30 Replies Latest reply on Nov 4, 2011 9:03 PM by hapunen

    Disk at risk warning on raid 0

    Editor Naama Level 1

      Hello all,

       

      My system:

      Windows7 64 bit

      Premiere CS4

      motherboard: X58A-UD3R

      CPU: Intel I7 930

      RAM 6 GB

       

      I got my new system. I let the computer shop set it up for me with Raid 0. There's a warning in an application called "Intel Rapid storage technology" on one of the disks of the raid stating:"Disk at risk" and it has a yellow triangle warning sign. When I press the "reset to normal" It has the green check mark again, but after some time the warning returns. I took it back to the lab only to discover that they aren't so professional. They checked all the disks, told me they were OK and that the warning didn't appear again. When I got the computer back I discovered that I had to set up the Raid 0 array again in the Intel application and after doing that the warning returned.

       

      Has anyone encountered this problem before?

       

      I know this is more of a computer issue, but there are such knowledgeable people here, who may be experienced with raid, so I thought I might ask here.

       

      Thanks for any info you might have

        • 1. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
          ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

          That means that drive is failing on 1 or some of the Smart requests the board is sending to the drive. That is one of the main features of Smart though

          it's still in it's infancy.  That likely means that drive is going to fail sooner rather than later. I would back up your data now and

          warranty the drive.

           

          Eric

          ADK

          • 2. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
            Editor Naama Level 1

            Thank you so much for your reply!

            I couldn't find info about it on the Internet. Now I know what to say to the computer shop. Thanks!

            • 3. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
              Editor Naama Level 1

              I'll update on this matter in case it may help other people in the future.

               

              Finally I got my computer back to work. I think the problem is solved, but I still have to work on the drives for a while to be sure. I was told that there was a problem with the synchronization of the two drives on the raid array and so while the smart request is being sent to the two drives, one of the drives doesn't answer at the same speed as the other one. So finally they were convinced to replace it for me.

               

              Eric, Thank you very much! Your information helped me explain the situation to the computer technicians much better. I was persistent and I figure even they learned something new. Thanks a lot!

              • 4. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                Editor Naama Level 1

                Bad news.

                 

                The disks were replaced and the problem returned. I have no idea what to do.

                 

                Problem summary:

                It's a smart event. It appears on the Intel Rapid Storage Technology program. It says that the disks are at risk.Both disks have a warning sign. the raid volume of the two disks has a green check mark. When I reset disk to normal, it gets back to a normal state, having the green check mark. But then, the problem returns at some point.

                 

                Does anyone know what could be wrong?

                • 5. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                  Harm Millaard Level 7

                  Exchange both disks again, hopefully under warranty. You probably have hit a bad bunch of these disks.

                  • 6. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                    Editor Naama Level 1

                    Hi Harm and thank you for your reply.

                     

                     

                    You may be right but It also seems unlikely that it's the disks again.

                     

                    Last time the computer shop checked the disks with a program and said they were fine. However they did replace the disks due to my persistence. One time they lied about it according to the serial number and now they replaced both disks. It took them two months! I don't want my computer to be away for that long again, I need it for my editing. I'll call them if I find no other solution (they probably hate me by now...) But before I do that, I want to be sure that the problem is with the disks.

                     

                    I also filled a ticket at Gigabyte - the motherboard manufacturer. I hope they answer me.

                     

                     

                    Could there be something wrong with the bios settings? Or the raid settings? Or could it be the power settings?

                     

                     

                    I'm trying to stay optimistic 

                     

                    Some times technology frustrates you more than it helps you.

                    • 7. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                      Harm Millaard Level 7

                      I have experienced similar situations.

                       

                      Situation 1: A Dell server with 6 disks (can't remember the brand or model) in a raid5 on a Cerc controller. I had two troublesome disks, number 2 and 5 that gave intermittent problems, causing a degraded raid, that needed rebuilding. Dell finally agreed to exchange them for new disks and the problem has never returned.

                       

                      Situation 2: A Thecus NAS with 7 Seagate 1.5 TB 7200.11 disks in raid5 and the same problem, intermittent failures on various disks. Returned to the supplier and after replacing 5 of the 7 disks the problems were over. But the delay was a disaster.

                       

                      Situation 3:  I had one disk (but which one?) in a raid0 give the exact same problems like yours. Went to the supplier and explained the issue. They tested the individual disks and no problem. However in raid0 they gave problems, so I convinced them that possibly timing issues, that do not show up with individual disks, caused the problems in a raid0, so they agreed to exchange both disks and the problem was solved. It took about one hour waiting for the test and the replacements.

                       

                      Situation 4: I had one disk in my large 12 disk array showing increasing problems. The disk was pretty easy to identify, unmounted, and exchanged for a new disk, let the array rebuild and the problem was solved.

                       

                      Suggestion: Explain that it is useless to test individual disks when the problem only occurs in raid0. Since it is hard to identify which of the disks is causing the problems, they should exchange both disks for new ones from the same batch, so there is no difference in the firmware and you are willing to wait for them to get them from the back. Couple of minutes at most.

                      • 8. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                        JEShort01 Level 4

                        Editor Naama,

                         

                        What drives (exact model, specs, etc) are you using for the on-board RAID 0? There are some drives that unfortunately do not play very well with Intel's very popular on-board RAID 0 implementation - most large WD Greens, many variants of the WD Raptors, and some Velociraptor models are as I recall from a year back as some notable examples that were upsetting a lot of users doing on-board Intel RAID 0.

                         

                        I few years back I had what seems to be a very similar ICH10 RAID 0 warning error situation to yours...

                         

                        Everything worked OK, I never lost any data, but the Intel RAID tool was reporting a drive warning; at the time, I was using 2x74GB early gen. 10k Raptors. I did a backup image and restored my OS/programs to a 2x1TB WD black array; the speed was better and subsequent checking using of SMART did reveal one of the Raptors was indeed failing and was replaced on "warranty". I then read that lots of users were having bad luck with the Raptor/Intel combo, so I left that system with the WD Blacks for the remainder of it's life.

                         

                        Since ICH10 does not allow you to "view" the full SMART data (i.e. using SMARTMON tools works for single drives on a ICH10), you need to break the RAID just to access the full history of what's going on inside of each drive; I do love hardware RAID cards BTW, as they do not share this limitation .

                         

                        Good luck, as this sounds very frustrating for a new system!

                         

                        Jim

                        • 9. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                          Editor Naama Level 1

                          Jim and Harm, thank you for your reply!

                           

                          I wrote Gigabyte, the MOBO manufacturer and they replied that the problem is either with the HDD or with the Raid0 configuration.

                          I didn't configure the Raid0, the computer shop did. Warranting the disks is also through them. I might have to call them again.

                           

                          Harm,

                           

                          Thanks for your empathy and story sharing. It definitely is a pain. It may be the disks. The first time the shop technician checked the disks, he said that the problem could be due to different timings of the disks. But now, both of them show an "at risk" status.

                           

                          Jim,

                           

                          The disks I'm using are: Samsung  SATA2 F3 1TB 32MB 7200RPM

                          I've chosen them after a lot of research of benchmarks...

                          I also did not lose any data yet. It seems to work fine. I'm not sure about the speed, I'll check the forum benchmark when I'll have some time. Anyway as a policy, I only have backed up data on the raid 0.

                           

                          If I break up the raid, can I use that tool SMARTMON to find out what the problem is?

                           

                          At this point, I don't mind investing in a raid controller if that will solve my problem. Do you think that could be a solution?

                           

                          Thanks again to both of you for your answers! It definitely helps in directing me towards the solution and makes me feel that I'm not alone facing this "evil" technology

                          • 10. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                            JEShort01 Level 4

                            I'm not sure if "breaking the RAID" and running SMARTMONTOOLS on your drives will solve the problem, but it may provide some more definitive information regarding the health of your drives. That is what I would do if I were in your shoes right now.

                             

                            Regarding, "will a hardware card help?", I cannot say that it would not change things, but it shouldn't be required.

                             

                            Jim

                            • 11. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                              Editor Naama Level 1

                              Jim,

                               

                              I might try your idea.

                              Should I break the raid by "delete volume" in the "Intel Rapid storage technology"?

                               

                              I found smartmontools here:

                              Is that the one?

                              http://sourceforge.net/projects/smartmontools/

                               

                               

                              Thanks again for all your help!

                               

                              Naama

                              • 12. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                JEShort01 Level 4

                                Wow, great news!!!

                                 

                                I was looking to see where I downloaded it from by Googling SMARTMONTOOLS and found a wiki note that indicates a new experimental version of SMARTMONTOOLS that supports disks behind Intel Matrix RAID driver on Windows. I don't know much about this, but it sounds like something you should check out:

                                 

                                http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/smartmontools/wiki

                                 

                                You original question may be moot if the new experimental SMARTMONTOOLS works to "see through" your Intel RAID driver, but in case it does not, I suppose you could break the RAID as you mention - after backing up anything on it! I never did this myself as I used a completely separate PC and used a DOS boot disk to check each drive separately. It was over a year ago, so I don't remember the details. Possibly some "tech" could chime it with a lot more details regarding how one would best go about this.

                                 

                                Regards,

                                 

                                Jim

                                • 13. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                  Editor Naama Level 1

                                  Thanks for the update Jim!

                                   

                                  I'm scared of using the smartmontool's test program. It has warnings of system lock ups for some other systems. Although it has no warnings for windows, I don't want to be the first one reporting damage.

                                   

                                  I wonder if there's an already tested program that can check an Intel Raid.

                                   

                                  I'll keep checking and updating on this matter.

                                  • 15. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                    Editor Naama Level 1

                                    Hi Eric,

                                     

                                    Thanks for that link. Seems like it has really good programs.

                                     

                                    I used Crystal Disk Mark program. I attached a picture of the results.

                                     

                                    Crystal Disk Info lists all of my disks except for the raid. It just won't see it.

                                     

                                    I also tried to verify the disk in "Intel Rapid Storage Technology" and no errors were found.

                                     

                                    Gigabyte suggested to rebuild the raid.

                                    • 16. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                      Editor Naama Level 1

                                      CrystalDiskInfo doesn't support Raid:

                                      http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalDiskInfo/manual-en/Faq.html

                                       

                                      Checking my Window's event log. Hoping to find clues there...

                                      • 17. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                        Editor Naama Level 1

                                        I may have solved the problem. I'm not sure yet. Unless I report back in a week to a month from now that the problem has returned.

                                         

                                        I went through my windows event log searching keywords and googled the results. The word smart led me to Event ID 7030 which led me to these links:

                                         

                                        http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/event-id-7030-basic-service-ope rations.aspx

                                         

                                        http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/FileUpload/Multimedia/2/file/105/172.htm

                                         

                                        According to the first link you should go to:

                                         

                                        Control panel-> administrative tools -> services -> (right click) smart time lock ->properties -> log on (tab) ->uncheck Allow services to interact with desk

                                         

                                        Eric, thanks for that link again. Although Crystal Disk Info couldn't help me find my problem directly, it did direct me towards the solution. When I looked at it's menu I found the event log and it gave me the idea of looking there.

                                         

                                        Thank you everyone for all of your efforts!

                                         

                                        I'm still not 100% sure of the solution but I really hope that's it and that the problem won't return. I'm posting this as it may help other frustrated users. Seems like it's something that can happen on a Gigabyte mother board.

                                         

                                        Anyway, It seems like a generally good idea to search the event log for solutions.

                                         

                                        So I may have replaced the hard disks for no reason. But at least I'm experimenting and becoming half of a computer technician in addition to being a video editor.

                                        • 18. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                          ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                          Well the problem is Naama the link you show just disables the application from interacting with the desktop so you may have just turned off the warning the controller is sending to the Rapid Storage Manager. That does not stop the warning at the controller level though which is generated when the drives fail 1 or more of the smart requests. It just depends on which smart request it failed as to how likely the drive is to fail. It very well may be the drives are just not initializing in the time the controller expects them to which means your PSU is not providing enough power. Do you by chance have the system connected to a UPS.

                                           

                                          Eric

                                          ADK

                                          • 19. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                            Editor Naama Level 1

                                            Yes you are right. But I'm only disabling the interaction of the "Smart time lock" (see second link) which is an application that locks the computer. So I don't think it's supposed to turn off other smart warnings If I understand correctly. I thought maybe it creates the problem because it locks something and then the raid array has some problem. Maybe you're right though, I'm really not sure.

                                             

                                            I thought of checking that application through the program Smart6 but I'm first waiting to see if the change I've made solves the problem.

                                             

                                            I am using a UPS. Do you think it might not provide enough power? Could that cause the smart event?

                                            • 20. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                              ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                              I need the model number of your UPS and what PSU the system has.

                                               

                                              Eric

                                              ADK

                                              • 21. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                Editor Naama Level 1

                                                PSU: SEASONIC S12II 620W BRONZE

                                                 

                                                UPS model number: PRV650

                                                 

                                                 

                                                What do you think about disabling the interaction of the "smart time lock" feature?

                                                 

                                                It seems like a feature for limiting the computer usage for kids. Not a necessity in a computer.

                                                • 22. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                  ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                  That will definitely not have enough Watts/load capacity for the 620W PSU even if that is the only item plugged into it since it's likely a 390W unit and that is likely why the drives are not initializing in time. Who is the manufacturer for the UPS btw since I can't find a specific one for that model number. You need a UPS with a Watts rating equal to or greater than every item plugged into it since for the first 5 to 10 seconds your system is pulling full power as it initializes the PSU and circuits. If the system does not initialize correctly then the problems will be all over the place including drives not initializing in time. So in the case of your system with the 620W PSU and a monitor, that would be a 700W UPS bare minimum. Most UPS units are Line Interactive UPS designs which means they have a transformer on the main circuit. This transformer will only handle a load of around what the UPS is rated to. This is the biggest mistake most people are making today on powering their workstations. The days of old Standby UPS units that just had a pass through circuit while power coming in is fine are gone. Line Interactive units use a Transformer to keep the power coming in at a certain range. That is how they provide the power protection and clean power from browning or surging. However this transformer limits the load they can handle and people are tearing their systems up plugging high powered PSU's into 400W UPS units. Plug the system into the wall and just get a surge protection unit or get a much higher UPS. Ignore the VA rating and look for the Watts rating.

                                                   

                                                  Eric

                                                  ADK

                                                  • 23. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                    Editor Naama Level 1

                                                    Eric,

                                                     

                                                    My solution didn't work. The Smart event returned today. So now I'm trying your suggestion. I plugged the computer straight to the wall.

                                                     

                                                    I'll update on this matter. Thanks for giving me advice.

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    In the event log I found these events with today's date:

                                                     

                                                    Event ID 11: The driver detected a controller error on \device\harddisk5\DR5

                                                     

                                                    Event ID 0: Disk on port 4: at risk

                                                    IAStorDataMgrSvc

                                                    Product Name: Microsoft .net Framework

                                                    • 24. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                      Editor Naama Level 1

                                                      Well unfortunately it's not the UPS either. I've plugged the computer without the UPS but the smart event returned.

                                                      • 25. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                        ECBowen Most Valuable Participant

                                                        Either way that UPS is to small for that system. The PSU could already have some issues. I suggest trying a different PSU at this point.

                                                         

                                                        Eric

                                                        ADK

                                                        • 26. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                          hapunen Level 1

                                                          Hello people,

                                                           

                                                          I see the last post in here is at 12-july-2011, wonder the solution is found, cuz i encountered this problem recentley. THe Intel Rapid Storage says "your computer is reporting one or more events, and data may be at risk." I really dont know what to do.

                                                           

                                                          My lattop : acer aspire 5750g

                                                          ram: 4GM

                                                          hard disk (at risk) : toshiba mk6465gsx

                                                          Intel rapid storage technology 10.0.0.1046

                                                          • 27. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                            Editor Naama Level 1

                                                            Hello,

                                                             

                                                            Although the post is marked as answered, the problem isn't solved at all. I wish you could mark a post as unanswered when you realize it isn't answered. I couldn't find a solution and I'm planning to disassemble the raid settings and use both HD's as 2 individual drives. I just have to first learn how to do that. My final conclusion is either you create a proper raid that secures your data with a few hard disks and a controller or it's not really worth the trouble.

                                                             

                                                            You can try the suggestions  written above here. They didn't work in my case but they might work for you.

                                                             

                                                             

                                                            Good luck!

                                                            • 28. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                              hapunen Level 1

                                                              thanks naama, but my lattop gets really slow to start up when i turn it on and i can see it gets a bit slower then before after the problem appeared. Anyway, you think it is a good idea to send it back to the factory to fix it? cuz my lattop's motherboard has some problem last few months and i send it to the acer factory to fix it, not sure if i should do the same thing this time

                                                              • 29. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                                Editor Naama Level 1

                                                                I think it might be a good idea to send it if you still have warranty. It might be a hardware problem.

                                                                • 30. Re: Disk at risk warning on raid 0
                                                                  hapunen Level 1

                                                                  thx man, i will do that when i get back to my country.