16 Replies Latest reply on Oct 25, 2011 2:31 PM by Peter Spier

    Text wrap around an achored object

    E Diane King Level 2

      I'm continually frustrated by a text wrap issue around an achored object in a story. I have two anchored textframes that are taking up the top half of a text frame, one of them has a full column text wrap applied to it which forces the first title of the regular text to begin beneath it.  My issue is that sometimes this title falls too close to the anchored text frames but if I add space to the bottom of the text wrap, the title does not snug to the text wrap but will stay tight until the wrap adjustment invades the cap height and then it will suddenly jump way down what looks like the full line height of the style, creating way too much of a gap. I can't seem to get a clean even space between my anchored textframe and the first line of text. I'm doing hundreds of files with this set up and they are looking different because the anchored text frames are all different sizes and I can't get that space between them and the first title to be uniform.  I'm sure I'm missing an option somewhere, but I can't figure out what it is. I want the first line of text to snug up to the edge of the text wrap, and it just won't do it. I've looked through all my style options and can't figure out what I'm missing.  "Align to grid" is set to "None," and "Start Paragraph" is set to "Anywhere."

       

      I'm really confused by this. Anyone have any ideas what I'm doing wrong or if I've run up against a limitation in the application?

       

      I'm using CS5 on a Mac 10.5.8

        • 1. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
          Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

          From your description, it soundls to me like your headline is set to align to the baseline grid.

          • 2. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
            E Diane King Level 2

            As I said in my original post, the "Align to grid" for all the paragraph styles is set to "none." Is there some other place this could be set that I'm not seeing?

            • 3. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
              Grant H Level 4

              Make sure of this: the anchored object options: position : inline or above line and that you have inserted the anchored object before any character or space in the "mother" text frame.

               

              G

              • 4. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                E Diane King Level 2

                Actually, all of the anchored objects are custom, not inline at all. Many of them are sidebars that flow beside the text, but I have 3 that are table cells inside anchored textboxes. These are all set up with object styles and automatically generated using the Side Heads Plugin.  I'm working on a 3-year curriculum for seven age groups and so I'm doing a LOT of lessons, so I tried to automate it as much as possible to save me layout time.

                • 5. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                  Grant H Level 4

                  Then Make sure you place the anchored object in a blank paragraph at the beginning of the mother text frame... adjust settings to suite.

                   

                  • 6. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                    E Diane King Level 2

                    The side-by-side anchored textboxes are anchored to two separate lines in a "split column" arrangement. The left one is anchored to the left column, the right one is anchored to the right column and has the column text wrap applied to it to make the next line of text (the title) start beneath the text frame.

                     

                    I tried to insert a picture to show the text wrap issue as it appears in my documents, but the forum seems to be really buggy today.

                    • 7. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                      Grant H Level 4

                      ok let me try explain:

                       

                      click in the beginning of the mother text frame twice creating two blank paragraphs insert the first anchored object in the first blank para, and the second anchored object in the second blank para... (the secret here is to have the anchors before any other text in the story) then adjust the anchored objects into there ideal positions and adjust settings as need be. This way if the text is modified in the mother text frame the text flow and wrap wont be affected: even if the hight of the frame is adjusted.

                       

                       

                      G

                       

                      tw.png

                      • 8. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                        E Diane King Level 2

                        I wish what you were saying was helpful, but unfortunately, it is not. My text frames are anchored to their own paragraphs already, and they flow properly with the over all story thread. The only issue I seem to be having is that the text that flows after them doesn't seem to be reacting properly to the text wrap on the anchored text frame. It sees it because it starts under the frame rather than behind it, but it ignores small adjustments to the text wrap and only jumps larges amounts out of proportion with the change to the text wrap. Leading and paragraph spacing adjustments do work, but I have to manually adjust them for each lesson because the content in the anchored boxes changes and so they change size accordingly and the effect on that gap is different every time. 

                         

                        I'll see if I can use a template adjustment to the paragraph spacing on the anchor paragraph style and see if that creates a consistent gap.

                         

                        Here's the images I made to show the jump in the text with small text wrap changes. It finally let me post it:

                         

                        Text-wrap-problem.png

                        • 9. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                          M Blackburn Level 3

                          Grant, it seems to me that your solution is exhibiting the very problem that Diane is complaining about: the bottom example has the text closed right up against the anchored objects.

                           

                          Diane, I think you are up against a limitation of the application. Text wrap around anchored objects is not that responsive and seems to jump at certain intervals. I'm guessing it is in relation to the leading applied to the text and the number of even times that would divide into the depth of the anchored object.

                          1 person found this helpful
                          • 10. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                            Grant H Level 4

                            yes: because I set it that way to demonstrate the flexibility...

                             

                            @ Diane: you cannot do it the way you are trying to because there is text BEFORE an anchored object.  and it will never be able to be done... inDesign will be in a constant loop of trying to format/kern etc the text before the anchored object and will crash every time. The only way around that is using a table or like I said.

                             

                             

                            • 11. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                              Grant H Level 4

                              Hi Diane: I cant seem to get back into the forum and cant see the screenshot link: (keeps saying adobe area down) ... but can you send me that ID pages ( 3 or 4) must be the complete story. I'll check it and give u a solution.

                               

                               

                              • 12. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                                E Diane King Level 2

                                Sorry Grant,

                                 

                                Your "solution" does not work in this instance. The boxes you see in my image are the first things on that page. The anchor paragraphs are set to start in a new column so that they purposely start a new page. The story starts 3 pages before this and you can't have anchored objects more than a spread away from their anchors, so your solution simply does not work. I would have to break my lesson into multiple stories, which is the very thing I'm trying not to do to keep my workflow efficient.

                                 

                                It looks like it is a limitation of ID's anchored object workflow (which has never been ideal, but I'm trying to work with it). Unfortunately, tables are also not a safe solution because long tables used together with span/split column features cause ID to crash (predictably)--as far as I can tell, Adobe doesn't appear to be interested in fixing this bug. I've learned the hardway not to combine them in any workflow unless I want to restart ID multiple times a day.

                                 

                                In case you are wondering, this complicated workflow resulted from a shortcoming in ID anyway. I have to place the text in table cells so that I can use the SIde Heads plugin to pull them automatically into anchored objects. I have to anchor them into floating objects to get the rounded corners on background squares that is BEHIND the text. I could do it as tables in the flow of text if I could create anchored backgrounds with rounded corners that floated behind the tables, but unfortunately, ID will not let you change the stacking order of anchored objects--they always float in front and there is no option to push them behind--and tables are uniformly square and boring. I tried several times to create an easily automatable workflow for this project, and complicated as it is, this is the only one that actually works.    

                                 

                                I will have to manually adjust the paragraph spacing and leading. That seems to be only adjustment that gives me the fine control that I want. I just wish it were consistent from document to document so I could set it in the style and not have to eyeball everything.

                                • 13. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                                  Grant H Level 4

                                  ok: now that i see the image: I'm not sure why u are anchoring them anyway: If they are meant to stay there. Why not adjust the main text frame?

                                  • 14. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                                    Grant H Level 4

                                    have to anchor them into floating objects to get the rounded corners on background squares that is BEHIND the text

                                    What version ID u using?

                                    • 15. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                                      E Diane King Level 2

                                      Nobody reads the original post .  I'm in CS5.

                                       

                                      I don't think you really understand my workflow in this case. The anchored text boxes are IN the main text frame. They are anchored to paragraphs that proceed the title you see on the page. Which are proceeded by three more pages of text in the same story.   I make use of all the styling and long text features that I can to automate my workflow into quick and seamless production--which in this case, it has to be because I have HUNDREDS of these lessons to lay out in a very short period of time. If ID CS5.5 allows you to stack anchored objects, I'm going to be pushing my boss to upgrade immediately, but I somehow doubt that made it into the .5 upgrade, and I know CS5 does NOT do it because I've already tried and posted on the forum regarding that. Sure you can manually place things behind textboxes, but you can't anchor them to the text in the textboxes so that they flow with it and keep them behind the text. I did put in a feature request for that quite a while ago.  There is a lot that I would have done differently on this lesson template if it were possible to stack the anchored objects behind their source textboxes. 

                                       

                                      While I am willing to admit that there are "better" ways to accomplish the look I'm trying to achieve, most of them are not automatable and would require me to manually adjust flow and objects a lot more than I have time to do. I'm looking for a solution that can be tied to a style and be consistent across the board, whether as a text wrap (object style) or a paragraph setting (paragraph style). It's the manual adjustments that I'm trying to avoid. I'm getting these files as Word docs and running Side Heads plugin on pre-styled text and just placing it in the template. The more exact the spacing is, the less time it takes for me to do the layout of each lesson. I'm looking for smooth and consistent production here.

                                      • 16. Re: Text wrap around an achored object
                                        Peter Spier Most Valuable Participant (Moderator)

                                        E Diane King wrote:

                                         

                                        As I said in my original post, the "Align to grid" for all the paragraph styles is set to "none." Is there some other place this could be set that I'm not seeing?

                                        If it's set in the style it's not really likely to be that (though it sure does behave like it), but check in the control panel to be sure it hasn't been applied as a local override.