possession, as well as the nonexistence of Camera Specification Data Base and seeing that worldwide PP users edit an enormous variety of footage, would not it be beneficial to Camera manufacturers, Adobe and PP users to have a fast and a simplified access to a reliable Data Base?

                    After all when one receives footage from an external person, asking them what camera was used the answer in most cases are “A video Camera” or “a Cannon I think” and the like.

                    As worldwide, there are at the most two dozen camera manufacturers and all of them do have the right data, maybe a letter from Adobe asking them to fill a form / table with the right info will be just the way to go.

                    Similar in many respects to Adobe successful handling of the Camera Raw version fiasco.

                    Wouldn’t that make life easy?

                    • 7. Re: New Sequence / General
                      the_wine_snob Level 9
                      How do you guys get to highlight citations background?

                       

                      I use the little Quotation icon in the editing screen - upper row, last icon.

                       

                      Its use is a bit browser dependent, but on IE 7, or Chrome, if I just click it, it'll bring in the entire post, to which I am replying, and that is seldom what I want. Instead, I will do a Copy/Paste, and then with the exact text highlighted, click the icon - done.

                       

                      Good luck,

                       

                      Hunt

                      • 8. Re: New Sequence / General
                        shooternz Level 6

                        I dont get why you are ringing Panasonic.!

                         

                        Is this your camera?  Did you set it up to shoot?

                         

                        Does the metadata in the clip tell you what ever you want to know?

                         

                        Did you try any of the suggestions posted above?

                         

                        What actually is your current issue?

                        • 9. Re: New Sequence / General
                          Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          My suggestion to pursue panasonic is for the future, and may be unnecessary even then.

                           

                          You know what you need now: do what Craig suggested in post 1 and let us know.

                          • 10. Re: New Sequence / General
                            Jarliei Level 1

                            Granted that the clip data are visible in the Meta Data screen.

                            However, dropping a clip into the Project / New Item changes it to a Sequence.

                            At which point this Sequence takes on the properties of the existing Sequence Presets, in my case Custom Presets.

                            I have tested this by applying some ridicules setting to a Custom setting, the new sequence facsimiled these settings.

                            If on the other hand I would have set my Sequence Custom Presets erroneously, then the Sequence will have the wrong settings.

                            Hence obtaining the recorded Meta Data will facilitate the setting of an accurate Sequence Preset.

                            The camera is not immediately physically available to me, the camera manual is silent regarding the needed information and as it would be important to play it safe and edit by applying accurate variables it is important to know what were the actual camera settings at the time of recording.

                            • 11. Re: New Sequence / General
                              Jarliei Level 1

                              Its use is a bit browser dependent, but on IE 7, or Chrome, if I just click it,

                               

                              thanks, It seems to work on Firefox too.

                              • 12. Re: New Sequence / General
                                Jim_Simon Level 8

                                it is important to know what were the actual camera settings at the time of recording.

                                 

                                 

                                Agreed.  But that data should be known before you shoot, not gleaned after.

                                • 13. Re: New Sequence / General
                                  shooternz Level 6
                                  Granted that the clip data are visible in the Meta Data screen.
                                  However, dropping a clip into the Project / New Item changes it to a Sequence.

                                  At which point this Sequence takes on the properties of the existing Sequence Presets, in my case Custom Presets.

                                  I have tested this by applying some ridicules setting to a Custom setting, the new sequence facsimiled these settings.

                                  If on the other hand I would have set my Sequence Custom Presets erroneously, then the Sequence will have the wrong settings.

                                  Hence obtaining the recorded Meta Data will facilitate the setting of an accurate Sequence Preset.

                                   

                                   

                                   

                                   

                                  Sorry ...but you are not making any sense in what you wrote above!.

                                   

                                  Of course it creates a matching Sequence from the Presets.  Thats what you want it to do.

                                   

                                  You know its 25fps so...

                                   

                                  What exactly is the issue you are having?   ie Simply....does it edit or not in a 25fps Project?

                                  • 14. Re: New Sequence / General
                                    Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                    Of course it creates a matching Sequence from the Presets.  Thats what you want it to do.


                                    But that isn't correct is it?  It creates a sequence with the settings of the file, whether there is a preset or not.  I'm not sure it uses a preset even if there is one that fits.  Admittedly, I'm new on CS5, but my experiments suggest this is true, and that's what the help file says:

                                     

                                    http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premierepro/cs/using/WSd79b3ca3b623cac941d41a681247d1f35a4-7ff f.html

                                     

                                    In many cases, you want to create a sequence that matches the characteristics of the primary assets (clips) that you’ll be editing. You can create a sequence that matches the characteristics of an asset by dragging the asset to the New Item [icon not copied] button at the bottom of the Project panel.

                                     

                                    You can also create a sequence by using a sequence preset. The sequence presets included with Premiere Pro include the correct settings for common types of assets. For example, if you have footage mostly in DV format, use a DV sequence preset.

                                     

                                    Jarliei, while knowing what you shot helps, what happens if you make an error - we've all set a camera up wrong (hopefully not too often).  While your sequence settings may look like a preset, I think the sequence you created when you dragged the file to the New Item icon reflects the properties of the file itself.  What are they?  Does it play on the timeline?

                                    • 15. Re: New Sequence / General
                                      shooternz Level 6

                                      I guess Stan that what is confusing me is that I do not know what Jarlie issue is?

                                       

                                      However the NEW ITEM Icon works...we do not know if it is working for Jarlie.  He seems hung up on establishing a setting despite the info and workflows he has been supplied with..

                                       

                                      Another  thing is... it is actually easy to edit many mismatched clips in a "wrong" sequence.  It desnt actually crash the application or anything.

                                      and...there are not that many presets if you analyse the diference between them.

                                      • 16. Re: New Sequence / General
                                        Jarliei Level 1

                                         

                                        Stan, Craig, Jim.

                                        Ok, let’s forget all previous posting, the forest is lost for the trees, let me try this.

                                        24 fps v 25 fps – Ausi settings @25. Topic completed.

                                        Setting for current camcorders (like a Panasonic HDC-HS9 ) – I take it that all is in the Meta, I should see it in the clips.  Topic completed.

                                        The Open Topic

                                        I am editing clips 15 – 20 years old.

                                        No Meta or info what so ever on the clips.

                                        Cameras no longer exist nor can they be identified.

                                        It has taken me 11 days to work on 14 clips to produce one movie.

                                        Another 387 clips to go.

                                        These will be turned into many many movies.

                                        Question.

                                        What presets settings shall I use with the confidence of knowing that I will not have to redo the work?

                                        • 17. Re: New Sequence / General
                                          shooternz Level 6

                                          Can you tell us what happens when you place a clip on the NEW ITEM ICON  ??????????????????????

                                           

                                          Are you able to edit it at all  in the sequnce or is there an issue. ????????????????????

                                           

                                          I repeat for the final time.  We have no idea what your  editing issue actually is!

                                           

                                          (I am starting to feel as if this is a troll or a wind up)

                                          • 18. Re: New Sequence / General
                                            Jarliei Level 1

                                            1. The clip changes to a Sequence.

                                            2. The Sequence Settings are as per the Custom Defaults.

                                            3. I can edit the sequence.

                                            • 19. Re: New Sequence / General
                                              shooternz Level 6

                                              So whats the problem then?

                                              • 20. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                Jarliei Level 1

                                                Some of my clips do not have an embedded camera data, others do.

                                                The clips adopt the Default (Custom) Sequence settings when added to a project –

                                                This is the situation.

                                                1. I set the Custom Sequence Settings.

                                                2. Create a project "Early Childhood" using some of the clips stored in Folder “1987”.

                                                3. In six month I’ll add newly discovered clips to this project from say Folder “1999” which contains clips with an embedded Meta data.

                                                Results

                                                I now have one project with multiple types of clips.

                                                Problem

                                                Are edited movies able to handle multiple types of various clips?

                                                If not, what do I need to do NOW?

                                                • 21. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                  Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                                  Please confirm that you have CS5.

                                                   

                                                  I now understand (I think, I'm getting this thread now confused with a different one) that you have clips from numerous cameras (some cameras are no longer available to you), and that the initial focus was on one, current camera.  You want to be clear about how to edit the footage you shot from the current camera, but you also need to edit older material.

                                                   

                                                  Ultimately, you need to know what each clip is.  First, I would get clear with us about the current camera, and then do the other issues.

                                                   

                                                  From 2 posts ago, regarding what happens when you drag an video to the New Item icon:

                                                   

                                                  > 2. The Sequence Settings are as per the Custom Defaults.

                                                   

                                                  I do not believe this is true.  It sets a sequence with the characteristics of that clip, not the default settings (which are not really default settings, they are what you used last when you create a setting).  I realize, from one of your earlier posts, that you did some tests and believe otherwise.  You do seem to now indicate that you can edit in the sequence created in this manner.  Since you may not be confident that you have the right settings, list it out for us: what does the project bin say and what are the sequence settings?  Post a screenshot would be good.

                                                   

                                                  1. I set the Custom Sequence Settings.

                                                  2. Create a project "Early Childhood" using some of the clips stored in Folder “1987”.

                                                  In some cases it doesn't matter, but it is generally better to use the correct terms.  A project is the largest part, and is what has the name and file (.prproj).  A sequence in CS4 and CS5 can have different settings from other sequences in the project.  A project has basic settings, but it is the sequence that is the issue for you. 

                                                   

                                                  You can mix material in the same sequence, but you will want to think through how to do that, and it can cause problems.  Some material is better converted to a format that is easier to mix.

                                                  • 22. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                    shooternz Level 6

                                                    You seem overly hung up on the settings  and Custom Presets thing (and I now understand you have different clips from diferent cameras)

                                                     

                                                    (My bet is that a standard  Adobe Preset will do all you need and I dont know how you ended up with custom presets).

                                                     

                                                    Just start editing with the different clips you.... have in the sequence that you set up.

                                                     

                                                    You can mix clips in a sequence but.....

                                                     

                                                    You may have to render them

                                                    Rescale them.

                                                    Change PAR

                                                    Interpret fields

                                                     

                                                    None of that is a big deal.

                                                     

                                                    BTW: right click on any clip> Properties.    This will tell you the dimension of the clip which is about the most important thing you need to know about it.

                                                    • 23. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                      jeremy d. Level 3

                                                      OK, so you have different clips in various formats, frame rates, and dimensions.

                                                      In my world, I would edit to a sequence that matches your desired output.

                                                      • 24. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                        Jarliei Level 1

                                                        edit to a sequence that matches your desired output

                                                         

                                                        Thank you!

                                                        You have answered my question.

                                                        • 25. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                          shooternz Level 6

                                                          So what is that "desired output" ?

                                                           

                                                          I must say that I disagree with the advice because its inflexible and limiting.

                                                           

                                                          I would edit in an "optimal" sequence factored to the source footage.

                                                          • 26. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                            jeremy d. Level 3

                                                            If you've got a bunch of mismatched clips, and your goal is to output to format x -- DVD, whatever -- then building towards that goal makes sense to me.

                                                             

                                                            What is the optimal format in this case, given the hodgepodge of footage?

                                                            • 27. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                              Jarliei Level 1

                                                               

                                                              Stan,

                                                              Firstly, please see Jeremy’s posting - " edit to a sequence that matches your desired output".

                                                              This appears to be the way to go.

                                                               

                                                              I was needlessly franting regarding the clip / sequence EXISTING (or NOT existing) data, which according to Jeremy are not the important factor.

                                                              Your post

                                                               

                                                              Please confirm that you have CS5.

                                                              I am using CS5 5.0.1

                                                               

                                                              I now understand…..etc….. edit older material.

                                                              Correct

                                                               

                                                              Ultimately….etc…the current camera.

                                                              My setting for the current camera are now in line with the advice of the User group, NOT Panasonic. I have no issues with the current camera.

                                                               

                                                              From 2 …etc… Custom Defaults

                                                              It does happen.

                                                               

                                                              It sets a sequence with the characteristics of that clip, not the default settings

                                                              Set a custom default / Import a clip / data  is now as per the Custom set up.

                                                               

                                                              (which are not really default settings, they are what you used last when you create a setting). 

                                                              Noted. you might be right, but if they are not the System default settings, they certainly are the PREVAILING default setting.

                                                               

                                                              I realize, from one of your earlier posts, that you did some tests and believe otherwise. 

                                                              Correct

                                                               

                                                              You do seem to now indicate that you can edit in the sequence created in this manner.

                                                              Always could

                                                               

                                                              Since you may not be confident that you have the right settings

                                                              Correct.

                                                              That what was the first issue.

                                                              The second issue of course was “The consequence of editing with the wrong or unknown settings”.

                                                              Jeremy’s reply is a ray of sunshine: - “edit to a sequence that matches your desired output".

                                                               

                                                              list it out for us: what does the project bin say and what are the sequence settings?  Post a screenshot would be good.

                                                              Will do so shortly.

                                                               

                                                              1. I set …etc… for you. 

                                                              Noted. Will do.

                                                               

                                                              You can mix …etc… easier to mix.

                                                              Noted. Will do.

                                                               

                                                               

                                                               

                                                              Many many thanks.

                                                              • 28. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                Jarliei Level 1

                                                                OH! you are killing me! I was drafting a reply to Stan and just saw your post.

                                                                I am about writing back to you re your post.

                                                                • 29. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                  shooternz Level 6

                                                                  The problem is we dont know how much of a hodgepodge the footage is and we dont know the

                                                                  "desired output".

                                                                   

                                                                  DVD is not a preset in Sequence Preset terms.  He may be making a Youtube movie or something for a cellphone.  Who would know but you wouldnt want to edit SD PAL in a mp4 project. at 366 x 240 for example

                                                                   

                                                                  Optimal to me is to edit an "optimal" sequence that works in the best rez and dimension of the source files.  It is likely that some of it is SD 25fps.

                                                                  In that instance I would edit in a SD PAL Sequence (there isnt a DVD Preset) and deal with the issues as they come up.

                                                                   

                                                                  Editing optimised to the source means you can work downwards. eg SD PAL DV to cellphone  mp4

                                                                   

                                                                  If you start down...you cant go up.

                                                                  • 30. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                    Jarliei Level 1

                                                                     

                                                                    Craig.

                                                                    You seem …etc…different cameras)

                                                                    I was concerned that I will be spending the next two years editing un-viewable footage.

                                                                    My bet…etc…presets.

                                                                    I have concluded (obviously erroneously) that the imported clips presets dictate and govern the final results, where as according to Jeremy it is the other way around..

                                                                    Just start editing …etc…big deal.

                                                                    Will do, thanks.

                                                                    BTW: right click …etc… about it.

                                                                    Noted, thanks

                                                                    • 31. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                      shooternz Level 6

                                                                      The imported clips do dictate or affect  the final result in some way.

                                                                       

                                                                      EXAMPLE.

                                                                       

                                                                      If your clip is PAL DV  720x 576

                                                                       

                                                                      That is not the dimension of a full HD  1920 x 1280 clip (or its variants)

                                                                       

                                                                      ..so if you placed the 720 x 576 clip in a full HD  1920 x 1280 project . Your little clip would be a postage stamp amongst others  in the final movie.

                                                                       

                                                                      If you tried to scale up the 720 x 576 clip....it would degrade (pixellate) the quality of that clip.

                                                                       

                                                                       

                                                                      Do a few little tests. Cost you nothing but time.  We all learnt over time

                                                                      • 32. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                        My bet…etc…presets.

                                                                        I have concluded (obviously erroneously) that the imported clips presets dictate and govern the final results, where as according to Jeremy it is the other way around..

                                                                        There might be a bit of confusion here. One wants to let the source footage dictate their choice of Project Preset. That is as good as it gets. That diminishes all problems. THEN, when done, one can choose the Export settings, per their needs.

                                                                         

                                                                        With mixed footage, one has several choices, but usually the best one is to choose a Preset for the main source footage, and then via several means, convert the other to match that.

                                                                         

                                                                        Good luck,

                                                                         

                                                                        Hunt

                                                                        • 33. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                          jeremy d. Level 3

                                                                          The problem is we dont know how much of a hodgepodge the footage is and we dont know the

                                                                          "desired output".

                                                                           

                                                                          Yes, that info would help.

                                                                           

                                                                          DVD is not a preset in Sequence Preset terms.

                                                                           

                                                                          Of course. I wasn't actually suggesting a specific preset, merely  speculating a destination. (I thought we weren't getting hung up on  presets:) )

                                                                           

                                                                          Optimal to me is to edit an "optimal" sequence that works in the best rez and dimension of the source files.  It is likely that some of it is SD 25fps.

                                                                          In that instance I would edit in a SD PAL Sequence (there isnt a DVD Preset) and deal with the issues as they come up.

                                                                           

                                                                          Editing optimised to the source means you can work downwards. eg SD PAL DV to cellphone  mp4

                                                                           

                                                                          I would agree. We're kind of hamstrung without knowing the media formats.

                                                                           

                                                                           

                                                                          But Jarliel, please don't take what I say as gospel; I think we're all right. The correct guidance varies as your expectations, footage, and output do. What I'm suggesting allows for random footage but is definitely geared towards one goal, and what Craig is saying allows much more flexibility at the end of the project. It's up to you to decide what makes sense.

                                                                           

                                                                           

                                                                          [what happened to my post's formatting, I have no idea]

                                                                          • 34. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                            shooternz Level 6

                                                                            No one reads Post #31

                                                                            • 35. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                              jeremy d. Level 3

                                                                              We all posted at the same time, I think.

                                                                               

                                                                              shooternz wrote:

                                                                               

                                                                              No one reads Post #31

                                                                              • 36. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                                shooternz Level 6
                                                                                [what happened to my post's formatting, I have no idea]

                                                                                 

                                                                                Post formatting in this forum has been wonky for sometime.

                                                                                • 37. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                                  shooternz Level 6

                                                                                  We cant post at the same time because I am in NZ and a day a head of you guys.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  NZ is the future.

                                                                                  • 38. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                                    jeremy d. Level 3

                                                                                    shooternz wrote:

                                                                                     

                                                                                    We cant post at the same time because I am in NZ and a day a head of you guys.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    NZ is the future.

                                                                                     

                                                                                     

                                                                                     

                                                                                    I always see us here on the west coast as existing at the end of the day.

                                                                                    I check out BBC news to see what's going to happen.

                                                                                    • 39. Re: New Sequence / General
                                                                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                                                      Where have I head that before?

                                                                                       

                                                                                      I was just afraid that the OP had missed that point, and did not want them misunderstanding.

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Hunt

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