12 Replies Latest reply on Feb 22, 2011 3:17 PM by oldschoolmx

    ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?

    ManndarrPat Level 1

      Hey Hello frineds,

       

                                      I am curious about one question which often comes in my mind, so I though why not put it on to the forum. its simple

       

                           WHY ADOBE IS NOT DEVELOPING / INTRODUCING A SOFTWARE LIKE 3D MAYA, 3D MAX, BLENDER, CINEMA 4D?

       

      the question comes in my mind because I found the Adobe Photoshop 3D features very creative and productive, and even Adobe illustrator is also giving an artist a great freedom and in Illustrator CS5 the 3D area is more improved than ever.  It will be great if one can make 3D model out of that, and get it into the AE for futher compositing, as I was just watching some node based compositing video on youtube, I learnt that one can directly import a 3D model in that software, so it will be great if one can able to import a complete 3D model as a layer in After Effects for compositing and improving the animation of said imported 3D model according to the tracked footage,  because after effects allows to work in to real 3D space but as you all know we still need to export a 3D object or model in 2D format i.e. .tif, .tga etc. from any 3D app., then compose it with tracked footage and after that Color Correction to get good results.

       

      WITH IMPROVED CS5 APPLICATIONS IT MAY LOOK EASIER FOR ADOBE TO INTRODUCE 3D SOFTWARE AS ADOBE PS, IL n AE HAVE 3D ENGINES...

       

      It is kind of thought, if a person starts growing up in ADOBE environment (culture) from doing anything right from the scratch to all the way upto rendered output (including coding), then why let that person use another 3D application? In addition to this most of the 3D program are difficult to learn, you must need to invest 2-3 years but what if adobe bring a software which is having a combination of 3D features of PS, IL, AE.

       

      And I'd like to mention another important thing, if one who is having command over photoshop (or A GOOD HAND), he may find other application like AE, IL, PrPro easy if he uses that much help and documentation and LOGIC, and I feel at least 5-10 out of 100 pros possessing such ability... It also happens if a you spent 2-3 years in ADOBE environment, with passion to learn new thing which help to get best creative output directly from your mind to PC.

       

      And as far as commercial things are concerns, I feel Adobe will be at a TOP if they introduce such 3D software....  which may help to increase the popularity of PrPro and even market share of adobe in Film Industry.     

       

      (personally I'd love if Adobe develop such 3D program just like they developed 3D lens that could essentially capture a scene from 19 slightly different angles simultaneously)

       

      I don't know why Adobe is not developing and introducing such 3D software, does anybody know?

       

      Thank you for your valuable time for reading this thread

      Any good answer is highly appreciated.....         

      sorry if there is any mistake in the above paras, you can correct me if you feel so....

      Happy Designing, Crafting n Troubleshooting in ADOBE :-)

        • 1. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
          Dave LaRonde Level 6

          ManndarrPat wrote:

           

          I don't know why Adobe is not developing and introducing such 3D software, does anybody know?

           

          I can tell this really bothers you, but I doubt you'll get a straight answer to your question above.  Like all other software developers, Adobe keeps such things under wraps.  If they are working on such a thing -- and I have NO clue if they are -- people in on it are under strict non-disclosure agreements.

           

          You can sum it up like this:  those who tell don't know, and those who know don't tell.

          • 2. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
            Rick Gerard Adobe Community Professional & MVP

            Development of a new application is a very expensive process and must be a business decision based on the projected market share and profitability. It would surprise me if Adobe has not considered this. It would not surprise me that the current economic climate is not conducive to either the acquisition of an existing product or the development of one from scratch.

             

            As for me, I'm a big Blender fan. It's fairly straight forward, easily renders multiple passes for compositing, and is feature rich enough for most things that I need to do. I'm also a big fan of C4D but I only have a Windows version and so I have to drag out my old Windows box and fire it up with I want to use it. The integration between C4D and AE is pretty good, only fair in Blender, but either or should I say any 3D app can be integrated with AE projects once you figure out how they handle the camera data.

            • 3. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
              ManndarrPat Level 1

              yes this may be a confidential matter for ADOBE......or someday ADOBE will directly announce the good news of 3D app. just they did when they showed their prototype 3D camera to the world.........

              • 4. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                ManndarrPat Level 1

                Hi Rick sir,

                 

                Development of a new application is a very expensive process and must be a business decision based on the projected market share and profitability. It would surprise me if Adobe has not considered this. It would not surprise me that the current economic climate is not conducive to either the acquisition of an existing product or the development of one from scratch.

                Yes, its true that any new development is expensive, but PrPro is still having small share in FILM INDUSTRY, so development of new 3D software may help Adobe to increase the share because all the 3D modeling and compositing will get a final render in PrPro for Film/ Video or in Flash for Mobile Devies.

                 

                There is no need for acquiring any existing 3D app.. Adobe don't need to develop a software from very scratch, as Adobe's PS, AE, IL are having very powerful 3D features, so they just need to combined the said 3D engines of softwares to get a good 3D software.

                 

                any 3D app can be suitable for compositing in AE, but the main issue is you need to invest time for learning that 3D software, but what if you can design and animate any object or 3D model with the tool and LOGIC you used in Photoshop or in After Effects or Illustrator 3D?

                • 5. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                  Mylenium Most Valuable Participant
                  Adobe don't need to develop a software from very scratch, as Adobe's PS, AE, IL are having very powerful 3D features, so they just need to combined the said 3D engines of softwares to get a good 3D software.

                   

                  Not really. AI 3D is just a fake dependent on specific AI features and whether PS 3D is anything I'd want in Ae, is very much a matter of debate. Its performance is simply to poor as is its rendering quality. If ever Adobe want to become serious about offline 3D, they either need to start from scratch or indeed need to buy an existing program. Currently they simply haven't anything usable in their portfolio.

                   

                  Mylenium

                  • 6. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                    Dave LaRonde Level 6

                    ManndarrPat wrote:

                     

                    yes this may be a confidential matter for ADOBE......or someday ADOBE will directly announce the good news of 3D app...

                     

                    I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that one, if you want my opinion.  Here's why:

                     

                    Adobe's big guns in the realm of moving pictures are Premiere, AE and Flash, right?  Each of these applications were NOT originally developed by Adobe; they were bought from different software developers.  Three different philosophies of software design... three different approaches to coding.... three different varieties of data structures to shuttle things around within the application... and NO crystal ball so the original developers would know that in the future, these three applications have to play nicely together.

                     

                    Oh, Adobe has some workarounds, and in truth, it's quite an accomplishment that they can work together at all!

                     

                    Now you propose to add a fourth application to this set?  One that might perhaps incorporate Flash's vector-friendliness?  One whose project files can be opened in Premiere and AE?  One that lets you modify Photoshop and Illustrator files within it?

                     

                    That's a whole bunch of integration to do, and a whole lot of recoding to do, and a whole lot of reorganizing to do.  Especially when there are existing -- and competing -- 3D applications that do a creditable job already.

                     

                    If Adobe pulls such a thing off in the next two-three years, you'll be able to knock me over with a feather.

                    • 7. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                      oldschoolmx Level 1

                      I agree with Dave. I don't see it...and frankly don't want it. I'd prefer that Adobe invest in the stability/reliability of it's existing offerings.

                       

                      Once you use a program like Maya or c4d you will quickly realize that it would take a stupendous effort to compete with them. You'll also realize that Adobe's "3d" features haven't been that credible. They are painfully slow, very limiting and not able to produce much usable.

                       

                      Adobe does 2d motion design and interaction well. That's their game.

                      • 8. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                        Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

                        Once you use a program like Maya or c4d you will quickly realize that it would take a stupendous effort to compete with them.

                         

                        I  don't think so. I think that is the biggest misconception people have  about the whole matter. Adobe doesn't need to compete with any of those  programs. Whatever 3D solution they would have to come up with first and  foremost needs to complement their existing tools. You know, Fusion and  Nuke have 3D features that go way beyond what Adobe has to offer in AE  or Photoshop, yet nobody would see them as competing with Maya or other  "serious" 3D programs. And it's really not necessary. Most users would  be overwhelmed by too many modeling tools, extensive character animation  or elaborate simulation. Even in 3D programs many users never use such  stuff - there is millions of visualization artists who never touch  character animation or complex dynamics, even if their program allows  it. You can go far on some textured static models and a decent render  engine. It's just that we don't even have that. PS 3D is simply so  rubbish in its performance, it would take hours to render even the most  basic animation in it. It's definitely a dead end and there is simply no  potential for the future there. It started out wrong and now Adobe are  stuck with it for better or worse....

                         

                        Mylenium

                        • 9. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                          oldschoolmx Level 1

                          Mylenium,

                           

                          I read your post twice and still don't see at what point we disagree.

                           

                          As we both know Adobe has not produced anything viable in the 3d space for nearly 15 years--despite user requests. Invigorator and Continuum offer vastly better options within After Effects...and it makes the notion of marrying PSD's 3d with AE look pretty silly in comparison. Still these two AE add-ons are generally limited to extrusions...3d spinning logos...that kind of thing.

                           

                          The jump from Invigorator or Continuum to a true tool like C4d is a quantum jump and I LOVE the marriage of AE + C4D. Maxon has done an amazing job in allowing artists to build a semi-seamless pipeline with the two tools.

                           

                          I have begun to consider Nuke or Fusion as an addition to Adobe's Master Suite...because I'm curious about what it's like to composite in something approaching truer 3d space instead of 2 1/3 space that After Effects gives us.

                           

                          Maybe Adobe could engineer a 3d program to rival the big boys. I'm dubious. I'd settle for a more Stable After Effects program that at least allowed me to import Collado or OBJ files and move them/ light them...with good render quality.

                           

                          Give AE the ability to properly IMPORT, MOVE/SCALE/ROTATE and RENDER 3d objects from other progras...that's all I'd ask.

                          • 10. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                            Mylenium Most Valuable Participant

                            I think we agree that Adobe has no handle on any "serious" 3D, but it seems we disagree how broad and deep a possible solution needs to be - if and when it ever comes - and which role model from others it needs to adopt. Anyway, not much point to endlessly hypothesize about things we cannot change or influence....

                             

                            Mylenium

                            • 11. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                              BlackCalvus Level 1

                              I wish Adobe had bought Softimage XSI off Avid when it was for sale a couple of years ago...  but too late now..

                              • 12. Re: ADOBE's own 3D program Like Maya or 3D max, blender?
                                oldschoolmx Level 1

                                SoftImage has seemed to fall off the planet. I never seem to hear about them anymore.

                                 

                                More and more it's c4d, maya and max for core everyday 3d applications. Blender would be the fourth, maybe?