15 Replies Latest reply on Feb 4, 2011 11:09 AM by firetrak

    Best HD Archive file

    firetrak Level 1

      I know this may be a difficult question.

       

      But what do you guys think is the best file to save long term HD fairly uncompressed files in.

       

      As an example, a lot of our stuff comes in  mt2 or HDV so essentially 1440x1080.

       

      I edit in that format then export the saved file a a HD Mpeg2 file @30mbps in 1440x1080 progressive @30fps.

       

      I was just wondering if there was a better format.

       

      All i use the format for it encoding using sorenson 7 into mp4 files and 1 wmv.

       

      And then keeping it for later for DVD's or whatever. But essentially an equivalent edited file to the original.

       

      What formats do you keep yours in?

        • 1. Re: Best HD Archive file
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          HDV on the original tape. Other material, AVCHD, etc. in the original format and data structure WITHOUT any modification on backup disks.

          • 2. Re: Best HD Archive file
            firetrak Level 1

            Ok but when you edit a sequence and need to keep those edited files, how do you keep though, obviously at that stage you cant save it back to the original HDV Tape or original AVCHD file.

             

            So how do you back up your fully edited scenes. Think of this as a library questions, realistically I have way over 20,000 scenes I need to digitally archive, some in SD some in HD. So whats the best method for that.

             

            Tape is out they need to be on a hard drive.

             

            Cheers.

            • 3. Re: Best HD Archive file
              Colin Brougham Level 6

              Check out the Lagarith Lossless Video Codec or the Ut Video Codec if you're using Windows. These use AVI as the container, and are losslessly compressed; they'll be large, but smaller than uncompressed video.

               

              If you're on a Mac, the Avid QuickTime Codecs might be a good choice (they're cross-platform, unlike Lagarith and Ut) or something like PNG compression in a QuickTime container.

               

              With any of these, I suppose there is the risk at some point that they will be unsupported or obsolete, but that's just the way of media formats. It's all about what you're willing to sacrifice: time, space, or quality.

              • 4. Re: Best HD Archive file
                Jim_Simon Level 8

                I generally don't keep my exports after I'm done.  I keap the original media and the project file.  If I ever need a new version, I can rebuild and reexport.

                • 5. Re: Best HD Archive file
                  Keith_Clark Level 2

                  JSS1138 wrote:

                   

                  I generally don't keep my exports after I'm done.  I keap the original media and the project file.  If I ever need a new version, I can rebuild and reexport.

                  same here.

                  • 6. Re: Best HD Archive file
                    davidbeisner2010 Level 3

                    Honestly, I've found the most cost effective way for me is to keep data is simply to purchase another hard drive and expand my RAID whenever I run out of room. Eventually I'll get too big (too many disks) for my internal RAID at which time I'll need to purchase a fast external RAID box with a good controller like Harm uses. Things that I know I'll never need again I'll delete after about a year. Otherwise, I've got everything on my system (duplicated with a 4TB external for backup) that I've ever done.... project files and data files and finished output files for whatever I used. The one exception is about 90 120 HDV tapes worth of material, most of which I've deleted from my data RAID since I still have the tapes here and they're old projects that I don't access anymore. If, for some reason, I need to access them I can simply recapture the tapes, link the files, and have my edit fully in place.

                     

                    Perhaps not the best way to do things, but it's worked for me.

                    • 7. Re: Best HD Archive file
                      Thrill Media Level 2

                      Since I shoot AVCHD,  I use 16Gig cards to shoot and then backup the source footage and all project files to BluRay.  The same day I get home from the shoot, I burn the BluRay backups of the footage and then when the project is complete, I burn a BluRay of all of the project files, assets, etc.

                      • 8. Re: Best HD Archive file
                        firetrak Level 1

                        Thanks guys, i know the physical way of backing up ie to hard drive etc...

                         

                        But what i'd like to know is what codec/format works best for HD video? I have to back it up digitally, cannot keep it on tape.

                        • 9. Re: Best HD Archive file
                          davidbeisner2010 Level 3

                          I think what we were saying is try not to export it out--keep your project and original data files, if you can...

                           

                          However, if you do have to back it up, I'd use as close to a lossless codec as I could. Though I've never used them, I know the guys on here all use Lagarith a lot. If that's too big, perhaps an MPEG export would be the best? Of all the HD exports I've worked with so far, the one that's been the most impressive to me has been AME's preset for Blu-Ray with H.264. Looks stunning played back on my 1080p screen.

                          • 10. Re: Best HD Archive file
                            Colin Brougham Level 6

                            I'll copy and paste my post from above:

                             

                            Check out the Lagarith Lossless Video Codec or the Ut Video Codec if you're using Windows. These use AVI as the container, and are losslessly compressed; they'll be large, but smaller than uncompressed video.

                             

                            If you're on a Mac, the Avid QuickTime Codecs might be a good choice (they're cross-platform, unlike Lagarith and Ut) or something like PNG compression in a QuickTime container.

                             

                            With any of these, I suppose there is the risk at some point that they will be unsupported or obsolete, but that's just the way of media formats. It's all about what you're willing to sacrifice: time, space, or quality.

                             

                            Any of those will allow you to save HD versions of your finished sequence. Regardless of the recommendations to not save finished, flattened versions of your project (I don't agree with that necessarily, myself), you have to do whatever you need/want to do. Those codecs I've listed are some of the one I rely on for this kind of thing.

                            • 11. Re: Best HD Archive file
                              the_wine_snob Level 9

                              Since no one has mentioned them, I'll add Lagarith Lossless, or UT, as CODEC's to explore...

                               

                              Good luck,

                               

                              Hunt

                              • 12. Re: Best HD Archive file
                                Jim_Simon Level 8

                                Look one post up, Bill.

                                • 13. Re: Best HD Archive file
                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                  Jim,

                                   

                                  You must have smilies turned OFF, or you missed the "wink."

                                   

                                  Hunt

                                  1 person found this helpful
                                  • 14. Re: Best HD Archive file
                                    Eric Addison User Group Manager

                                    What about P2 AVC-I 100? Wouldn't that serve as a good codec to use if you don't have access to ProRes or something outside Premiere Pro?

                                    1 person found this helpful
                                    • 15. Re: Best HD Archive file
                                      firetrak Level 1

                                      Thanks guys.

                                       

                                      I have to export all my files as they need to

                                       

                                      a) batch export to various web support codecs like mp4

                                       

                                      b) used later for dvds

                                       

                                      c) used for clip selling

                                       

                                      d) used for future codec upgrades.

                                       

                                      Essentially each week i go through about 60 10-30 min scenes.

                                       

                                      Right now i use mpeg2 to backup, I did try the bluray 1080p h264 route, and yes it looks awesome, but try exporting that 60 times, even on an 8-core intel machine, its just not possible in a week.

                                       

                                      And the lossless formats just wouldn't be possible either considering i use about 400gbs a week in storage as it is.

                                       

                                      guess i'll be sticking with mpeg2, i dont see any other option, as its ratio of speed of export and compression quality is still pretty high.

                                       

                                      If i can get ahead i might look again in h264, but thats just so highly compressed for an archival format.