15 Replies Latest reply on Nov 29, 2011 9:13 AM by Stan Jones

    6 Hr DVD?

    Marvin Nauman Level 1

      Is there a way to made a 6 hr DVD? 

      I use to be able to make a 2, 4, & 6 hr DVD, and now after all these years I need to make a one sided 6 hr DV for a special application.



        • 1. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          Reduce the  size and quality by lowering the bitrate. You may get it to fit, but the quality will be really bad. Why not use several disks. Nobody will watch a bad quality movie for six hours without getting a drink or making a sanitary stop, during which time one can insert a new DVD.

          • 2. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
            Colin Brougham Level 6

            That's probably around 1500kbps, which is DVD-legal and attainable; be sure to use AC3 audio to save the space that PCM audio would otherwise occupy.


            You can use frame dimensions of 352x480 (also DVD legal) to decrease the spatial bit rate requirements.


            Can you use dual-layer DVD? That'll give you not-quite-but-almost twice the amount of disc capacity to work with, which means slightly higher bit rate.

            • 3. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
              Marvin Nauman Level 1

              Thanks guys.






              Light Warrior... Camera in Hand

              • 4. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                Marvin Nauman Level 1

                (I'm new to CS5. so excuse my lack of CS5 knowledge. but my client is under

                a very tight deadline, so we have no time to play with things too much at

                this point, when each movie (3) takes 2-3 hrs to render, plus DVD burn).




                NOTE: My client is using CS5 on a Mac.  She has the 3 programs at about 2

                hrs each.  One program is 1 hr 59 minutes and is 5.4GB MPEG-2 file normally

                rendered.  On my PC I have sent a 2 hr movie by Dynamic link with no

                problem.   Is Dynamic link a better option?




                In Export I noticed 3 Video setting. Mim, Target, Max.   Are you saying I

                can set all 3 to 1500 if I need to go that far?


                I could not find the AC3 audio.   Where is it?


                If I decrease frame size. that will also decrease the quality as well.

                correct?  Where is the setting?




                Sorry. Dual Layer DVD not an option.









                • 5. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                  Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                  Scenario One:


                  For your purposes, don't use VBR. Just set it to CBR x.x - that number actually being what you calculate you will need.


                  Here is one bitrate calculator:




                  360 minutes of video, with 1 stream of 96 mbps dolby audio, gives a video only target of 1308. (Absolutely pitiful quality, but hey, I'm really curious what you come up with!) I would simply use a CBR of 1.3, multiplexing none, and an audio of 96 Dolby (that is the a3c).


                  You don't appear to know precisely what the number of minutes is: I would redo the calculations based on the actual minutes. This was barely above 1.3.


                  This calculator adds motion menus into the video. You are not using motion menus, and I assume using only a single menu. Adding multiple (even non-motion) menus might throw this off.


                  I cannot find any of the old Encore threads, but Encore itself refuses to transcode when the bitrate gets too low. I don't recall what that number is. It is above the spec minimum. But I think it will import a very low rate, just not transcode it.


                  Scenario Two:


                  I looked just a bit for the "lowest" DVD spec datarate, and was reminded that DVRs have an "8 hour" quality setting. So I recorded 30 seconds on tonights football game at that setting. Guess what? Media info says the VOB is 352X240 and only uses 945 Kbps! It does say variable rate, and at this pixel size, the minimum drops enough that VBR would be meaningful. The audio is ac3 with a 256 Kbps datarate - over a quarter of the video rate!


                  Yes, very poor quality on TV or computer. A still image was similar to the live picture, but motion (panning, zooming, and action) produced very significant blockiness and pixelation. But watchable for some purpose.


                  Keep in mind that DVRs are using hardware compression, and should do a better job than software - or perhaps that's only per their realtime speed. But I would expect worse quality from your transcodes than the DVR version. Really just a guess.


                  Because of the high audio rate, the total overall rate is pushing the calculated disk max above at 1225.

                  • 6. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                    Stephen_Spider Level 3

                    You might want to make sure that your client knows it will be ugly video.


                    I've worked with a few people that have been editing and outputting DVDs for years, and they still have no idea what bit rates mean. It always amazes me.

                    • 7. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                      Marvin Nauman Level 1

                      Thanks everyone.  Big help.




                      My client now has the video in 2 hr chunks. or close to it (YEA).   The

                      problem now is that #1 movie is 1 hr 59 minutes (SD) and is 5.4GB with

                      MPEG-2 normally rendered.  Still over the Encore DVD 4.5 limit.  (we are

                      testing the bit rates now).




                      I've done so many jobs over the years I can't remember. but I could have

                      sworn I did a couple at about 2hr 20min and several at around 2hrs (SD) sent

                      by Dynamic link and just used the defaults.   So why is my client's video so

                      much more space?   NOTE:  It is either one or a mixture of a live speaker,

                      power point, and/or sometimes she is a 1/8 image, with lots of transitions.

                      Is that eating up a lot of space?  I would think the PP images would not add

                      up as much as video.




                      1. Where are the audio settings?




                      2. One last question while we are at it.


                      I was under the impression that you needed to render the timeline first to

                      get rid of all the "Red" bars at the top of the timeline, (usually

                      transitions, titles, sp effects, etc) before you sent it to export, etc.



                      3. It seems to me I've run into problems when I forgot to.   It also seems

                      to me that it doubled my rendering time downstream (i.e. Encore) if I

                      did-not do the first rendering in PP.  Comments appreciated Please.





                      • 8. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                        Harm Millaard Level 7



                        You have two options available, but both require you load the complete (2 hour) time-line into PR:


                        1. Use File/Adobe Dynamic Link/Send to Encore and let Encore take care of the encoding for you, or


                        2. Use a calculator like DVD-HQ  Bitrate & GOP calculator and fill out the fields in there and then use those settings for exporting with AME as elementary streams and import the resulting files into Encore.

                        • 9. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                          Marvin Nauman Level 1

                          Thanks Harm.




                          What you really saying is that the Dynamic Link route automatically adjusts

                          for a 2 hr DVD. correct?


                          We'll go for the Dynamic Link route.  (Unfortunately. previously my client

                          had a mindset to go the export route).







                          • 10. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                            Harm Millaard Level 7

                            Using the Dynamic Link route, Encore will automatically chose the best encoding settings based on the length of your timeline.

                            • 11. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                              Marvin Nauman Level 1

                              Thanks Harm,




                              Client was able to Dynamic Link #1 just fine.


                              #3 would start processing and lockup and PP would shut down. but she

                              rebooted a couple of times and it finally went ok.


                              #2 would go to Dynamic to Encore and start building. but Premier would shut

                              down on its own and Encore stops.  This morning at a freash start. Encore it

                              made it all the way to 50% before a Msg "Premiere Pro (CS5) quit

                              unexpectedly" and Encore stopped.


                              NOTE: All 3 movies are 2hrs with-in 1 minute.  (This is a Mac Computer that

                              she has.   Not that that matters.)




                              Any idea what is going on here?


                              Why is PP shutting down?


                              How can we get best proceed?





                              • 12. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                                Marvin Nauman Level 1





                                We found the problem.


                                My client had some complex transitions. sometimes 2 at the exact same spot.



                                According to Adobe. when you have two transitions at the exact same spot PP

                                only see's the first one. and you can have problems when Dynamic Linking.

                                You also may have problems exporting as well.




                                We redid the double transitions to one, and all went well.





                                • 13. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                                  Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                  Just curious:


                                  According to Adobe. when you have two transitions at the exact same spot PP

                                  only see's the first one. and you can have problems when Dynamic Linking.

                                  You also may have problems exporting as well.

                                  Do you have a link/source for that?

                                  • 14. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                                    Marvin Nauman Level 1

                                    That came from a teck at Adobe support that my client talked to.




                                    I tried it by taking a simple dissolve on line 1 between clip 1 & 2, and

                                    then another video clip starting on Line 2 at the same point of the Line 1

                                    disolve with a page peel.  Result. I only got the first effect.




                                    2nd test:  Moved the transition length on line 2 a little so that it still

                                    overlapped Line 1.   Both Worked.




                                    NOTE:  They MAY work in PP.   The problem is when you dynamic link.  Export

                                    may work better.


                                    Solution.. Don't have 2 transitions start and end on the same frames.







                                    • 15. Re: 6 Hr DVD?
                                      Stan Jones Adobe Community Professional & MVP