28 Replies Latest reply on Jun 8, 2011 7:14 PM by expert_not

    Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?

    expert_not

      I'm new to Adobe Premiere Elements 9.  I have a file that I imported.  In QuickTime 7 Pro I had pieced together video/audio clips, but then I wanted to make a movie for a gift so I bought PRE 9.  Anyway, in PRE I clipped each snippet of video/audio so I could add transitions between them.  Now, in the Timeline window, I can see both the audio and video pieces, but when I play it, only the video plays - no audio.  What did I do??  I've check all the volume controls to make sure they are not muted and the volume is at a level I could hear.  I checked the connections and am able to play/hear music on you tube.  Thanks for your help.

        • 1. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          Welcome to the forum.

           

          Can you hear any Audio in PrE, or just from this Project?

           

          If I read correctly, you combined Audio & Video in QT, and output to a MOV, which was then Imported and edited in PrE. Is that correct?

           

          If so, at any point, did you hear the Audio in PrE?

           

          What are the Audio specs. in that MOV file?

           

          This is a general ARTICLE on various Audio issues. Check all of those suggestions, and report the resluts, along with the answers to the questions above, please.

           

          Good luck,

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
            expert_not Level 1

            Thank you!

             

            Yes, I can hear audio - I just brought in another video file (.mt2s) and was able to play and hear it.

             

            Yes, I imported it as .MOV.

             

            Yes, I was able to play/hear it after importing.  I just noticed that I couldn't hear anything after splitting it up.  but, not sure if that's when it happened or if the soulnd was gone before splitting.

             

            How do I find the audio specs?  In the task window - the balance and volume are both at normal levels.

             

            Also, I did add a transition to the beginning and between the first and second clips.  Just trying to think of anything that I may have touched that turned to sound off.

             

            I read the article - checked the suggestions, but since I can hear other clips, I know its not like a connection or hardware issue.

             

            When I play the original project file (that isn't split up) in the preview window there is also no sound.

             

            ??

             

            Chris

             

            Message was edited by: expert_not

            • 3. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
              the_wine_snob Level 9

              Chris,

               

              Thank you for all of that info. It rules out a lot of things quickly.

               

              We now know that it is not likely a computer, or PrE setting, and that the system and PrE can play Audio, so we can now focus on your particular Clips. We also know that they did work originally, so the likely cause is something done in the editing process.

               

              Probably the easiest test to perfrom first, will be to open the Audio Mixer (Window>Audio Mixer), so that you can see the VU Meters (in reality, they are not officially VU Meters, but that term gets used enough, that I'll just use it here ). Play your Timeline, watch the VU Meters. They will be arranged from Audio Track 1 to how ever many Audio Tracks you have. Assuming that your Audio is on Audio Track 1, that would be the meter to watch. You should see green "bars" moving up and down, and they should stop just short of turning yellow, with maybe a tiny bit of yellow at the top. When played back, do the green bars go up to about -6 dB. Do the green bars move from -oo dB to somewhere near -6 dB?

               

              Next, repeat, but look to the right of the VU Meter, just left of the dB scale. There is a little "slider handle." What is that set to? When you playback the Timeline, does it move?

               

              For getting the Audio info, if your Audio is muxed (Multiplexed, i.e. combined Audio & Video), just look in the Project Panel, and Rt-Click on the Clip. Go to Properties in the drop-down menu, and you will see all of the Properties of the Clip, including the specs. of the Audio. It should be something like:

               

               

              • Source Audio Format 48KHz - 16-bit Stereo
              • Project Audio Format 48KHz - 32-bit floating point Stereo

               

               

              Do you see some other numbers and descriptions?

               

              Let us know how those tests proceed, please.

               

              Thanks, and good luck,

               

              Hunt

               

              PS - while looking at the Audio Mixer, check that the Mute checkbox is empty - think you have done that already, but just check it out.

              • 4. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                Also, while testing, Rt-click on your Clip in the Timeline. Look down that menu, and make sure that Enable has a checkmark beside it.

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                  expert_not Level 1

                  Hi Hunt,

                   

                  I opened the audio mixer and played the Timeline and there was no movement on the mixer, no green or yellow bars on any track.

                   

                  The slider handle is set to '0' and doesn't move.

                   

                  I clicked 'show properties' and in the Task window, the various components appeared one of them being Volume and Balance, but I couldn't find anywhere something that showed Source Audio Format or Project Audio Format.

                   

                  I did check the Mute box is not checked.

                   

                  Also, Enabled is checked.

                   

                  I remembered something else I did.  After I imported the file, I was trying to figure out how to get it into a frame by frame view in the Sceneline so I 'rendered' it.  It took a while, didn't do what I was hoping but I didn't think it did any harm.

                   

                  Still without sound.

                   

                  Chris

                  • 6. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                    the_wine_snob Level 9

                    Chris,

                     

                    To get the Audio (and Video) Properties, you should be able to go to the Project Panel, and then Right-click to get the drop-down with Properties available in the menu. The Properties should give you a dialog box, with all of the Properties for that file.

                     

                    The Rendering of the Timeline should not have any effect, so long as you let it complete. Render will do so for both Audio and Video, and create proxy files, that PrE will use for playback only.

                     

                    No movement in the VU Meters indicates that for some reason, there is no Audio Signal being fed from the Timeline.

                     

                    Having the slider at 0 dB and not moving is about what you want. You do mean 0 dB and -oo dB, don't you?

                     

                    Now, go to the Timeline, and examine the Audio portion of those Clips. There will be an orange-yellow line running through it, and if you look at the Clip's name, you should see "Clip Volume" after the name.  Note: you might need to do a horizontal view zoom, to read the name, and the Effect Volume at the top of the Clip.

                     

                    Where is that orange-yellow line in the vertical space of the Clip? Is it near the top of the Clip, or near the bottom?

                     

                    Also, click on one of the Clips to Select it. Open the Effects Tab, and look at the bottom-left (unless Adobe moved it), where you will see Edit Effects. Click that, to open the Effects Control Panel for that Clip. You will see several Fixed Effects, like Motion and Opacity for the Video portion, and Volume for the Audio stream. Volume will have a little triangle on the left of the name. Click that, to expand the settings for Volume. What is that set to?

                     

                    Last, go back to the Timeline, and Right-click on one of the Clips. Look at Audio Gain, and click on it in the menu, to see the Gain setting. What is that set to?

                     

                    Let us know the settings that you get from each of those tests, please.

                     

                    Good luck,

                     

                    Hunt

                    • 7. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                      expert_not Level 1

                      Hi again (Thank you for your patience),

                       

                      I found the properties - I guess I thought the Project Panel was the area where the Timeline resides.  I right clicked on the file in the Organization tab window and was able to get the properties:

                      properties.jpg

                      "You do mean 0 dB and -oo dB, don't you?" Yes.

                       

                      The orange/yellow line running through the Timeline clips is higher (through the video portion)

                      The volume - is set at about 8 (1 being the lowest and 10 being the highest)

                      Audio Gain - 0 db and Normalize

                       

                      I think that answers all your questions.

                       

                      Chris

                      • 8. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                        Other than having a mono Audio stream, which is not a problem, or should not be, the Properties look as expected.

                         

                        Now, with the mono, go back and look at the Audio Mixer, and at the Balance knob. Is it set to the middle? Can you post a screen-cap of the Audio Mixer?

                         

                        In the Effects Control Panel, accessed by Edit Effects button at the bottom of the Effects Tab, what do you see, when you twirl open the Volume Effect? A screen-cap of that would be good too.

                         

                        Also, please attach a screen-cap of the Timeline, with enough horizontal zoom to see a couple of the Clips.

                         

                        Good luck, and we have eliminated a bunch of possibilities, thanks to your hard work.

                         

                        Hunt

                        • 9. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          Also, back in the Timeline, choose one of the Clips, and Alt+click on the Audio portion to temprarily unlink it from the Video. Now, Right-click on that, and choose Show Clip Keyframes. You should then see Balance and Volume. If you hover over Volume, you will get a flyout menu. There will be two options: Bypass and Clip Volume. Is Clip Volume checked, and not Bypass?

                           

                          Good luck,

                           

                          Hunt

                          • 10. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                            expert_not Level 1

                            Hello

                             

                            Looks like the balance is right in the middle:

                            audio mixer.jpg

                            • 11. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                              expert_not Level 1

                              Here's a screen-cap of the Timeline and Effects Volume:

                              Edit Effects Volume.jpg

                              • 12. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                the_wine_snob Level 9

                                Is your Audio Track 1 closed? One can close up a Track in PrPro, but was unaware of that being possible in PrE. It appears that there is no Waveform Display in the Audio Clips, if the Track is closed, the Waveform Display might not show.

                                 

                                There is no "Clip Volume" showing after the Audio File Name.

                                 

                                As you are working from QT Reference files, I wonder if something casued the Audio to become unlinked from the "master" Clip, and from the CFA and PEK files.

                                 

                                Good luck,

                                 

                                Hunt

                                • 13. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                  expert_not Level 1

                                  I don't see that Clip volume is checked, but there is a check box for Bypass that is not checked:

                                  show clip key frames.jpg

                                  • 14. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                    expert_not Level 1

                                    The Audio Track 1 is not muted - how can I tell if it is closed and how do I open it if it is closed?

                                    • 15. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                      Look at the Audio Track's Header, and click on the little arrowhead to expand it. It is collapsed now.

                                       

                                      Note how the Clip's Name appears in this screen-cap, from PrE4.0:

                                       

                                      PrE_Tracks_01.png

                                       

                                      When you expand the Audio Track, does the Clip Name show, similar to mine?

                                       

                                      Good luck,

                                       

                                      Hunt

                                      • 16. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                        the_wine_snob Level 9

                                        When you have expanded that Audio Track, look to the far right of the Track Header, and toggle the Display Mode through, until you see the Waveform Display, and any Clip Keyframes.

                                         

                                        Good luck,

                                         

                                        Hunt

                                        • 17. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                          expert_not Level 1

                                          Yes, the clip name shows and I click on the Volume arrow > Volume and the 'Clip Volume' is checked.

                                          • 18. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                            the_wine_snob Level 9

                                            OK, scratch one thought.

                                             

                                            Do you then see the Waveform Display, when you expand the Audio Track?

                                             

                                            Is that orange-yellow line (the Volume "rubberband") up near the top of the Clip(s)?

                                             

                                            Good luck,

                                             

                                            Hunt

                                            • 19. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                              expert_not Level 1

                                              No, I don't see the waveform display.  I think this screen cap will show what i see when the Audio is expanded.Audio Timeline open.jpg

                                              If the audio track somehow separated from the video, can I re-attach it?

                                               

                                              Chris

                                              • 20. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                expert_not Level 1

                                                Hi,

                                                 

                                                You know, I don't see how to toggle through the display mode.  It's right in the Timeline window on the header of the audio track where the name displays?  Or is it outside of the window?  Sorry, just don't see it.

                                                 

                                                 

                                                Chris

                                                • 21. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                  expert_not Level 1

                                                  So, I thought I would just test a new project.  So I am creating a new project with a different video clip.  The first window is captured below.  Is the 'Project settings' correct?  Because it's probably how I began my problem project.

                                                  Test new project.jpg

                                                  • 22. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                    expert_not Level 1

                                                    Ok, so I started a new project and re-imported the video to PrE, dragged the video to the Project window and no sound.  It makes me wonder if I ever had sound.  But, I swear I did.

                                                    • 23. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                      Looking back up to Reply # 7, it appears that the Frame Size is not that of AVCHD-Lite, which would be 1440 x 720, IIRC.

                                                       

                                                      Back to your "flatline" Waveform Display, it appears that your edited Clips have become unlinked from both the CFA and PEK files.

                                                       

                                                      The CFA files are the Conformed Audio files, created when one Imports a Clip with Audio into a Project. This Conforming creates a 32-bit floating-point WAV file for editing. The process also creates the PEK files, which allow PrE to display the Waveform. Those two files will be created in the Media Cache folder inside what PrE refers to as the Scratch Disks, and located where the user directs the program to place them. After they have been created, they are then linked to their respective original Clips, in the PREL (Project) file.

                                                       

                                                      Usually, if those links get broken, PrE will just regenerate the CFA and PEK files, but that is not happening to you, and you are also not getting any error messages, asking for file locations, so something is happening.

                                                       

                                                      Unfortunately, you are going to have to help me a bit to try this next step, if we can. I do not have PrE 9, so do not know if it has added a little feature from PrPro. You will have to poke around a bit, or maybe others will jump in and tell us that the feature has NOT been added to PrE 9. In PrPro, one can go to the Project Panel, Right-click on a Clip, and then choose to "Offline Media." There, a dialog box pops up, asking if the user wants to "Unlink the Media, or Unlink and Remove from the Hard Drive." In our case, we would ONLY want to Unlink in the Project. Again, in PrPro, one would then repeat the Right-click, and choose "Link Media," reestablishing the link. This would cause the program to regenerate new CFA and PEK files, and there would be a little progress bar at the lower-right of the program's GUI. One would not touch the computer, until that progress bar disappears. What I just do not know, and cannot test, is whether PrE 9 has added that Offline Media feature. [Editing Offline is something more often done in a pro environment.]

                                                       

                                                      There is another similar feature in PrPro, called Match Frame. It does something similar to the Offline Media. I feel very certain, that PrE (no version) has Match Frame, so we would most probably just be wasting our time, looking for it.

                                                       

                                                      For some more background on Conforming and the PEK file generation, see this ARTICLE.

                                                       

                                                      Good luck, and let me know about the Offline Media in PrE 9. There is a "manual way" to do it, but if the feature has been added, it solves a lot of potential issues and saves some time.

                                                       

                                                      Hunt

                                                      • 24. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                        expert_not Level 1

                                                        Hello,

                                                         

                                                        When I select a clip and right click - one option in the menu is to 'Unlink Audio and Video'.  I clicked that and then right clicked the clip again to get the menu and then there was an option to 'Link Audio and Video'.  There we no 'processing' bar that I could see and there is still a 'flat line'. The only change I could see is when it was unlinked, the [V] and [A] disappeared from the header name.

                                                         

                                                        I wonder when the file was initally brought in, there was no conforming process.  Could I re-import the file and force it to conform?  Then maybe unlink and relink?

                                                         

                                                        Chris

                                                         

                                                        Message was edited by: expert_not

                                                        • 25. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                          Chris,

                                                           

                                                          That is not quite the same thing as Offlining the Media, and then Relinking it. I am guessing that the semi-automatic Offllining is just not a feature in PrE 9.

                                                           

                                                          OK, let's look at the manual way. Read through these steps a few times, and do not deviate from them.

                                                           

                                                          • Open your Project, and do a Save_As, altering the name such that you can easily tell which Project you have loaded, at any one time. I would do something like this: [Project Name]_TEST, so you will be sure that you are working with the "TEST" version of the Project. Do NOT use your original Project.
                                                          • Exit PrElements
                                                          • Now, create a New Folder, and name it something that you will easily recognize, then navigate to the location of your Video files, and Move those to the New Folder.
                                                          • Launch PrE, and choose that TEST Project
                                                          • When it Opens, you should get a dialog box, asking "Where is file _____.MOV?"
                                                          • Here choose Offline All (or similar syntax)
                                                          • The Project should now Open, but with the Media Offline placeholder in the place of those files
                                                          • Do another Save_As, and call this one [Project Name]_TEST_02 (in case you have to go back to TEST
                                                          • Exit PrE
                                                          • Read the material added at the bottom of this post for Replacing an Offline File
                                                          • Launch PrE, and choose that TEST_02 Project, and follow those steps. Note: those steps are for PrE 4.0, so that is why we have done the two Save_As operations. I would suggest that you go to PrE 9's Help File, and Search for "offline," without the " marks. Compare what I have below, with the Help Files for PrE9. We want to make sure that nothing has changed between the versions.

                                                           

                                                          If luck holds, this time, PrE will now see those files, and when Relinking to them, should do the Conforming and PEK file generation.

                                                           

                                                          Good luck, and Replacing an Offline File below:

                                                           

                                                          Replace an offline file with a file on your computer

                                                          1. In the Tasks panel, click Edit, click the Media button, and then click  Project.
                                                          2. In the Project view, select one or more offline files.
                                                          3. Choose Edit > Locate Media.
                                                          4. Do one of the following, and click OK:
                                                            • Locate and select the actual source file.

                                                            • Click Cancel if you can’t locate the file you wanted to link to.

                                                              Note: If you selected more than one  offline file, the Attach Which Media dialog box appears in turn for each file  you selected. Pay attention to the offline filename in the title bar of the  dialog box so that you relink the correct source file to each offline  file.

                                                          • 26. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                            expert_not Level 1

                                                            just an fyi - I will gladly try what you suggest - but I'll be offline for a few hours.  I'll reply with my results later today.

                                                            • 27. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                              the_wine_snob Level 9

                                                              Take your time, and do not feel rushed. It is more important that you follow the steps carefully, to protect your original Project.

                                                               

                                                              I'll check back later.

                                                               

                                                              Good luck,

                                                               

                                                              Hunt

                                                              • 28. Re: Audio mysteriously disappeared, help?
                                                                expert_not Level 1

                                                                Hi again,

                                                                 

                                                                I followed your intructions about creating a test folder and test project and test original video file.  I found the instructions for 'offline files' in my Help.  I get to the point where I've selected each clip in the Sceneline by holding the Ctrl button and clicking on each 'placeholder'.  Then I go to Edit and I can see Locate Media, but it is greyed out.  When I right click on the Project view, the sub menu doesn't list Locate Media as an option.  I'm afraid to click on just one clip because the original video file is just one file, my Project view contains that one file, but in smaller clips.

                                                                Replace offline file Elements 9.jpg

                                                                Offline File view.jpg