7 Replies Latest reply on Jun 23, 2011 12:06 PM by peter minneapolis

    Problem with placed file threading

    JayneSanchez

      I have been a lightweight ID user since CS3, and currently using CS5. I have used FrameMaker previously for my long docs.

       

      I am encountering a problem with setting up my doc.

       

      I have made 1st, left and right master pages with footers and headers. I have threaded only the main text frames on the master pages from 1st to left to right, etc.

       

      When I "place" the file (.docx) using Autoflow, it "flows" from the main text frame thru the footer, thru the next page header, thru the main frame, footer, etc. all the way to the end of the doc.

       

      I thought there may be en error in how I set up the master page frames, so redid them.

       

      Same result.

       

      However, if I flow the text using "semi-autoflow" it flows correctly into only the main text frame, and does not go into the footer, etc.

       

      I really don't want to "place" each page separately, as this will eventually be a 350 pp document, which is why I'm trying to smooth the bugs out now.

       

      Any suggestions?

       

      Thanks!

       

      Jayne

        • 1. Re: Problem with placed file threading
          peter minneapolis Level 4

          JayneSanchez wrote:

           

          I have been a lightweight ID user since CS3, and currently using CS5. I have used FrameMaker previously for my long docs.

           

          I am encountering a problem with setting up my doc.

           

          I have made 1st, left and right master pages with footers and headers. I have threaded only the main text frames on the master pages from 1st to left to right, etc.

           

          When I "place" the file (.docx) using Autoflow, it "flows" from the main text frame thru the footer, thru the next page header, thru the main frame, footer, etc. all the way to the end of the doc.

           

          I thought there may be en error in how I set up the master page frames, so redid them.

           

          Same result.

           

          However, if I flow the text using "semi-autoflow" it flows correctly into only the main text frame, and does not go into the footer, etc.

           

          I really don't want to "place" each page separately, as this will eventually be a 350 pp document, which is why I'm trying to smooth the bugs out now.

           

          Any suggestions?

           

          Thanks!

           

          Jayne

          Hi, Jayne:

           

          Thanks for noting your FrameMaker background. I'm writing a book on InDesign for FrameMaker users, so I'm always eager to see how FrameMaker thinking might work against becoming productive in InDesign.

           

          There's no more need to place each page separately in InDesign than there is in FrameMaker. It's just a matter of getting the pieces right and the proper steps in the right order.

           

          Your description of master page setup seems correct for FrameMaker as well as InDesign. However, if you aren't placing the imported content exactly right, it's possible to miss the master text frame on the document page, which causes the imported content to flow to the page margins. This can appear as the text filling the main document page text frame and the headers and footers as well.

           

          "Exactly right" means hovering the loaded place cursor (aka "place gun") within the dotted boundary of the master text frame on the document page, pressing and holding Shift, and clicking; this constrains the import to the boundaries of the master text frame, and brings it to the document page (aka "overriding the master text frame.")

           

          Aside for FrameMaker users: In FrameMaker, the main master page text frame would be tagged with a text flow name like Flow: A, and the header and footer text frames would not be tagged with flow names. The flow tag property makes master-page text frames "live" on body pages, so they accept text; lack of the flow property makes the frames remain master-page objects that can't accept text on body pages. To flow imported content in FrameMaker, you'd place the insertion pointer in the main tagged text frame on the body page, and import - no need to press Shift or Alt.

           

          It would be helpful to see screen shots of your master and document pages, with Type > Show Hidden Characters on, and with text frames selected and View >  Extras > Show Frame Edges on, and exact descriptions of your steps when importing.

           

          HTH

           

          Regards,

           

          Peter

          _______________________

          Peter Gold

          KnowHow ProServices

          • 2. Re: Problem with placed file threading
            Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

            Screen shots woud certainly help, but I'd almost be willing to bet that your header and footer frames fall inside your top and bottom margins. I suspect, also that you tried to autoflow directly from a chapter start page in a file that has a chapter start and then inside pages already in place (though void of content), and that you are not actually using the master frames on any page, even though you think you are.

             

            First, auto-flow behavior. If you have two successive pages with master text frames, but based on different masters, unless the second master is based on the first ( think that's right -- I avoid master frames), using auto flow to put text into the master frames starting on the first page is going to skip over intervening pages based on the other master and add new pages based on the master in use for the first page.

             

            Second, it isn't well documented (in fact I don't think it's documented at all), but when you place text from a loaded cursor (place gun), and you click on a guide of any sort, a new frame (and thread) will be created and your master text frames will not be used at all for that thread. The new frame will have it's top wherever you click, and it will extend from there to the bottom margin guide, and the width will fill whatever column dimenstions are surrounding the point where you click. New frames on successive pages will fill from top margin to bottom margin. You should watch the place gun cursor carefully when trying to use exisiting frames, and move well away from frame edges. A cursor surrounded by parentheses inidcates that the exiting frame will be used, a hard corner means a new frame will be created.

             

            In the case of two masters, you would want to place first without using autoflow into the frame on the start page, then use autoflow to place the overset text into the first body page.

             

            If I'm correct about the margins, it sounds to me as if you clicked on the margin on the first page while trying to use autoflow.

             

            Now a word about master text frames in ID. You almost never need them, and if you don't need them you probably also don't want them. Set your margin and column guides to handle the dimensions of your main text block and ID will build text frames on the fly to fill them.

            • 3. Re: Problem with placed file threading
              Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              When you hover over a guide you get a cursor like this http://help.adobe.com/en_US/indesign/cs/using/images/manof.png

               

              When you hover over a text frame you get a cursor like this http://help.adobe.com/en_US/indesign/cs/using/images/manfram.png

               

               

              If you've threaded these frames on the master pages then the 2nd cursor above will flow into just those frames.

              • 4. Re: Problem with placed file threading
                Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                I've done this here and as you can see it has just threaded into the Master Frames that are threaded. You can see the footer text frames still have the dotted stroke indicating they are from master pages.

                 

                thread.jpg

                • 5. Re: Problem with placed file threading
                  JayneSanchez Level 1

                  A huge thank you to Peter (Gold), Peter (Spier), and Eugene! I incorporated all of your hints and suggestions and was able to create the masters and text flow that I needed.

                   

                  It was reassuring to get such quick and relevent resonses. As this is the very beginning of my project, I may well need further help and am encouraged by this great support resource.

                   

                  Thanks again!

                   

                  Jayne

                  • 6. Re: Problem with placed file threading
                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                    Come back any time. We like to think we're the best resource in this galaxy for learing how to use InDesing in the real world.

                    • 7. Re: Problem with placed file threading
                      peter minneapolis Level 4

                      JayneSanchez wrote:

                       

                      A huge thank you to Peter (Gold), Peter (Spier), and Eugene! I incorporated all of your hints and suggestions and was able to create the masters and text flow that I needed.

                       

                      It was reassuring to get such quick and relevent resonses. As this is the very beginning of my project, I may well need further help and am encouraged by this great support resource.

                       

                      Thanks again!

                       

                      Jayne

                      You're welcome, Jayne. As I mentioned, I'm writing a book on InDesign for FrameMaker users, so don't hold back on asking for assistance when you find your FrameMaker habits aren't working in InDesign.

                       

                      Regards,

                       

                      Peter

                      _______________________

                      Peter Gold

                      KnowHow ProServices