14 Replies Latest reply on Jul 6, 2011 6:42 PM by RDA972

    From FCP to PP: what i miss....

    Alessandro Cofanelli

      From about a week i'm evaluating alternatives to my (loved but dead) Final Cut Pro.

      I've extensively tested Premiere Pro CS5.5 and these are my considerations on what i miss and what i've gained.

       

      GAINED: Direct editing, without transcoding, of almost every format

       

      MISS: FCP seems to be more stable (but this should depend on my configuration)

       

      GAINED: Perfect integration with AE and PS

       

      MISS (Feature request): Effect applied to master clips. In FCP i can apply motion and effects directly to a master clip (video clip, sequence,...) and then use the effected clip in the viewer. Every edit i do with that master clip as source maintain the effects. This is very useful  when you have,for example,an entire tape as master clip and want to apply an effect to every clip you edit from that clip, without using copy/paste attributes. In FCP the edited clips become independent from the master clip, is should be useful to create a sort of hierarchy so that you can modify a filter on the master clip and the modification automatically copy to all the "child" clip on the timeline.

       

      MISS: more precise copy/paste/delete attributes. i should be free to paste or remove only specific effects and not "all or nothing".

       

      MISS: better quality motion scale in realtime playback on FCP

       

      MISS: better integration of third-part editing cards (Aja, BMD,...). In FCP you have only to select to output video out to the card or not, in a normal sequence. In PPro you have to use a specific editing mode, you are unable to disable the output for a moment and so on.

       

       

      There are a lot more things i've gained using PP, but i think it's more usefull, for the moment, to only underline what i missed, with the hope that "someone" is listening.

        • 1. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
          Colin Brougham Level 6
          ....with the hope that "someone" is listening.

           

           

          Why just hope? Tell the folks that can do something about it here: Adobe Feature Request/Bug Report Form

           

          MISS: better quality motion scale in realtime playback on FCP

           

           

          For the record, Premiere Pro should blow FCP away in this regard; I don't quite follow what you're referring to. With a CUDA GPU, you can scale anything you want (or do other transformations) in real-time at 32-bit color--and that includes animating that effect. Can you explain a bit more what it is you're missing?

          • 2. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
            Alessandro Cofanelli Level 1

            I've poster here and not in the feature request form for two main reasons: First, some of the features i'm asking for should already be' there, but i do not know how to' use it.  Second, maybe some users can 'enhance' my requests. I think that discussion about a feature can result in a better feature request.   As about the scale: i don't have a CUDA enabled GPU, so i can't test it. But with a normal GPU, scale quality of FCP is better than PP, even with max quality enabled. This is much more visibile in rendered clips than in realtime one. FCP motions appears with less flicker and a better antialiasing. I'm refferring to' scale of motion clips, not stills.

            • 3. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
              Colin Brougham Level 6

              First, some of the features i'm asking for should already be' there, but i do not know how to' use it.

               

              In light of that, I'd suggest making an individual post for each issue you encounter. Not only does this help those of us who want to answer keep track of what's been solved and what hasn't, but you'll be benefitting future users by making it easier to locate information on those specific issues.

               

              Second, maybe some users can 'enhance' my requests. I think that discussion about a feature can result in a better feature request.

               

              I don't doubt that, but ultimately, you need to file a feature request using the form to get Adobe to hear your voice. This is just a user-to-user forum, and even though it's on Adobe's site, it's really not a good means of communicating with them.

               

              But with a normal GPU, scale quality of FCP is better than PP, even with max quality enabled. This is much more visibile in rendered clips than in realtime one. FCP motions appears with less flicker and a better antialiasing. I'm refferring to' scale of motion clips, not stills.

               

              Unfortunately, I'll have to take you at your word on that, since I do not have FCP and cannot compare the results from FCP side-by-side with PPro. One thing I can say is that scaling has gotten much better in CS5/CS5.5 than previous versions, but whether that's up to par with FCP, I do not know. Use the same form to file a bug, if you feel there is room for improvement in this regard.

              • 4. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                Alessandro Cofanelli Level 1

                In light of that, I'd suggest making an individual post for each issue you encounter. Not only does this help those of us who want to answer keep track of what's been solved and what hasn't, but you'll be benefitting future users by making it easier to locate information on those specific issues.

                 

                You,re right. Ok, i'll do it. Thank you for the suggestion.

                 

                 

                I don't doubt that, but ultimately, you need to file a feature request using the form to get Adobe to hear your voice. This is just a user-to-user forum, and even though it's on Adobe's site, it's really not a good means of communicating with them.

                 

                Yes, i'll wait some days for suggestions than i'll fill the feature request form.

                 

                Unfortunately, I'll have to take you at your word on that, since I do not have FCP and cannot compare the results from FCP side-by-side with PPro. One thing I can say is that scaling has gotten much better in CS5/CS5.5 than previous versions, but whether that's up to par with FCP, I do not know. Use the same form to file a bug, if you feel there is room for improvement in this regard.

                 

                As soon as i'll have time, i'm going to post a side by side comparison, to better explain what i mean.

                In the meantime, thank's a lot for your help and your suggestions.

                • 5. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                  Colin Brougham Level 6
                  As soon as i'll have time, i'm going to post a side by side comparison, to better explain what i mean.

                   

                  That would be great; that would help us determine if there is something that you can do about it, or if that's just the way it is. We look forward to helping!

                  • 6. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                    davidbeisner2010 Level 3

                    Alessandro Cofanelli wrote:

                     

                     

                     

                    MISS: more precise copy/paste/delete attributes. i should be free to paste or remove only specific effects and not "all or nothing".

                     

                     

                    What, specifically, are you referring to here? In the effect controls panel, you can ctrl+click to select multiple effects to copy/paste between clips or delete. Or you single click on a specific effect and copy/paste/delete just one effect. I'm not sure what you mean by the "all or nothing." Could you elaborate?

                     

                    Alessandro Cofanelli wrote:

                     

                     

                     

                    MISS: FCP seems to be more stable (but this should depend on my configuration)

                     

                    You're right about the configuration... I've run PrPro CS5 (updated to 5.03) on a custom-built PC editing rig for over a year and not had a single crash or hangup with it. I've got a solid motherboard (VERY important--nobody talks about the mobo, but it can make or break a machine just as easily as your CPU or memory); decent CPU (i7-920); good memory (12GB); decent CUDA video card (GTX-285--no longer available); good hard drive setup (1 for OS/Programs, 1 for Pagefile, Still images, and graphics, 1 for Premiere Projects and a 3-disk RAID-0 for Video data files); and a good power supply (again, like the mobo, this can make or break a machine). I have occasional issues with errors and such, but that's always been traced back to my source media or a problem with what I've done on the timeline. Never once, in over a year with CS5 on this machine, have I had a crash or failure of the software/system. And before CS5, I ran CS4 on the machine for over a year and only had one or two problems. So a well-built rig will definitely give you that stability that you want. The graphic designer for our company who works upstairs uses Photoshop, InDesign, and Fireworks on a Mac Pro and his machine crashes more than mine does. Visit the hardware guidelines forum for more info about specific hardware to properly run PrPro. I'll warn you, that not many of us here are Mac users, so if you're coming from a Mac platform you may not get as much help as you'd like. But there are some of us that have access to Macs and are willing to test things out for you, if you're running into a problem.

                     

                    Good luck, and welcome to PrPro!

                    • 7. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                      Alessandro Cofanelli Level 1

                      FCP_PP_SCALERENDER.jpg

                       

                      This is what i mean. On the left you have a PP motion, on the right a FCP motion.

                      Look at the picture borders at top and bottom, in FCP it is more antialiased. Fake 16/9 white borders are on the original clip, not added in FCP or PP.

                      I also noted the the tiff i saved from PP have incorrect gamma but on this i'm investigating.

                      • 8. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                        Alessandro Cofanelli Level 1

                        What, specifically, are you referring to here? In the effect controls panel, you can ctrl+click to select multiple effects to copy/paste between clips or delete. Or you single click on a specific effect and copy/paste/delete just one effect. I'm not sure what you mean by the "all or nothing." Could you elaborate?

                         

                        an example: i have a clip with the following effects applied: blur, color correction, motion and audio fill left.

                        i want to copy only color correction and fill left to other clips on the timeline.

                        IN FCP i select the clips with effects, copy, select the multiple clips i want to paste effects to, paste attributes, selct what attributes to paste and all is done.

                        IN PP i have to go to the effects control tab of the clip, select the effects i want to copy and then copy the effects to the destination clips, one to one.

                        For every clip i have to select it, go to effects editor and paste. I can't use the paste attributes from the contextual menu because it's disabled.

                         

                        The same for delete attributes: if i have 100 clips in the timeline with motion, an audio filter and color correction applied and i want to delete only color correction to all, i have to select every single clip and delete color correction from the effects editor.

                         

                        I hope to be clear, english is not my main language.

                        • 9. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                          davidbeisner2010 Level 3

                          Ah, okay, yeah, that makes more sense. I'm not aware of any way to do that in PrPro, though I've only been using it for four years so I'm not as up on all the intricacies of it as others may be.

                          • 10. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                            Colin Brougham Level 6

                            That's correct; there is not that finite level of control in Premiere Pro. However, at least when it comes to applying effects, you can save an effect preset with any number and kind of effects, and apply that at any time. Not as flexible, but a possibility.

                             

                            There is the Paste Attributes command, as well, but that pastes everything about a copied clip, and doesn't allow for application of specific effects. To use it, copy the clip that has the effects/transformations you like, and then select one or more destination clips, and go to Edit > Paste Attributes. The will apply and/or overwrite any effects/transformations on the destination clips, but again, everything that was applied to the source clip will be applied to the destination clips.

                             

                            Remove Effects lets you remove/reset specific effect categories, but that's not specific to certain effects, either.

                            • 11. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                              Jim_Simon Level 8

                              MISS (Feature request): Effect applied to master clips.

                               

                              You can achieve this in PP by nesting.  Create a sequence for the long clip.  Open that sequence in the Source Monitor, set In/Out points as desired and add to your main sequence.  When you're done editing, go back to the sequence with the long clip and apply your effect.  All instances of that in the main sequence will now show that effect.

                              • 12. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                                Jeff Bellune Adobe Community Professional

                                <puts on moderator hat>

                                 

                                We each love the platform and OS we've chosen.   Vigorously defending and zealously promoting such is unnecessary and  unproductive.  You gotta know that any editor who is unhappy with their  system will be soliciting advice on picking a new one.  Any editor who  is happy will not be interested in throwing away their investment just  because someone says, "Hey, mine is better!"  The object here is to get FCP users up-to-speed with Premiere Pro.

                                 

                                If  you can't address that goal without snarky or sarcastic comments about  the other guy's stuff, then please refrain from posting at all.  Don't  be surprised if posts that don't follow those guidelines magically  disappear...

                                 

                                -Jeff

                                • 13. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                                  lasvideo Level 4

                                  Thank you Jeff.

                                  • 14. Re: From FCP to PP: what i miss....
                                    RDA972 Level 3

                                    'Don't be surprised if posts that don't follow those guidelines magically disappear...'

                                     

                                    I don't thik you will have to resort to such extreme measures as most PPro users respect and welcome their FCP brethren with open arms and are only too pleased to assist them in transitioning into PPro as smoothly as possible. Jim's post above is a case in point.