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1. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Chris Cox Mar 8, 2011 4:58 PM (in response to tim3308)We're voicing our objections, but you need to let Apple know that their decisions are causing real world customer problems.
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2. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Mar 8, 2011 7:02 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Will do. Thanks, Chris. I was thinking there must be something I am missing on this hiding the library folder. Apparently not! Bad move, Apple.
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3. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Tai Lao Mar 8, 2011 8:59 PM (in response to tim3308)The Apple trend to hide system stuff reared its ugly head for the first time in Spotblight, which hides a great multitude of files from the user. I stayed at Tiger 10.4.11, but with Spotblight and Dashboard permanently disabled. From this exchange I fear Lion will be worse.
Come to think of it, OS X began hiding files from the start. iPhoto likes to hide your images. Why all this Masonic secrecy, Apple?
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4. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
[scott] Mar 9, 2011 6:39 AM (in response to Tai Lao)You can still get to it via the Go command though, right?
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5. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Tai Lao Mar 9, 2011 11:44 PM (in response to [scott])[SW] wrote:
You can still get to it via the Go command though, right?
Sorry, SW, I'm not following you here. "Get to" what?
If you mean Spotblight or Dashboard on my setup, then the answer is no. Both are permanently disabled.
Also, I'm embarrassed to admit I don't quite know what the "Go command" is.
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6. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Tai Lao Mar 9, 2011 11:53 PM (in response to [scott])Oh, if you mean the User Library and voice commands in Lion, then I don't have a clue. I have not had access to Lion yet.
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7. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SG... Mar 10, 2011 12:27 AM (in response to [scott])I haven't tried, but did read that you can get to the folder using the Go command with a modifier. You could also use Terminal to change the visibilty, but I don't see a majority going that route.
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8. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
c.pfaffenbichler Mar 10, 2011 2:49 AM (in response to SG...)You could also use Terminal to change the visibilty,
Could you elaborate on this method?
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9. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
[scott] Mar 10, 2011 4:15 AM (in response to Tai Lao)Tai Lao wrote:
[SW] wrote:
You can still get to it via the Go command though, right?
Sorry, SW, I'm not following you here. "Get to" what?
If you mean Spotblight or Dashboard on my setup, then the answer is no. Both are permanently disabled.
Also, I'm embarrassed to admit I don't quite know what the "Go command" is.
Mac OS hides many folders.... but you can use Go > Go To Folder.. in the finder menu to open the hidden folders. Once you get into a hidden folder, you can then make an alias of anything inside it. So it may be a small thing to navigate to the Application Support folder inside the Hidden Library folder and simply create an alias (or symbolic link) for easy access regularly.
For example... on any Mac OSX version you can use Go > Go To Folder.. then type "/private" (Without quotes) and open the private directory... make an alias of the "etc" or "var" directory inside it.. and then you have double-click access to a directory Apple doesn't want you to normally see. (*WARNING: do not alter contents inside the private, var, or etc directories unless you know what you're doing or have a valid OS backup to restore if needed.)
I've got zero experience with Lion... just speculating based on things I've done with previous OSX installs.
I, personally, have always frowned upon how Apple feels they need to structure directories and force some items upon it's users. I understand in some cases it's meant to be a protective measure. But in other cases there should be options.
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10. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Mar 10, 2011 5:52 AM (in response to c.pfaffenbichler)c.pfaffenbichler wrote:
You could also use Terminal to change the visibilty,
Could you elaborate on this method?
http://macs.about.com/od/tipstricks/qt/hiddenfolder.htm
You can also google for trinket apps that do the same thing if you prefer a button click instead of typing.
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11. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
c.pfaffenbichler Mar 10, 2011 6:26 AM (in response to Marian Driscoll)Thank you.
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12. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Mar 10, 2011 8:04 AM (in response to c.pfaffenbichler)Ironically I first got help from Apple's forum (of course didn't take long w/ the "Lion" word and the warning that your user library - you know - where all your prefs, and where I put photoshop stuff, would go "poof" visibly w/ Lion.)... the thread was removed in short order, but not before I go help:
Command line in terminal was something like(I've slept since then):
chflags nohidden ~/Library
then, I (on my own move) entered "killall Finder" ( I saw in other threads).
And eureka, there was my library, visually. At first I thought the squiggle dash was where I insert my user name, but nope, use the squiggle. Again, this was after I purged Lion from an other partition. I am done playing w/ the iPad OS(what it is -- sorry, not drinking the kool-aid on this updated direction, but I'll comply if the new OS is a speed demon?) on my Mac Pro.
I sorta get Apple's thinking here w/ Lion, but in practical terms -- it goes too far, hiding the library in the user folder - c'mon. How is one supposed to trash prefs for an app in Lion, as an example(w/ out all the monkey business to see it)? Has this been moved to another folder besides user/library? Maybe it was me, but I had zero luck w/ folks talking about revealing it on the "go to folder" command and all of that. I was stymied.
So yes, if apple doesn't change it (don't count on it) updates to apps will figure new places to store user "stuff". I know Painter is even more involved in the user folder in some areas. Something will need to change by Summer...
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13. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
EricDuboisMDD Mar 10, 2011 8:54 AM (in response to tim3308)If Apple is going this way with Leopard for entry-level users, it should add something like MacPilot (http://www.koingosw.com/products/macpilot.php) for more advanced users.
I can imagine Apple tech support calls in the future.
"I'm having problems with [app name]."
"Try deleting the [app name] plist file."
"Where is it?"
"Er..."
At the very least it should have an option similar to the "show package content" to display hidden files in a specific folder. View Options dialog box is probably a good place for that.
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14. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Mar 10, 2011 10:17 AM (in response to EricDuboisMDD)Ha! Right.
Apple Tech support: "What, we're not talking about an iPad?"
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15. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
eclic Mar 29, 2011 11:18 AM (in response to tim3308)I hope they dont go through with this - do they think so many computer users are that stupid? Maybe so but I still dont see a reason to hide the user's library. Anyway I use Pathfinder so if I never use Finder anymore it shoudn't effect me. It is nice to have a choice to work they way you'd like to.
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16. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Jun 24, 2011 9:19 AM (in response to eclic)Any updates on apple's stealth(not a compliment) approach to our own user folder in Lion and how adobe will handle it, as the release is getting rather close now?
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17. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Jeffrey Tranberry Jun 24, 2011 11:19 AM (in response to tim3308)We're working on a Knowledge Base document to show users how to view folder and it's contents.
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18. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Jul 13, 2011 12:43 PM (in response to Jeffrey Tranberry)Good news, Jeffrey. Will you post a link here when the time is right? Thanks.
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19. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Jul 13, 2011 1:54 PM (in response to tim3308)Why is this KB article important to you if you've already got the info as indicated in your post #12?
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20. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SG... Jul 13, 2011 2:21 PM (in response to Marian Driscoll)Hi Marion,
I can see many people balking at having to launch Terminal. Maybe he's looking for a better option, and one that's posted by Adobe? Just because he's skinned the cat one way doesn't mean other ways might be more compelling.
regards,
steve
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21. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Jul 13, 2011 2:35 PM (in response to SG...)True, but I don't see how someone with a pre-release of Lion (as he seems to have indicated) is on the less technical side of things and has an issue with Terminal.
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22. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SaturnV Jul 13, 2011 4:45 PM (in response to Marian Driscoll)Marian Driscoll wrote:
Why is this KB article important to you if you've already got the info as indicated in your post #12?
Post #12 is not really friendly, especially for right-brain creatives who use the Mac because they don't like things like the Unix command line. The other reason is that the steps are too complex. Instead of typing or copying/pasting lines of commands where spelling is critical, just do this: Use a free utility like MacPilot or TinkerTool to switch on "Show Hidden Folders", quit the Finder, make your change, hide the folders and restart Finder. That's it. TinkerTool has another option that adds a Quit command to the Finder which makes this easier, or you can simply use the Force Quit command.
The Terminal, and having to understand it, doesn't need to be involved at all.
tim3308 wrote:
...How is one supposed to trash prefs for an app in Lion, as an example(w/ out all the monkey business to see it)? Has this been moved to another folder besides user/library?
As for deleting .plist files, here's a tip. You can make a alias to a folder even if it's hidden...you can try it right now in Snow Leopard with one of the invisible root folders like /var or /etc. That means, if Apple really is going to hide the Preferences folder in Lion, we should tell Mac users to make an alias to the Preferences folder (after making it visible just once). That way, you'll always be able to get into the Preferences folder even if it's hidden, and you won't have to keep switching folder visibility to get there. Might as well make another alias to user/Library while you're at it.
If you put those aliases in the Dock or Sidebar, you'll have one-click access to those hidden folders -- no utilities or Terminal commands needed.
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23. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
[scott] Jul 13, 2011 6:56 PM (in response to SaturnV)No one ever reads post #9.
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24. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Jul 14, 2011 6:06 AM (in response to SaturnV)SaturnV wrote:
...Post #12 is not really friendly, especially for right-brain creatives who use the Mac because they don't like things like the Unix command line. The other reason is that the steps are too complex. Instead of typing or copying/pasting lines of commands where spelling is critical, just do this: Use a free utility like MacPilot or TinkerTool to switch on "Show Hidden Folders", quit the Finder, make your change, hide the folders and restart Finder. That's it.
That's it?
That seems a whole lot more complicated than typing a single line in Terminal that unhides a specific folder to permamently restore it to how we see it today. The OP appears to be using a pre-release version of Lion so he would not be one of those 'right-brain creatives'. A pre-release user of Lion would be a developer, a member of the technical press, or a lousy pirate.
If you are not a fan of Terminal or OS X's BSD underpinnings then you should probably write a sternly-worded letter to Mr. Jobs to have them take out Terminal and the BSD system in the next OS X release.
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25. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SaturnV Jul 14, 2011 8:05 PM (in response to Marian Driscoll)Marian Driscoll wrote:
That seems a whole lot more complicated than typing a single line in Terminal that unhides a specific folder to permamently restore it to how we see it today. The OP appears to be using a pre-release version of Lion so he would not be one of those 'right-brain creatives'. A pre-release user of Lion would be a developer, a member of the technical press, or a lousy pirate.
We might be focusing on different audiences. If you're talking about the original poster, you could well be right (though it's not true that companies only ask tech-savvy users to be beta testers).
I'm focusing on the discussion later in the thread where Adobe will be incorporating workarounds into a knowledge base article. For that general audience, I don't think Terminal should be the first resort. I'm also wondering if OS X might reset the visibility of the folder at some point during a routine Software Update; the alias would be a safer fix in that case because it will keep working. And with the alias solution you can make any Apple-hidden library folder visible without having to correctly write out its location into a directory path first.
Marian Driscoll wrote:
If you are not a fan of Terminal or OS X's BSD underpinnings then you should probably write a sternly-worded letter to Mr. Jobs to have them take out Terminal and the BSD system in the next OS X release.
Ok now. I do consider Terminal to be an option, and I'll use it when needed. All I was saying is that I don't think Terminal should be the first option in a KB article if there's a less technical way to do it. As a second option for advanced users? Absolutely.
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26. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Tai Lao Jul 14, 2011 8:48 PM (in response to SaturnV)Evidently your interlocutor does not know who you are, Mr. Chávez, nor has he read any of your books and hasn't googled Conrad Chávez.
I'd fully share anyone's dislike of the Terminal (or anything that has to do with command lines), and I'm with SW when it comes to the Home folder, which is utterly superfluous for any of us who do not share the use of our computers with anyone else.
____________
Wo Tai Lao Le
我太老了
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27. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Jul 15, 2011 3:57 AM (in response to SaturnV)SaturnV wrote:
...We might be focusing on different audiences. If you're talking about the original poster...
Who else would I be responding to?
We have already mentioned visual tools to unhide folders. This thread has covered every option. Unless Adobe is going to offer their own visual utility to tweak the system, the KB article will not add anything new to this discussion. There is nothing more to this. An Adobe KB article will only help others that have not accessed this thread.
Ramon, you have no idea of what is or what is not evident. If you weren't so fearful of Terminal you could fix that Home folder to your liking.
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28. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Tai Lao Jul 15, 2011 4:31 AM (in response to Marian Driscoll)Jim Oblak, I'm not afraid of anything. Personal preferences have nothing to do with fear. I have never ridden a bicycle in my life, and that's not because I'm afraid of bikes, it's because I prefer horses and automobiles. Also, I have no use for the Home folder or anything like it.
"Evident" is what is self evident, i.e., that which evidences itself by itself.
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29. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
Marian Driscoll Jul 15, 2011 6:08 AM (in response to Tai Lao)Ramón G Castañeda wrote:
....the Home folder, which is utterly superfluous for any of us who do not share the use of our computers with anyone else.If you are eternally advocating permission repair, then it seems evident that you are not the only user on that computer. Apple has hidden these system users from you, just as it is hiding folders in Lion. If you don't like Mac OS X, you have the option to go elsewhere.
It should be evident to you that it is not too late to keep this forum a decent place without personal issues and insane assumptions. Your second identity had done fairly well up to this discussion.
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30. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
tim3308 Jul 19, 2011 4:02 PM (in response to tim3308)Well, Lion hits the wild tomorrow. Has the white paper from adobe been released? Thanks.
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31. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SG... Jul 19, 2011 4:49 PM (in response to tim3308)Hi,
We'll publish the kb document when 10.7 is officially released. We'll post the link to the document in this thread.
regards,
steve
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33. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
SG... Jul 20, 2011 7:48 AM (in response to tim3308)Hi,
Here's the link to the KB doc:
http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/909/cpsid_90947.html
With the first 2 methods, we didn't include the idea of using an alias of the directory for subsequent navigation. However, I think that's what's needed for accessing those presets when using Open/Save dialogs during Load/Save. I'll see about updating it.
regards,
steve
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34. Re: OSX Lion and brush storage...
David Dobish Jul 20, 2011 11:33 AM (in response to tim3308)Here is another more general KB that describes Known Lion Issues.






