34 Replies Latest reply on Oct 10, 2011 6:45 PM by Michiharu Ariza

    InDesign Crashing During Program Start

    WaringT

      I am having major issues with Adobe InDesign on 1 machine at a client's site. As of mid yeterday morning, InDesign will no longer load, crashing before even getting the loading splash screen with an issue with CoolType.dll.

       

      Faulting application name: InDesign.exe, version: 6.0.6.622, time stamp: 0x4caa28e2Faulting module name: CoolType.dll, version: 5.6.5.1744, time stamp: 0x48b60829Exception code: 0xc0000005Fault offset: 0x000a302aFaulting process id: 0xc6cFaulting application start time: 0x01cc7d77c667ecf1Faulting application path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Adobe\Adobe InDesign CS4\InDesign.exeFaulting module path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Adobe\Adobe InDesign CS4\CoolType.dllReport Id: 0552dc07-e96b-11e0-879e-f46d04257f70

       

      As what i can find online about the issue (although pretty much being only related to CS3) relates to fonts, i have uninstalled what they said they installed yesterday, but InDesign still isnt loading. Nothing else has supposedly changed.

       

      Can anyone please help me sort out this issue ASAP.

        • 1. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
          John Hawkinson Level 5

          What version of Windows? If XP, try http://indesignsecrets.com/guide-to-interpreting-indesign-crash-reports.php.

          CoolType is certainly about fonts. Try uninstalling all non-system fonts and see if solves the problem. Then add them in by halves. Sometimes fonts get corrupted and you don't know it.

          • 2. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
            mckayk_777 Level 2

            I would try copying the dll to that machine maybe its just that file that has been corrupted.

            Its a long shot but you never know...

            • 3. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
              WaringT Level 1

              Thanks for the tip John. I didnt go so far as to uninstall all fonts, as it would have been a pain to install them all again, with 1800 fonts on this machine. i just deleted the once saying they were modified in the last 7 days, and installing them one by one and testing. it ended up being a font named "Bell Gothic Std" that was the cause of all the issues...

              • 4. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                John Hawkinson Level 5

                Great! Of course, an invalid font should not cause InDesign to crash, but unfortunately sometimes it does. Perhaps if you were running 7.5.1 it might be worth trying to get Adobe to see if they could reproduce it and file a bug...

                Glad to hear you are all set.

                • 5. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                  Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                  I've never heard of anyone else having an issue with Bell Gothic Std. Did it get installed from original media, or from a package file supplied by an outside source? Seems to me that at least some weights are included with ID in at least some versions, so you might have a clean copy in the installer.

                   

                  I don't see any mention of your having tried System Restore. While that won't necessarily tell you waht the problem was, but for a quick get-up-and-running solution it's often the most time-effective way to go.

                  • 6. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                    WaringT Level 1

                    Unfortunately, this machine does not have any system restore points on it i found. So I cannot use that option.

                    • 7. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                      WaringT Level 1

                      Excuse my ignorance, but is 7.5.1 CS5.5?

                       

                      I spoke too soon on the issue being fully solved. It seems to be related to the Windows user account that this user has. Running on the machine as the network admin it runs fine and has no issues with the files that seem to be causing the issue, but this particular user it is constantly crashing on. Any other hints to try and solve this?

                      • 8. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                        John Hawkinson Level 5

                        Yes, 7.5.1 is the current patchlevel of CS5.5 (aka 7.5).

                        In post #1 I asked you what version of Windows you were running. You should answer.

                        Perhaps the user has fonts installed privately.

                        • 9. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                          WaringT Level 1

                          Sorry, this user is using Windows 7 Professional x64 SP1. And how do you install fonts privately (i dont play with fonts myself)? I have only looked in the main Windows fonts folder under the network admin user.

                          • 10. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                            John Hawkinson Level 5

                            Well, Windows 7 makes it hard to see the crash report, so that's annoying.

                            I don't know how to install fonts privately under Windows—I assume you can do it, though I suppose I might be wrong. Certainly you can do it under the competition...

                            • 11. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                              Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                              I assume John is referring to Mac's ability to have fonts stored in a user's library as well as in the sytem fonts folder. Windows does not do that. ID will also see fonts that are copied into the Fonts folder inthe InDesign program directory or the Adobe common files Fonts folder.

                               

                              You say the problem only happens in the user acount, not an admin? Does it happen if you make a new ORDINARY user? If it does, that implies some sort of permission issue, I think, either on the folders in the user account or in the registry and I'm not fluent in permissions. If it doesn't fail in a new user, that implies a damaged profile, and it may be enough to trash the prefs. See Replace Your Preferences

                              • 12. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                WaringT Level 1

                                I forgot to mention that the user account that is affected by this is a local admin account on this machine, so i am certain it is not a permissions issue.

                                 

                                I have just tried replacing the preferences, but that doesnt help. InDesign opens, then crashes when trying to open this particular file, and crashes on all future attempts until clearing the preferences again. I will ask the user, but it looks like it may be down to documents for a particular client. But I doubt it is the files, as I am sure that this is the one she is currently working on on another machine without issues.

                                • 13. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                  Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                  Have you cleared the recovery folder after the crash? Corrupt recovery data can put ID into a cycle of crash at launch.

                                  • 14. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                    John Hawkinson Level 5

                                    Peter:

                                    I assume John is referring to Mac's ability to have fonts stored in a user's library as well as in the sytem fonts folder. Windows does not do that. ID will also see fonts that are copied into the Fonts folder inthe InDesign program directory or the Adobe common files Fonts folder.

                                    John was.

                                     

                                    It turns out I was practically wrong but technically right.

                                    Windows does indeed allow users to install fonts in other places, but it does not provide any built-in software to do so.  But you can run a program WITHOUT administrative privileges to do so.

                                     

                                    At least that is my interpretation of this page: MSDN Blogs > Sorting it all Out > About the Fonts folder in Windows, Part 1 (aka What are we talking about?) .

                                    • 15. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                      Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                      John Hawkinson wrote:

                                       

                                      It turns out I was practically wrong but technically right.

                                      Windows does indeed allow users to install fonts in other places, but it does not provide any built-in software to do so.  But you can run a program WITHOUT administrative privileges to do so.

                                       

                                      At least that is my interpretation of this page: MSDN Blogs > Sorting it all Out > About the Fonts folder in Windows, Part 1 (aka What are we talking about?) .

                                      Far as I know, you need admin rights to edit the registry (which is what that link says you need to do to make the installation survive a reboot). I'm an admin on all my own systems, so I never really worry about such stuff (and I'm certainly no Windows programmer), but I don't think an ordinary user can add a font that the entire system would see at all. That would kind of defeat the purpose of having a restricted account.

                                      • 16. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                        WaringT Level 1

                                        I have just had a look to see if there were any fonts installed elsewhere, and cannot find any that are active anywhere other than the Fonts folder. Is there anything else you can think of to help solve this? I am about to reset the users profile, since it is only affecting this user on this machine, but am not sure if that will solve it, or the issue will still remain and all settings for all programs will be returned to default.

                                        • 17. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                          Before you reset the prefs, see this thread: Replace Your Preferences

                                           

                                          That will tell you how to back them up, and what you are going to lose that you might wish to export first for quick recovery.

                                          • 18. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                            WaringT Level 1

                                            I backed everything up and reset the Windows profile, and it hasnt helped. Opening the files up for editing again caused it to crash again, so it is not something to do with something hidden in the profile somewhere. It is not the files being corrupted either, as the user is editing them with no issues on another machine. But it only seems to happen with these particular files. As cooltype is about fonts, could it be to do with the fonts that these documents use, especially as this one tells me at load it is missing fonts.

                                            • 19. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                              Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                              If it works in another user on the very same machine, it's unlikely to be anything other than a problem in the particular user account as all users share pretty much everything else that the file would need. Missing fonts, in and of themselves, should not be a problem, only corrupt ones.

                                               

                                              When you say you backed up everything and reset the profile, what exactly do you mean? It's probably OK to back up document and printer presets using the define dialogs, and to copy workspaces and shortcut sets, but I wouldn't attempt to re-use anything else from that user profile. Copying the Adobe section from another user would be a better idea, or abandoning the current user entirely and move what you need from it for other other applications into a new user.

                                              • 20. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                WaringT Level 1

                                                I am still assuming corrupt fonts, as I reset the Windows User Account profile and it still crashed. That is what I meant above. I renamed the Windows User Account Profile folder and deleted the registry key to identify the account. I am about to compare files with a known good computer to see what is going on.

                                                • 21. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                  John Hawkinson Level 5

                                                  It turns out resetting is often unreliable. Could you please create

                                                  a brand new user account and try that?

                                                  • 22. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                    WaringT Level 1

                                                    This is a network user. I cannot delete this user account. Resetting is the only way to create the user again on that machine.

                                                    • 23. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                      John Hawkinson Level 5

                                                      Sure. But please test with another non-administrator network user account.

                                                      • 24. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                        WaringT Level 1

                                                        I just tried with another network user account that is not an administrator, and it crashed. but only after opening the second file that is in the group of 3 being worked on when this started. there are 2 files that are similar, 1 being the original, and the other containing client required changes. i am wondering if the fonts are loaded correctly, as it keeps coming up saying it is missing the 'humanist' fonts, but they look like they may already be on the machine. can you please check the below and see if things dont look right with what is installed and what is required. They seem the same to me, but I am just an IT admin, not a designer.

                                                        screenshot.385.png

                                                        screenshot.384.jpg

                                                        • 25. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                          John Hawkinson Level 5

                                                          Err. Crashing on the second file you opened but not the first. Is this behavior reproducible? Or does it now crash all the time?

                                                          I don't know how to interpret those results!

                                                           

                                                          In fonts, both exact names and versions matter. ID is looking for "Humanist 777 BT Bold" and you don't have it. It's also looking for "BT Black" but you have "BlkCn BT Black."

                                                           

                                                          If you click FInd Font there is a More Info button which will tell you the exact version information.

                                                          • 26. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                            Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                                            It's quite possibly a font type problem as well, looking for TT and finding T1, or vice versa. Having both TT and T1 versions with the same name installed can cause problems like crashing, too.

                                                            • 27. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                              WaringT Level 1

                                                              The behaviour is not 100% reproducible. It seems to be intermittent, but most often crashes as described in the way above. Just this morning doing some more testing, it has opened both without issues, although this time i was loking at the missing fonts more deeply, and am wondering if that has altered how it loads so that I am not actually reproducing it properly. but then closing them and reopening caused an almost immediate crash. I am just frustrated that I try something, it looks like it will work and then all of a sudden crash. Then it works for hours, and then crashes again. Unfortunately for me, another client's server had issues this weekend, so I couldnt compare machines to a working one that doesnt have these issues.

                                                               

                                                              Ptere, how do I find if they are TT or T1? I cannot see anything on the fonts that shows this.

                                                              • 28. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                                                If you go to Find Font and look at the More Info section ist should tell you the type of font, even if it's missing.

                                                                • 29. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                  WaringT Level 1

                                                                  It seems that the fonts that show up as being installed are TT, and the ones missing are T1. When going through all the fonts, i have found that there seems to somehow be many duplicate fonts. There are fonts that when copied out of the C:\Windows\Fonts folder make duplicates, despite when looking via network browsing there being no such duplicate files. Could it be all of these fonts that seem to be duplicated that would cause the issue?

                                                                  • 30. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                    Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                                                    I don't understand the last comment. If you COPY the fonts from the Windows Fonts folder, then you will have a duplicate. This may or may not be a problem for ID since the version and type will be the same, but if ID sees the one in the Windows folder, there is no advantage to making a copy elsewhere.

                                                                     

                                                                    WIndows allows you to make a "real" copy of a font inthe fonts folder, or to use a shortcut to a different storage location when you install a font. I tend to do the latter, and keep my entire fonts collection in an archive on a drive that gets backed up all the time. The shorcuts save a small amount of space, and if Windows needs to be reinstalled I don't need to search for font disks (but it's still a royal pain to reinstall from the archive). You should not confuse a shorcut to a font with a duplicate, and of course duplicates that are not in one of the locations that ID will check would not be a problem, either. Many fonts, particularly T1 fonts, will have separate files for regular, bold, italic, etc., and these also are not duplicates, though they might appear as such if you don't look carefully.

                                                                     

                                                                    What does cause problems is when you have multiple copies of fonts with the same name and different types or differernt version  numbers accessible to ID.

                                                                    • 31. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                      WaringT Level 1

                                                                      Sorry if my last comment didnt make sense. I will explain more. If i go to the Windows Fonts folder, it shows it in the Windows Font Manager style. With this view, I have found that on this machine, fonts are sometimes showing twice. Below is a graphic showing what I mean, there are 4 identical fonts, showing in properties to reference 5 different files, but listed as 8 fonts. (the first one listed is a different file to the one with a duplicate name, but the others seem to reference the same file.)

                                                                      screenshot.386.png

                                                                      When copying all fonts via the font manager, it copied them like this:

                                                                      screenshot.387.png

                                                                      While I cannot see why these Swiss 721 fonts should show duplicates, as they dont follow what i am about to say, other fonts that are duplicated show in the fonts folder when viewed over a network with _0 at the end of their file name:

                                                                      screenshot.388.png

                                                                      I also seem to have found an encrypted font, although that shouldnt be causing the issues, as it seems to belong to the main user of the machine, but it may.

                                                                       

                                                                      I hope this clarifies things better for you. I am going through and removing all of these duplicates.

                                                                      • 32. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                        Michiharu Ariza Adobe Employee

                                                                        Did you try "Troubleshoot launch issues, problems | Creative Suite 5, CS5.5 products"?

                                                                        <http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/832/cpsid_83223.html>

                                                                        Especially "6. Delete all Adobefnt*.lst files" may be relevant.

                                                                        • 33. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                          WaringT Level 1

                                                                          This is no longer a 'launch' issue, it seems to be related to particular fonts somehow crashing InDesign. I tried deleting the adobefnt*.lst files, but that had no effect. am going through now and starting to remove fonts.

                                                                          • 34. Re: InDesign Crashing During Program Start
                                                                            Michiharu Ariza Adobe Employee

                                                                            I dug up history of InDesign bugs and found that this appears to be a known issue of CS4.

                                                                            As suspected, this problem happens with duplicate fonts under some subtle condition.

                                                                            The best bet for a user having this problem is to remove duplicate fonts. Reducing the number of installed fonts at one time is a good practice in general to minimize a chance of font problems actually.

                                                                             

                                                                            We missed a chance to fix this in a CS4 update and are unlikely to release another update unfortunately. It is fixed in CS5.

                                                                            I apologize if I sound like you have to pay to get a fix. I'm just telling the truth.