9 Replies Latest reply on Aug 31, 2011 8:33 AM by Eugene Tyson

    Rules on Text Frames

    Ken Krugh Level 1

      We're moving a series from Ventura Publisher to InDesign, currently CS3, soon to be CS5.

       

      I'm wondering about a clever way to get a rule all the way across only the top of a text frame, like you might see above a footnote in a text book. In VP I could set frame tags (akin to object styles) to have a rule on any single side of the frame, in this case just the top. The InDesign object styles can only put the rule around the entire frame.

       

      Currently I'm anchoring a rule in the first line of the footnote frame, which works great except when we have to re-do things and the anchor moves around.

       

      I'm going to experiment with adding the rule around the frame and breaking it up (possibly scripting something) after I go home for some dinner. Until then I thought I'd see what everyone here had to offer!

       

      Many thanks,

      Ken

        • 1. Re: Rules on Text Frames
          Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

          If this rule appears on every page then use the Master Page and insert the Line here - you don't have to anchor it, just draw it where it needs to appear.

           

          I converted over 30 publications, from 300 pages to 3200 pages from Ventura to InDesign.

           

          Any questions just ask

          1 person found this helpful
          • 2. Re: Rules on Text Frames
            Ken Krugh Level 1

            That's a lot of pages!

             

            The rule only goes in when notes are appearing on the facing page from their reference. The verical position can change depending on whether there are notes "already" on that page from the language on that page. Man is THAT confusing!

             

            Suffice to say that the vertical position of the rule is relative to the first note from a facing page, the position of which varies depending on what is on that page.

             

            So, the best place for the rule is attached to the frame, however, the frame height may need to change as well so grouping a rule and a frame isn't feasible (I don't think!).

             

            Thanks!

            • 3. Re: Rules on Text Frames
              Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

              Sounds like I need a screen shot of what you're doing lol?

              • 4. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                Ken Krugh Level 1

                Ha ha! I thought that might be the case, especially from my conveleuted description.

                 

                Really, the crux of it is that, ideally, I need to be able to have the text frame have a rule near the top of it only.

                 

                But in case you're interested a spread might looked like this:

                 

                ScreenShot.jpg

                • 5. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                  Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  I'm even more confused now.

                   

                  Are 6,7,8,9 done as footnotes?

                   

                  And how is 25, 30, 35 etc. inserted?

                  • 6. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                    SJRiegel Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    Could you create a new paragraph style based on your footnote style, but with a rule-above added? Applying this style to the first note in the appropriate frames, and it will stay with that note.

                    1 person found this helpful
                    • 7. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                      Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                      I thought of that - but that requires two footnotes, I currently have a project or 7 using this method. It wouldn't be ideal for long documents, and it's manual setting of each one, so if text moves on you have to manually apply the first footnote style.

                      • 8. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                        Ken Krugh Level 1

                        Starting with Eugene's questions of 8/31: There are NO InDesign “embedded” footnotes, all the “notes” are simply text in a text frame. When they refer to a note reference in text, the note numbers at the start of the footnote are superscripted with a character style. Just for info, the notes without the superscript numbers at the start (25-35, 33, 35) are notes that refer to the line numbers.

                         

                        Unfortunately using a rule above the first note in the frame won’t work all the time either. Just as the notes for the right page (6, 7 and 8) start on the left page and continue with note number 9 on the right page, a single long note can start on the left page and end on the right page. At that point we’d have to break the paragraph and restyle the 2nd half of the note with out the rule. We did this in another book and it was only a minor irritation. If this series though it would be a killer over the long haul.

                         

                        After looking at it again last night for a while I think anchoring a rule in the first line of the footnote still seems to be the best way. It’s easy to place if a library is left open, I can script it if I find it necessary and it keeps the text flow in tact for possible later repurposing. Maybe the best place for the anchor is the middle of the line giving the best chance that it will stay in the right place if text moves a bit forward or backward. The one good thing about the way it anchors is that the anchor’s horizontal position doesn’t matter.

                         

                        Thanks to both of you for your time and all the best.

                         

                        Ken

                        • 9. Re: Rules on Text Frames
                          Eugene Tyson Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                          The only problem with an anchored line is that if you delete or move text you run the risk of moving the line or deleting the line.

                           

                          I'm afraid this is just one of those situations where Ventura has a slight upper hand over InDesign.

                           

                          I wouldn't normally have more than one frame per page on a document like this. It would just be one continuous text frame from start to finish.