25 Replies Latest reply on Mar 1, 2011 9:18 AM by the_wine_snob

    juddering after burning

    cheesysmegs

      Guys, this has probably been covered, but bear with me

       

      using premiere elements 7

      copied vob files from dvd min discs into organizer

      made my video and looks great in sceneline/timeline

      burnt to dvd and the pan shots are all juddery

      is there a solution?

      do i have to convert files from vob, elements

      recognized them and had no trouble getting them

      into the organizer

        • 1. Re: juddering after burning
          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

          Sometimes you do have to convert VOBs to DV-AVIs.

           

          But most of the time you don't, if you choose the proper project preset.

           

          When you start your new Premiere Elements project, make sure you click Settings and select the preset for a Hard Disk Camcorder, standard definition. This will automatically reverse the field dominance of your video so you don't get the "juddering".

           

          This is one of the many tips in my books, by the way -- just in case you want to nip some of the other potential problems in the bud.

          • 2. Re: juddering after burning
            the_wine_snob Level 9

            This could be a Field Reversal issue, as one can get some awful footage, if, for instance, the source material is LFF (Lower Field First), and then they output to an UFF (Upper Field First) format. What is the Field Order of the mini-DVD? A standard DVD is UFF.

             

            For some tips on working with DVD material, this ARTICLE might be useful.

             

            Good luck,

             

            Hunt

            • 3. Re: juddering after burning
              cheesysmegs Level 1

              Thanks Bill, this was recorded and finalised in the camcorder, im a bit of 

              a novice doing this, tried to look at the properties of the vob file but 

              couldn't determine what the field order is, i'll try what the other guy 

              suggested and change the settings before i get media from the disc and do the 

              project again, it took me all day, but now im comfortable with the editing it

              shouldn't take me as long

               

              thanks for your help

               

              Dave

               

               

              In a message dated 26/02/2011 15:51:54 GMT Standard Time, forums@adobe.com 

              writes:

               

              This  could be a Field Reversal issue, as one can get some awful footage,

              if, for  instance, the source material is LFF (Lower Field First), and then

              they output  to an UFF (Upper Field First) format. What is the Field Order of

              the mini-DVD?  A standard DVD is UFF.

               

              For some tips on working with DVD  material, this

              http://forums.adobe.com/message/2117743#2117743 might be  useful.

               

              Good  luck,

               

              Hunt

              • 4. Re: juddering after burning
                Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

                Are you saying your video was shot on a DVD camcorder?

                • 5. Re: juddering after burning
                  cheesysmegs Level 1

                  yes Steve, i had to borrow a sony handycam which records onto mini dvd

                  discs, i gave the handycam back

                  when my camcorder was fixed.

                  so i have 7 little discs that i put in my d drive and elements finds

                  them and puts them in the

                  organiser, as i said it looks great in the timeline and i can do all

                  the editing and it burns

                  abt 4.2 gb of a normal -r dvd disc, but the panned shots are all

                  juddery and sometimes have

                  two images, i only copy the major vob files (not the smaller scenes

                  type files)

                  one thing that did happen was a couple of discs got corrupted and i

                  managed to download a programme

                  that saved the majority of the data, those seem to be ok on the burned

                  disc (they were saved as mpg files)

                  i did try renaming the vobs to mpg when i tried to edit in movie maker,

                  but they came out wierd.

                  would it make sense (as elements seemed to work well with the repaired

                  mpgs, but i dont know

                  if the repair programme also recoded the files and i dont know if just

                  renamed the vobs

                  will have the same effect, shall i still try changing the settings

                  before i start this project again?

                   

                  appreciate your help

                   

                  Dave

                  • 6. Re: juddering after burning
                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                    Dave,

                     

                    While this sounds like a possible Field Reversal issue, there is also the problem of having MPEG-2 material to start with, and then doing a second MPEG-2 compression. This can get to be like a FAX of a FAX, or a JPEG, Saved as another JPEG. Quality (especially off-axis motion, either camera, or subject) goes downhill quickly.

                     

                    Also, what brand of blank media are you using? They are NOT created equal, and some just do a very poor job with playback. Memorex is about as bad as it gets, and Verbatim is about as good as it gets.

                     

                    Good luck,

                     

                    Hunt

                    • 7. Re: juddering after burning
                      Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

                      Bill and I are saying the same thing then.

                       

                      If you use the project settings I described in the first post, all will be well.

                      • 8. Re: juddering after burning
                        cheesysmegs Level 1

                        Thanks guys, its 9am on Sunday morning and i'm starting the project  again!!

                        Wish me luck and i'll let you know how I get on

                         

                        Dave

                         

                         

                        In a message dated 26/02/2011 23:38:14 GMT Standard Time, forums@adobe.com 

                        writes:

                         

                        Bill and  I are saying the same thing then.

                         

                        If you use the project settings  I described in the first post, all will be

                        well.

                        • 9. Re: juddering after burning
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          Dave,

                           

                          My fingers are X'ed for you here in sunny, but cold AZ.

                           

                          Let us know how well the Project goes.

                           

                          Good luck,

                           

                          Hunt

                          • 10. Re: juddering after burning
                            cheesysmegs Level 1

                            Sorry guys, but if anything this finished dvd is worse then the previous 

                            one!!

                             

                            Anyhow, a couple of questions for you

                             

                            1. As the damaged vob files that were recoded to mpg have come out ok, can 

                            my edited vobs be recoded before burning?

                             

                            2. If not and I have to recode all the vob files to mpg, can you recommend 

                            a good programme that will not lose any of the original quality of the  vobs

                             

                            thanks again

                             

                            Dave

                             

                             

                            In a message dated 27/02/2011 15:00:55 GMT Standard Time, forums@adobe.com 

                            writes:

                             

                            Dave,

                             

                            My fingers are X'ed for you here in sunny, but  cold AZ.

                             

                            Let us know how well the Project goes.

                             

                            Good  luck,

                             

                            Hunt

                            • 11. Re: juddering after burning
                              cheesysmegs Level 1

                              One last thing, as vobs are being copied direct from a dvd drive,

                              would it help if i copied them to my desktop first?

                               

                              One day i will get this project finished!!

                               

                              Dave

                               

                               

                              In a message dated 27/02/2011 15:00:55 GMT Standard Time, forums@adobe.com 

                              writes:

                               

                              Dave,

                               

                              My fingers are X'ed for you here in sunny, but  cold AZ.

                               

                              Let us know how well the Project goes.

                               

                              Good  luck,

                               

                              Hunt

                              • 12. Re: juddering after burning
                                Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

                                It makes no difference.

                                 

                                But if you put the DVD in your computer's drive and then use Get Media/From DVD, you'll be sure that the program will import the files as they should be imported into your project.

                                • 13. Re: juddering after burning
                                  cheesysmegs Level 1

                                  Ok, it would seem that i need to convert the vobs to mpg as the damaged

                                  ones

                                  that i passed through the programme videoredo have come out fine

                                   

                                  I wouldnt normally bother by now, but this was recorded on my 50th

                                  birthday in Barbados.

                                   

                                  Thanks for all your help Steve

                                  • 14. Re: juddering after burning
                                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                                    Dave,

                                     

                                    Copying to the HDD, into a folder just for them, is the best method. The Desktop is a special folder, with some differences between it, and other folders. PrE does not do something correctly, when working with the Desktop folder. Just use a regular folder, created just for the VOB's. That is as good as it gets.

                                     

                                    Good luck,

                                     

                                    Hunt

                                    • 15. Re: juddering after burning
                                      cheesysmegs Level 1

                                      Thanks  Bill, like I said i had three damaged discs and used videorecode

                                      and it saved most of the data to a mpg file.

                                       

                                      Now when i finished the project and burnt it, only those files came out

                                      without any pan juddering, so I still have about a week left on my free

                                      trial and plan to do this.

                                       

                                      use videoredo using the quickstream fix to convert vobs to mpg

                                      and place in a folder named Barbados on my desktop

                                       

                                      Then build my dvd (should be able to do it blindfolded by now!!)

                                       

                                      then place it in my dvd and close my eyes!!

                                       

                                      When i start my project what settings should i use?

                                       

                                       

                                      thanks

                                       

                                       

                                      Dave

                                      • 16. Re: juddering after burning
                                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                                        Dave,

                                         

                                        I would locate that Barbados folder somewhere else, perhaps in the Project's folder structure, and keep that special Desktop folder out of the mix. Many have had issues with both PrE and PrPro, when the Desktop folder is in use for Assets, or as a destination folder for Export.

                                         

                                        Good luck, and hope that things work fine.

                                         

                                        Hunt

                                         

                                        PS - Please note that if you are using the trial, the output will be watermarked with "Produced in PrE Trial," or simliar syntax. It will NOT be useful to deliver. Just want to make sure that you are aware of the watermark.

                                        • 17. Re: juddering after burning
                                          cheesysmegs Level 1

                                          Bill, i have a bought Premiere Elements

                                           

                                          i used videorecode to retrieve the damaged

                                          data from three of my discs and used

                                          them in my project (it converted them mpg)

                                           

                                          when i burnt it, those were the only clips that didnt judder

                                          on the pan shots.

                                           

                                          so theoretically if i run all my dvd discs through

                                          viedorecode ( i have about a week left of a fully

                                          functioning trial) then my project should beok

                                           

                                          but before istart my new project, what do i need

                                          to preset it at, as Steve suggested before

                                          Hard Disk Camcorder, standard definition,

                                          i guess that should be different now

                                           

                                          thanks

                                           

                                          Dave

                                          • 18. Re: juddering after burning
                                            the_wine_snob Level 9

                                            Dave,

                                             

                                            With MPEG-2 footage, the Preset would still be just as Steve outlined.

                                             

                                            Good luck,

                                             

                                            Hunt

                                            • 19. Re: juddering after burning
                                              cheesysmegs Level 1

                                              cool, let you guys know how i get on

                                              • 20. Re: juddering after burning
                                                cheesysmegs Level 1

                                                Yeehaa, all done, thanks to Bill and Steve for your imput, for anyone else 

                                                that have

                                                these damned dvd mini discs and want to use the superb Premiere Elements to

                                                edit

                                                heres what i did

                                                 

                                                downloaded videoredo plus

                                                ran each disc through quickstream fix (this will also retrieve as much good

                                                data as possible from any damaged discs) and copied only the vob vts files

                                                to a  separate folder on my desktop, for ease of compiling

                                                in date order, i renamed them 1,2,3 etc and when i got to 9 made them 9a,b 

                                                etc as double figures gets

                                                put to the top of the edit list

                                                ran premiere elements and got media from this folder

                                                did the editing and burnt, job done

                                                 

                                                thanks again guys

                                                 

                                                Dave

                                                 

                                                 

                                                In a message dated 28/02/2011 16:31:13 GMT Standard Time, forums@adobe.com 

                                                writes:

                                                 

                                                Dave,

                                                 

                                                With MPEG-2 footage, the Preset would still be  just as Steve outlined.

                                                 

                                                Good  luck,

                                                 

                                                Hunt

                                                • 21. Re: juddering after burning
                                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                  Great news Dave, and glad that you got it working for you.

                                                   

                                                  As for the file naming, use the computer convention of  01 thru 09, and then 10 thru XX, and the files will line up, as you wish.

                                                   

                                                  Good luck,

                                                   

                                                  Hunt

                                                  • 22. Re: juddering after burning
                                                    cheesysmegs Level 1

                                                    Thanks Bill, one last thing, whats the best method of getting say 3

                                                    copies of my project?

                                                     

                                                    copy the one I have burnt or burn more from the project in Elements?

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    regards

                                                     

                                                     

                                                    Dave

                                                    • 23. Re: juddering after burning
                                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                      Dave,

                                                       

                                                      Do mean "copies" of your completed DVD?

                                                       

                                                      If so, here are some methods, and the one that you choose, might be related to what you have done already:

                                                       

                                                      • Initially, Burn to Folder from PrE, and then use a burning utility, like the free ImgBurn, to do physical burns to disc. With ImgBurn, you can set the quantity that you need, and just fee blank discs into the burner.
                                                      • If you already have a perfect DVD, use ImgBurn, or similar, to Copy DVD. This works great, if you have two burners on your computer, as you just put your "source disc" into one, and the "destination disc," the blank media into the other burner. Again, you can set the quantity.
                                                      • If you only have one burner, you can still Copy DVD, but there will be a little more time involved, as first ImgBurn will Copy the VIDEO_TS folder and all the files to your HDD (you can set where this will happen, and it's best to choose a fast HDD w/ plenty of defragmented free space), and then it will just burn that VIDEO_TS folder to your blank media. This is pretty much the same as if you did the Burn to Folder above, and you can also set the quantity.
                                                      • You can Burn to Disc from PrE, but I believe that you will then be doing the Transcoding again, and again, thus taking quite a bit more time. I do not use PrE for authoring, or burning, so am not positive. In my authoring program, Encore, I set the quantity of disc, and the program Transcodes once, then quickly does the burns, per my settings.

                                                       

                                                      Here are a couple of tips:

                                                       

                                                      • Use only high-quality blank media, like Verbatim, or Taiyo-Yuden. Sony and Falcon Pro get high marks too.
                                                      • In PrE, one does not have the ability to adjust burn speed, like when using ImgBurn, or Encore, and the burn speed is derived from the fastest possible, given the blank media and the burner. For this reason, I would choose slower media. Note: with ImgBurn, you CAN set the burn speed, and I drop that down to about half of the max.
                                                      • Before doing any quantity, first burn to a Rewritable (RW) disc, and test in several different players. Look very closely for mis-spellings, or any glitches. Do NOT use RW for delivery. It is ONLY for testing purposes, and will save creating "coaster" from a Project, with the main character's name mis-spelled on the opening title...

                                                       

                                                      Here is where you can download ImgBurn.

                                                       

                                                      Good luck, and happy authoring,

                                                       

                                                      Hunt

                                                      • 24. Re: juddering after burning
                                                        cheesysmegs Level 1

                                                        Thanks Bill, didnt occur to me to burn outside the programme, thats why

                                                        these

                                                        forums are so helpful

                                                         

                                                        thanks again, you and Steve have been a blessing!!

                                                         

                                                        Dave

                                                        • 25. Re: juddering after burning
                                                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                          Dave,

                                                           

                                                          You are most welcome. One of the beauties of this forum is that one can "think outside the program," where necessary.

                                                           

                                                          I have learned many great tips, like using ClipMate (3rd party Clipboard Extender) to Copy/Paste from one Project to another - I had no idea that there was a way to do that, until I read about it here.

                                                           

                                                          Good luck,

                                                           

                                                          Hunt