>captured 2 videos
How... and exactly what is inside those files?
Read Bill Hunt on a file type as WRAPPER http://forums.adobe.com/thread/440037?tstart=0
What is a CODEC... a Primer http://forums.adobe.com/thread/546811?tstart=0
What CODEC is INSIDE that file? http://forums.adobe.com/thread/440037?tstart=0
Report back with the codec details of your file, use the programs below
For PC http://www.headbands.com/gspot/ or http://mediainfo.sourceforge.net/en
For Mac http://mediainfo.massanti.com/
Once you know exactly what it is you are editing, report back with that information... and your project setting, and if there is a red line above the video in the timeline, which indicates a mismatch between video and project
Open a problem file in the Gspot utility. Post a screen cap of the output.
Here's the gSpot for the tape that will not play in WMP 12. This was captured via firewire from a JVC SR-VS30 deck from mini-DV tape on Windows 7 64-bit with CS 5.5. Again CS 4 was also installed at the time of capture.
Here's a gSpot for a tape that plays fine (capture via FireWire from JVC SR-VS30 deck VHS tape side) via Premiere CS 4 from Vista 32-bit.
I guess the next thing for me to try is try and capture with CS 4 since it still installed. Maybe there is some conflict between CS 4 and 5.5
Edit: I just realized I had captured another miniDV tape. I tried to play the capture in WMP and it failed. I also had an Export of the edited version done as Microsoft AVI with the preset of NTSC DV and no other adjustments. That AVI plays just fine. I was under the assumption the capture of DV footage was Microsoft AVI DV? Based upon my 3 captures so far, it doesn't seem like mine is doing that.
Message was edited by: STLRon
So, I just captured from CS 4 on my machine which I hadn't done yet since I reloaded Windows 7 64-bit. The captured video will not play in WMP.
I'm now at:
1. Captured raw video from CS 5.5 on Win 7 64-bit will not play in WMP 12 in Win 7 64-bit (or my other Win 7 Enterprise 32-bit w/ WMP 12)
2. Captured raw video from CS 4 on Win 7 64-bit will not play in WMP 12 in Win 7 64-bit (or my other Win 7 Enterprise 32-bit w/ WMP 12)
3. Captured raw video from CS 4 done on Vista 32-bit will play in WMP 12 on Win 7 64-bit.
I'm guessing the issue is with a missing codec to allow WMP to play the captured raw video? Is there something that didn't get installed from my installation from some other disc (like Goodies)?
From the two screencaps, I'm just not seeing a difference between my good video (Vista CS4) and the won't that won't play (Win 7 CS5.5).
I'm not seeing anything wrong with the file. From the information given, they should all play just fine in whatever media player you use. I'm baffled why they don't.
What exactly happens when you try and play the problem clips?
WMP 12 says: "Windows Media Player cannot play the file. The Player might not support the file type or might not support the codec that was used to compress the file." Clicking on the Web Help button takes you to the useless C00D1199 generic WMP error page at MSFT's website.
DivX Plus Player says: Unsupported Format. This video is in an unsupported format and cannot be played without installing additonal DirectShow filters. You can only OK out of that window. No description of what filters it thinks it needs.
I just went to try VLC and now it works. I did a basic install of the default choices for the K-Lite Codec earlier today. I tried WMP and DivX Player earlier after the codecs were installed but not VLC.
I think I am more confused now than before. If VLC liked the codec pack I installed, why doesn't WMP 12? And why does captured footage fail but exported "Microsoft AVI NTSC DV" video of the capture work in WMP.
I can handle making VLC my default player but the fact it now work and WMP drives my OCD side insane. Is it worth wiping my computer and reloading Win 7 64-bit and only CS 5.5? Or should I just say screw it and use VLC and be grateful something works rather than me having to launch Premiere every time I want to view a captured video.
I did a basic install of the default choices for the K-Lite Codec earlier today.
Oooooh, that was not good.
Is it worth wiping my computer and reloading Win 7 64-bit and only CS 5.5?
After installing K-Lite, you may want to seriously consider that. (And then don't install it again.)
What's wrong with the K-Lite pack?
I guess the big question at this point is that there is no reason I shouldn't be able to view my captured videos in WMP 12 if I did a fresh reload of my machine and only CS 5.5 (complete install)? I'll go a complete wipe and reload and see what happens.
The forums are full of people having issues after installing K-Lite and other codec packs. If the search ever works again, you can peruse some of their troubles.
I agree that a rebuild should resolve things. But it is still strange that they didn't work in the first place. With the data provided, I can find no reason for the failure.
Finished my reformat and reload of Win 7 64-bit. I patched only critical updates and then installed CS 5.5. I didn't install any other programs (Office, Flash, Java) and captured footage via firewire from my DSR-11. It still doesn't work in WMP 12. It plays for 2 seconds and then errors out saying it can't play the file due to a codec error. Yet again, old captured AVI files from CS4 on Vista 32-bit plays without issue in WMP 12. However, since capturing footage via CS 4 Premiere on Win 7 64-bit also failed to play, it really seems like the issue is with Windows 7 and WMP 12.
I did go and grab VLC and tried that next and it worked on my newly captured footage. I guess I'll give up on WMP and blame Windows 7 and/or WMP 12. I can live with VLC playing it so long as something plays the files without me having to open Premiere and load the AVI. Perhaps a patch from Adobe or MSFT will eventually fix this.
I'd be curious to hear from someone else running Win 7 Pro 64-bit and CS 5.5 if they have the same problem.
Something is weird with those files; the frame rate should be 29.970 and not 29.971. Seems minor, but it would indicate some busted frames, or possibly a miswritten header. The other parts of the report, like "unneeded bytes at end of file" and "-3 frames follow" are suspicious, as well. It's possible that doing a lossless rewrap of the files would fix it--I'm sure the video itself is fine, but the header of the file is borked.
You could use something like VirtualDub or MPEG StreamClip to losslessly resave these files; they won't be reencoded, but the video/audio data will simply be copied from one AVI to another.
Had a thought. Try this:
- Go to the Control Panel in Windows, and select Device Manager.
- Open the IEEE 1394 Bus Host controllers category; right-click on whatever is listed there and select Update Device Driver.
- Click the "Browse my computer for driver software" button.
- Click the "Let me pick from a list of device drivers..." button.
- In the list of drivers that appears, select whichever one has "(Legacy)" at the end of its name. Click Next, and then restart the computer.
When you're back up and running, try capturing a bit of video again, and see what happens. If this works, it won't fix the previous captures, but should prevent issues in the future.
(Long shot here.)
Any idea how the headers can get all jacked up? Something with the way Windows 7 handles firewire maybe?
Edit: Thanks. I'll give this a shot. We've got people ripping our carpet out after raw sewage backed up into my office. It may be tomorrow before I can try this.
Would it matter than I am on a Raid setup? I've got two Sata 3Gbps 250gig drives striped as a single 500 gig drive. This never caused problems in Vista 32-bit but maybe it is in Win 7 64. It's an NVidia controller that came with my XPS 630i straight from Dell.
Any idea how the headers can get all jacked up? Something with the way Windows 7 handles firewire maybe?
That's my thought; I think you've seen my follow-up post.
...after raw sewage backed up into my office.
Maybe that had something to do with it!
Would it matter than I am on a Raid setup?
I doubt it. I've captured DV to USB drives before without incident, so a RAID should not be an issue. I suspect its something in the AV/C protocol that controls the communication between the computer and the deck, which is why I suggested changing the driver and recapturing. Rewrapping the existing files may get you going with the ones you already have.
I was able to set my firewire driver to Legacy and no dice. I did come up with something interesting though. I captured 5, 15 second clips and none played in WMP but did in VLC. I opened them all up in Gspot and they had 0 errors like the one I posted earlier in a screencap. On each, I clicked the little MS A/V 1 button and no error. I clicked the 2 button and it did a preview of the video with no problems.
For sh*ts and grins, I remembered this version of Win 7 installs Media Center. I chose a few of the files and lo-and-behold they opened perfectly fine with the Media Center player. I'm guessing, the way the raw captured video is packaged, Media Center has exclusive control over that codec. Yet, if export that same footage as Microsoft AVI NTSC DV, it will play in WMP 12.
So, it appears to be solely an issue with Media Center jacking everything up.
Very interesting, and good find. That's always one of the first things I turn off, so that would have never occured to me. If you want to uninstall Media Center (which I assume you do, now), go to Control Panel > Programs and Features > Turn Windows features on or off (located in the left pane). Windows Media Center is located under Media Features. There are some other things in there which are good to turn off, as well, like Indexing, the Gadgets, and Tablet PC components. Your diagnosis may be correct that Media Center is wresting away control.
I'll give it a go in the morning on getting rid of Media Center. It'd be interesting to see if that fixes WMP. I'll report back to hopefully provide closure on this issue.
PS> Thanks for the tips!
My thought at this point is that something is wrong with Windows Media Player 12.
I disabled Media Center and rebooted. Playing captured footage in WMP did not work. They still work in VLC though. Apparently it won't accepted a captured piece of video.
I decided to capture something new thinking Media Center somehow messed that process up. Still doesn't play in WMP 12. GSpot shows everything is fine with the video and even the MS A/V Solutions and Tests part shows no problem and renders it correctly in the preview window.
So, I call bs on WMP 12. Since the only disc I have for 7 64-bit is a Dell Restore disc, it doesn't let me select installable options--thinking to never install Media Center in the first place. I am not even sure if not installing Media Center is even an option from a regular install DVD. It's still curious as to why WMP 12 will play old captured footage but I've accepted my fate at this point.
VLC for the win. Hey, maybe Windows 8 will fix this lol
Just for giggles, try exporting to a DV AVI (source doesn't really matter), and see if it'll play back. WMP12 (not that I use it, either) plays back all DV AVIs I have.
Nope. It plays perfectly fine for exactly 3 seconds every time I try to play it. Literally as soon as it hit 0:03 it errors out with that generic codec error. Here's my GSpot of the exported clip:
Edit: For grins I tried watching the original capture on my other machine Win 7 Enterprise 32-bit with WMP 12 and no dice. Same problems. I am going to go try this on my XP laptop.
Edit 2: grr which I can't do for another hour. it's currently in use by someone else. will report back what XP and WMP 11 (or 10) does.
Message was edited by: STLRon
So, I took my raw captured AVI and the exported NTSC DV AVI version of that and tried them on Windows XP 32-bit with WMP 11 and they both play no problem.
Looks like WMP 12 is the culprit and Media Center is probably connected to this somehow. I'll settle for VLC being the default player and if needed turn Media Center on again.
Thanks for all the help with getting this isolated down.
Over the years, I have found WMP to be a less-desirable player, so rely heavily on VLC, or MediaPlayer Classic HC (both free).
MS just cannot keep their hands off of WMP, and it seems that each release is less useful, than the version that it replaced. That was the original impetus for MediaPlayer Classic - going back to the basics.
Good luck, and thanks for reporting the issue with WMP 12.
I don't think it's a general issue with WMP12. It works fine on my system will all appropriate files. I think it's a localized problem for this one poster.
Albeit, a confusing one.
Please elaborate on what "all appropriate files" means. Are you referring to the videos themselves when you say that or are you referring to codecs and Adobe CS/Windows files?
I'm not sure what else can be done with a completely fresh install of Windows 7 and Adobe CS 5.5.
What version of Windows 7 are you using?
Did you upgrade from a previous version of CS to CS 5.5?
All apropriate files means any file that Windows Media Player should be able to play, including any and all DV files.
I'm running Windows 7 Pro, clean install.
That's interesting because I've tried it on Win 7 Pro 64-bit and on 5 machines in the officfe that run Win 7 Enterprise 32-bit and none play a captured video file in WMP 12. I take the same file to my XP 32-bit laptop or my Vista Enterprise 32-bit home machine with WMP 11 and they play. I'd love to know what makes your machine different than mine.
What brand of machine? All my Win 7 machines are Dell.
I wonder if your issue is with something Dell did (or didn't do).
There was a fairly recent, similar thread in the PrElements forum, where WMP 12 would not play that poster's files. IIRC, they were DV-AVI and the poster also had a Dell. Wonder if Jim is onto something?
Dont know if it has anything to do with it but your screen caps of the filses shows the CS 5.5 one as having the INFO on the Audio as 48000Hz 1536 kb/s and the one from CS 4 as the Audio as 32000Hz 1024 kb/s
That shouldn't affect anything.
Yah, the default export was set to that. I didn't catch it. I'd think that wouldn't make any difference. Besides, WMP 12 won't even play my old captured AVI files from CS4 and Vista.
I've given up and moved on to VLC and Media Player Classic HC. Both play everything fine. I thin it has something to do with Media Center and WMP 12. GSpot shows the necessary codec as being installed. Media Center will play all my captures fine. However, turning Media Center off did not fix WMP 12. It's as if WMP 12 can't see the same codec that Media Center is using.
Back in previous versions of WMP you could get into a menu regarding codecs and which ones it would use for which videos being played. That appears to be gone in WMP 12.
Could you upload a small clip somewhere for others to test? I think you said that even exported clips wouldn't play correctly; a one-second clip would be enough to test if you have a place to drop it.
Sure. Let me go check and make sure I didn't delete the ones I was testing with. I'll make new ones if they aren't there. I'll make them 4 seconds long because the always play for exactly 3 seconds perfectly fine before erroring out. I'll edit this post with a link to download a zip file.
Well, now they play for 5 seconds in WMP. So here are two clips--captured DV at 32k audio and exported NTSC DV 32k audio. Once the choices come up, select Free-Download in the gray button below the blue Save File.
Here's my dropbox link. It may be much faster:
Message was edited by: STLRon
OK, I get the same result you do, in WMP12. Any other application or player I tried (including Premiere Pro) played the file without issue. WMP12 would play up until about the last second or two, and then give the same error message.
At this point, I'm inclined to believe that it's not so much the container or the header in the file that's the problem, but the encoded video itself. I noticed that the video has got a lot of break-up in it--it's going all Lego Land at parts. That might be causing the decoder to throw a fit--any other DV AVI I throw at WMP12 plays just fine. Are all the videos that exhibit this issue like this one?
As an experiment, what happens if you create a DV sequence, drop an effect on the clip (something that will force a render), and export to a DV AVI? Does it play back in WMP12 then?
EDIT: I'll answer my own question: the exported clip works fine in WMP12. That means that something is affecting the capture of the original footage, or the tape itself is messed up and leading to some weird results. The reason that even the straight exported clip from the original capture doesn't work is because PPro won't re-encode DV footage unless it has to, and if you don't use an effect, it doesn't have to. It simply passes through the DV material to a new container file. When you put an effect on the clip, the original footage must be recompressed, and that rights the ship, so to speak. The DV stream is encoded anew, and now you have a standard/playable DV stream.
Yah the spotty effects are due to me recording this in LP mode on a crappy MiniDV tape. I was only going to use the audio with a different video overlay.
I'll go capture something that isn't like that and add an effect like a text overlay for the full 5 seconds.
That makes sense. I did some tests here: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13343499/Videos2.zip
I found a recent recording to DVCAM in SP @ 32k and captured that. There were no flickers/garble on the tape so the picture was perfect. It played perfectly fine.
I found a different MiniDV tape that is a few years old that was in SP. It had some minor garble on it probably due to age and it failed to play. Exporting it failed to play. Putting text over it and exporting it fixed it and it played.
I'm going to take a new Panasonic "Professional Quality" tape and try an SP recording in my office and see what happens (will report back).
I'm sorta surprised that WMP is less fault tolerant than Media Center and VLC. It looks like any sorta blemish that happens affects the videos more so than in WMP 11 and earlier. I had some horrible footage from one tape that was brand new but apparently defective and it still played okay in WMP 11. In fact that raw footage now won't play in WMP 12 yet plays on an XP WMP 11.
Sigh...I'll take donations to buy a flash based memory camcorder Any suggestions on a model number that plays well for importing into Premiere in the sub $7,000 range?
Edit: I went trolling for old captures on my Promise. I found 3 old tapes I had archived the same day one after the other. Two played fine in WMP 12 and one was from a bad tape so there was a ton of blocking. It wouldn't play in WMP and VLC even threw up and prompted me to repair the index of it and then it played showing all the blocking.
So it looks like you're right. Any flaws in the tape and WMP 12 will choke on it unless I force it to render it and then export it. Figures that the first few tapes of my archiving process happened to be bad ones and resulted in WMP 12 errors. I suppose WMP 12 choking is MSFT ensuring that I am only capable of experiecing the highest quality of video for my viewing enjoyment
Thanks for all the brainstorming to get to this point. I feel better knowing what the real problem is!
Message was edited by: STLRon
...due to me recording this in LP mode on a crappy MiniDV tape.
Oh, Ron... didn't anyone ever tell you that LP mode stands for Lost Phootage?
Seriously though--while DV SP is pretty well standardized across equipment and manufacturers, LP mode is a more loosey-goosey. That's because LP mode is SP mode, just with the tape moving more slowly. I used to do a lot of transfers for people from DV tapes to DVD, and everybody used LP mode because OMIGOSHICANGETMORETIMEFORMYMONEYYAY! Almost without exception, you'd have to try a bunch of different cameras (we had collected almost 20 at one point) because sometimes one manufacturer's LP wouldn't play back in another's. Sometimes, we'd have to get the camera from the client! Using cheapo tape only makes this worse...
Did you capture this footage with the camera that was used to shoot it? If not, try that--it might clear up the problem.