17 Replies Latest reply on Aug 30, 2011 7:32 PM by the_wine_snob

    strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition

    nefl777 Level 1

      Hi guys,

       

      I was going along fine adding clips to a timeline and then adding in a "cross dissolve" transition in between all of them. each clip is about 3-6 seconds.  These video clips are being added to the timeline on top of a locked audio track with a song on it. I am using the "overlay" function to add the clips.

       

      On some clips, there is a strange jerky motion right at the start of the clip and right after the transition. the scene seems to jump for about 2-3 frames.

       

      so, I deleted the cross dissolve and stepped thru each frame one by one.  No jerkiness.  then I put back in the transition and there it is right after the start of the clip during the transition.

       

      It doesn't happen on all of them, just some. I tried cutting some frames away from the jerky clip, reducing it.  add back the transition, now a new jerky part is there.

       

      Has anyone seen this? Could it be a setting? I'm using PPO5.5 on a Mac OS 10.6.6 / 2.66gz Intel / 8GB memory. a 1TB disk with 600Gig free.

       

      thanks for any input or advice!

        • 1. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
          ExactImage Level 3

          Does it do this after you render it?   If they are rendered already, have you tried deleting the render files (in the menu) and re-rendering?   I've seen a few problems like this and it's almost always been a render file issue.

          • 2. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
            Todd_Kopriva Level 8

            What exactly are you seeing? Is the image moving up a few pixels? Is that what you mean by "jumping"? Or are you just referring to playback smoothness---i.e., dropped frames?

            • 3. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
              nefl777 Level 1

              Hi and thanks for your input.  it happens before and after rendering.

               

              You said " If they are rendered already, have you tried deleting the render files (in the menu) and re-rendering?  "  where exactly are these files ? help me with that one.

               

              Here is a Vimeo video to show you.  there are 4 clips each one with a cross dissolve in between:

               

              1. scene of flowers

              2. scene of family with 2 boys

              3. scene of a table centerpiece with instructions on it

              4. scene of a white napkin with a yellow flower napkin ring.

               

               

              it happens at the BEGINNING of #2 and #4.

               

               

               

              http://vimeo.com/28333406

               

              what do you think?

               

              strange!

              • 4. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                the_wine_snob Level 9

                With those short Duration Clips, my first guess would be that some do not have adequate Handles, and you are seeing a freeze frame of the last, or first Frame. Check the Handles on those Clips. For more info, this ARTICLE goes into more detail.

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                1 person found this helpful
                • 5. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                  lasvideo Level 4

                  Hi Nancy. I studied your first dissolve very closely At the end of the flower shot as you transition to the WS of the folks entering the main door I see for a few frames an image where the words "Octagon Lodge" are emblazoned on a semicircular surface , like an inner doorway. Its almost like you had another shot after the bouquet on your original footage that appeared for a moment, feeling like a jump as you dissolved to the WS. Do both your clips and the dissolve occur on the same video track. There definitely is the ghost of a different image in your transition.

                  • 6. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                    nefl777 Level 1

                    Hi and good morning,

                    Lasvideo, yes you are right - there is a ghost image of the sign which makes the clip appear to be jerky.


                    Bill Hunt; I believe you also are right. This has to do with handles. did you see the video I posted in one of my replies? I read your info closely and have some questions.

                     

                    It said "In some cases, the source media may not contain enough frames for clip handles. If you apply a transition, and the handle duration is too short to cover the transition duration, an alert appears to warn you that frames will be repeated to cover the duration. If you decide to proceed, the transition appears in a Timeline panel with diagonal warning bars through it."

                     

                    This clip was created marking an in point and an outpoint. the clip existed inside a 55 minute video asset.  There was plenty of "source media" before the clip. Does PPO generate the handle ? If so, it is not doing it right.  Also, I did not get any warning from PPO that frames would be repeated.  And there was no diagonal warning bars thru anything.


                    I did this test:  create a new sequence.  add that exact clip to the beginning of the new sequence and then add the cross dissolve to the beginning. It behaved properly.  does that mean the clip BEFORE this one is causing the problem?


                    Given all this, what do you advise? In Final cut, if this happens, you use the Rolling edit function to set up a handle for the clip. Is that possible with PPO?


                    Again, it only happens on a subset of clips while others behave as desired.  I guess I could "fiddle" around but I just want to understand. maybe this is an intermittent bug? Not sure.


                    thanks again for all your help.

                    • 7. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                      Jim_Simon Level 8
                      Does PPO generate the handle ? If so, it is not doing it right.

                       

                      The 'handles' are there in the original media, all right.  The problem is, that portion of the clip is of another shot, which is what you are seeing in the transition.  You need to shorten up the shot you're using.  Set the In point at least half the duration of your transition past the start of the shot you want to use, and end it (Out point) at least half the duration of the transition before the next shot.

                       

                      Yes, the Ripple Edit can be used to do this.  The Help file will have the details.

                      • 8. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                        lasvideo Level 4

                        Nancy I think you missed the point of my observations.

                         

                        1. In reference to the first dissolve I refered to...

                            a. Since another image was glimpssed in the dissolve, check your source footage out point then look at the following 1 sec. that follows

                            b. Does  the same shot continue for that duration OR does a new shot (the one I described as the momentary image) appear?

                            c. If there's a new shot, then this is what is perceived as you dissolve from clip one (with crap on the end) to shot 2.

                            d. If not. check the head of shot 2 to make sure the image doesn't precede the in point on that clip.

                            e. If this is the case, then appropriate trimming is necessary.

                         

                        2. If its neither of these issues I would suggest a phone call to Adobe tech support since this should not be happening.

                        • 9. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                          Nancy,

                           

                          As Jim points out, PrPro will not "create" a Handle, but if the Out Point is the end of the Clip, i.e. no more Frames, it will duplicate the last Frame, creating a Freeze Frame effect, that is just as jarring. The trick is to Trim that Out Point back, so that there ARE Handles from the actual Frames of that Clip.

                           

                          When one did A - B Roll editing, there was a manual overlap of the Clips, so it was easy to see - same for film. You could easily see that you had, and needed to have, an overlap of Frames. When editing moved to one Track, that necessary overlap was no longer seen (out of sight, out of mind), and while no less necessary, it no longer stood out.

                           

                          For your case, just hold down Ctrl and click+drag on the Tail of the preceding Clip to alter the Out Point just a few more Frames, to provide Frames for that Transition.

                           

                          The need for Handles, where one has a Transition (most types), is why the videographer starts the recording just before the "action," and then keeps recording, after the "action." A couple of seconds is usually enough.

                           

                          Good luck,

                           

                          Hunt

                          1 person found this helpful
                          • 10. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                            the_wine_snob Level 9

                            Nancy,

                             

                            Something else to consider (I did not get Audio from the Vimeo Clip), is that if you have necessary Audio, and need to Trim In & Out Points a bit, to provide adequate Handles, you might want to consider J, or L - Cuts, where say the Audio from Clip 1 overlaps into Clip 2's visuals a bit. This ARTICLE goes into a bit more detail on J & L - Cuts. Those types of Cuts can be very useful and powerful.

                             

                            If you do not have Audio, recorded with the Video, then nothing to worry about there. So, if you are only using ambient sounds and say a music track, ignore the above comments. Or, perhaps better, think about employing them in another production. An example would be showing a visual of a group of people, talking at the reception, and letting their conversation go on for a moment, though the visual has now cut to another scene.

                             

                            Good luck, and just Trim a bit, to get those clean Handles.

                             

                            Hunt

                             

                            PS - nice visuals, BTW.

                            • 11. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                              nefl777 Level 1

                              Jim, Lasvideo, and Bill,

                               

                              first, thanks for all your attention. I took time to read and reread your posts. I also looked at the documentation under "ripple edit" and found this helpful video:

                               

                              http://library.creativecow.net/articles/devis_andrew/Learning-the-tools-1/video-tutorial

                               

                              The way I solved it was to use the Ripple edit tool (as a few of you told me) on the clip IN FRONT of the offending clip. all this time I thought it was on the actual jerky clip and I was getting nowhere fast.

                               

                              Ripple Edit the clip in front to trim the scenes that jump out. that's it!

                               

                              It has educated me, that's for sure. I now see how you can set in and out points but PPO comes along and adds more to it.

                               

                              THANKS guys!

                              • 12. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                Jim_Simon Level 8

                                Not just Premiere Pro, but any pro level NLE.  This is industry standard behavior.

                                • 13. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                                  but PPO comes along and adds more to it.

                                   

                                  Not really PrPo here, but the Transition. As Jim points out, that is how it is everywhere in the NLE world. Some kind of hide things a bit, as they just move the Out Point, or In Point, to allow for adequate Handles, and do not tell the user, that they have done this. With programs like that, the user thinks that something magical has happened, and then they get to PrPro, and are surprised that there is no "magic" there. PrPro assumes that the user wants the exact In & Out Points chosen, and without adequate Handles, leaves it up to the user to adjust those Points, or perhaps choose a shorter Duration for the Transition. Usually, a few Frames difference between the desired In, or Out Point, will make little difference, and the same for a slightly shorter Duration Transition.

                                   

                                  Good luck, and glad that you are now happily editing.

                                   

                                  Hunt

                                  • 14. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                    lasvideo Level 4

                                    Congratulations Nancy. Well done! A quick tutoiral on transitions might be good to further expand your understanding of their functions.

                                     

                                    http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premierepro/cs/using/WSE2A9B838-1422-4d8a-9A03-CFDF4332533B.ht ml

                                     

                                     

                                    Tom Daigon
                                    Avid DS / PrP / After Effects Editor
                                    www.hdshotsandcuts.com
                                    Mac Pro 3,1
                                    8 core
                                    10.6.8
                                    Nvidia Quadro 4000
                                    24 gigs ram
                                    Maxx Digita / Areca 8tb. raid

                                    • 15. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                                      I agree with you on the usefulness of that link, and had added it to the list of info on Handles. Had that been around in such a nice layout, when I did the Handles article, I think I could have saved myself a lot of typing, and just linked to it.

                                       

                                      Hunt

                                      • 16. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                        lasvideo Level 4

                                        But timing is everything and you got Nancy the info just when she needed it.

                                        • 17. Re: strange jerk motion on clip directly after Cross Dissolve transition
                                          the_wine_snob Level 9

                                           

                                           

                                          So long as all is well, then Iam 100o% happy!

                                           

                                          Hunt