1 2 Previous Next 58 Replies Latest reply on Mar 26, 2012 8:44 AM by RDA972

    Should I switch to a Mac?

    77mrd Level 1

      Hi guys,

       

      I'm thinking of switching to Mac from the PC. Reasons are because I think it may be time for a new computer to speed up workflow, and I also Im a bit tired of getting errors and having to save always and being paranoid of not knowing when something is going to crash on me.

       

      Now, I'm not 100% sure if switching to Mac is gonig to help resolve some of those issues....  From what I've seen, most major editing is done on Mac. I just hear good things about stability and speed and workflow.... 

       

      I'm not saying it is the right choice. That's why I am on these forums to ask.

       

      What is the experience you guys personally have? 

       

      And if I do make the plunge, where do you guys reccomend to buy a computer? Aren't there custom build businesses. Or for mac, do I have to buy directly from Apple?

       

      Also, are you able to upgrade an Apple's ram, hard drives, etc from a third party such as Crucial Ram company, or Western Digital(for harddrive). The reason I ask that, is because on Apple's web site, to add just 6 gb of ram, they charge an extra $450!! Coming from PC, that sounds INSANE! So I'm thinking a custom build will be WAY cheaper.

       

      My budget is probably in the 3-4k range becasue I am trying to do serious video jobs in future.

       

      Let me know and thanks for all the help guys!

      MrD

        • 1. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
          Harm Millaard Level 7

          My budget is probably in the 3-4k range becasue I am trying to do serious video jobs in future.

           

          With that budget, forget about MAC. Serious video jobs require serious hardware and that is not available in the indicated price range. If you were to double your budget, maybe... You are way better off with a PC, better BFTB (bang-for-the-buck), more options for expansion, more choices in video cards, better availability of components, much more support from forums like these, far better price, better performance and threading, etc.

           

          MAC's are like hookers, they look good, but after spending your money, you will always wonder if it was worth it...

          • 2. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
            Jim_Simon Level 9

            I've been working with Macs for well over 20 years.  They're just as susceptible to crashes and errors as a Windows machine.  Even worse, when a Mac crashes, the whole system can easily freeze up causing a reboot.  Windows 7 is so stable that it's very, very rare for an application or driver to take down the entire OS and force a reboot.  Most often you can simply close the app or restart the driver and continue working.

             

            As for speed of work flow, I personally find the Mac OS to be far less intuitive than Windows.  Especially with the lack of any right click functionality.  For someone accustomed to Windows and how things work, I think you'll find yourself slowed down dramatically as you get accustomed to the new way things are done (and perhaps even after you learn it).

             

            And you're right in that a similarly spec'd Windows machine will be less expensive, even more so if you build your own.  (Which I feel is the best way to go.)

             

            And finally, there do seem to be a lot of issues with Premiere Pro on the Mac that don't exist on the PC.

            • 3. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
              the_wine_snob Level 9

              Though it might not be a deal-breaker, there are quite a few more Effects & Transitons in the PC version of PrPro, than on the Mac. However, one might find those that useful.

               

              Good luck,

               

              Hunt

              • 4. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                shooternz Level 6

                MAC's are like hookers, they look good, but after spending your money, you will always wonder if it was worth it...

                 

                Voice of experience and reason.

                 

                 

                • 5. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                  77mrd Level 1

                  Wow thanks for all the input!

                   

                  That being the case, I'm so glad I asked! You are right, a PC would be the way.

                   

                  I can't recall which company made those custom PCs that were recommended on these forums. Anyone know which company it was? I remember some kind of web site that made editing specific machines.

                   

                  Thanks!

                  MrD

                  • 6. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                    lasvideo Level 4

                    ADK. Tell them Tom from Vegas says Howdy!

                     

                    http://www.adkvideoediting.com/

                    • 7. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                      the_wine_snob Level 9

                      Yes, ADK is a good group, and can do almost anything.

                       

                      Hunt

                      • 8. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                        al_bergstein Level 1

                        I've spent a lot of time editing on both the Mac and Windows over the last few years. All at a small shop, documentary workflow.Started with FCP, moved to Vegas (to avoid transcoding) and then to Pr (for stability).  If you asked me this a few years ago, even one year ago, I would have said, Mac. Pay the price. Now, so much is changing on the Mac. I firmly believe that Apple for all appearances is giving up on the business community for the consumer world. All their decisions seem to be focused there, and their business side is languishing. Could that change? Only Apple insiders know. 

                         

                        I've always been a very sophisticated Windows user, and use the right click menus and control keys instead of the mouse when possible. The thing I've always hated about the mac is the amount of time I spend taking my hands off the keyboard to do trivial things I do either with well clarified control keys and at worst, the right click of the mouse. I think it's what you get when you design the OS and the major applications.

                         

                        With FCP there was really no choice. But with the obsoleting of FCP for X it's all up for grabs. I have both a Mac Pro and Windows 7 based tower. I run Pr on both. There are some benefits to the Mac, but I find I go to the W7 machine more and more since I've picked up Pr. It's faster and the utilties are better. But there are some areas, like printing, that I move back to the mac because I don't find the problems with printer drivers that still to some degree plague Windows. Somewhat MSFTs fault,  but the drivers just can be bad. Printing labels for CD cases has been a real problem with Windows, but not on the Mac. Maybe it's just me.

                         

                        Also, Apple really doesn't have a state of the art tower anymore. Maybe they'll put one out, but my guess is that they are finished with towers, sooner than later. And the machines that they are offering are not for those of us in the world of editing. I want plenty of power, and the ability to stuff multiple video cards into the box. No new Mac lately has given me that. While my 8 core is fine, but showing it's age,  my latest W7 machine is much faster for rendering..  One real plus to Mac is that the touchpad technology is just way ahead of Windows machines. Again, this is because MSFT doesn't design the touchpads so there are many of them, and most are crap. I'm looking forward to trying a Lenovo next time I need a laptop. But the Mac Book touchpad is just a superb piece of technology.

                         

                        Cloning is no longer some big issue on Windows. And if you set restore points before any software upgrade, you can rollback just about any software problem. Restore points is under Backup and Restore now.

                         

                        Once I finish moving my older key projects over to Pr on Windows, which I don't have the time to do, I'll likely strip out my utilities and load them on my Mac Book Pro, and sell FCP and the Mac Pro. There really doesn't seem to be a need for it anymore.

                         

                        I don't beleive in buying piecemeal machines. I prefer to buy complete systems tested by the vendors that make them. I've had some real problems with motherboard ROM upgrades, while Dell HP and Lenovo seem to be pretty much on top of their game with them. Dell and HP sell into MSFT so they have very deep relations to catch the bugs in ROMs early. They do exist and are a real problem,. Dell's next day service has saved my bacon more than once, and they are very committed to doing it right. Apple call in support can be superb, I've found, as well. HP, not so good.

                         

                        Just one persons' opinion. Good luck.

                        • 9. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                          briantho Level 1

                          "on Apple's web site, to add just 6 gb of ram, they charge an extra $450!!"

                           

                          OWC's prices are MUCH better, a small fraction of Apple's. I doubled the RAM on my iMac six months ago and they even reimbursed me for my old memory! They do some great things for Apple products and BTW, I have no financial interest in them :-)

                          • 10. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                            needles27 Level 3

                            Jim Simon wrote:

                             

                            Especially with the lack of any right click functionality. 

                             

                            Macs have right-click functionality.  I'm surprised that this myth still is floating around, and from someone who says that they have been using macs for 20 years. 

                            • 11. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                              Jim_Simon Level 9

                              None of the Mac mice I've ever used have a right click button.  I know you can get there with a keyboard modification, but that defeats the point of making them mouse commands.

                              • 12. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                lasvideo Level 4

                                No, but the Microsoft mouse I always use with my Mac Pro does ? 

                                • 13. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                  shooternz Level 6

                                  I alway take  a Microsoft Mouse when using Macs so that I have the familiar right click function.  Works fine.

                                  • 14. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                    needles27 Level 3

                                    Jim, 

                                    I know this is trivial, but just trying to be factual.

                                     

                                    Any mouse you plug into a mac that has 2 buttons will work. 

                                     

                                    In fact, the mouse that comes packaged with a mac looks like it has only 1 button, but pressing the right side of the mouse is a right-click.  I guess in Apple's design simplicity, they make people continue to think there is no right-click.  On a laptop, putting two fingers down on the trackpad and clicking is a right click. 

                                     

                                    Having said all of that, Premiere Pro on a Mac has many, many problems.  But that is a topic for another thread...

                                    • 15. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                      Glitchdog Level 1

                                      I'm an extremely happy Mac user, my apple mouse right-clicks, my OS seldom ever completely locks up (maybe once or twice a year), but I must admit I'm concerned as well about Apples focus away from the professional video market. Will we even have MacPros in a year or so? If we stay on Mac will we be forced to edit on an iMac or MacBook Pro via thunderbolt and a third party box with cards? Wow, how messy. Call me stupid, but I still love the Mac experience which I never understood until I switched from the PC. But I'm always open for the right kind of change.....

                                       

                                      That said, we are looking at a mobile editing setup for the field and I am actually considering getting a PC for this over a 17" MacBook Pro. Are there any PC laptops out there with graphic cards with CUDA, lots of memory, etc for video editing?

                                       

                                      ps I did look at the ADK, but I'm a bit skeptical on custom built PC's, ie not engineered from the ground up. Maybe it's been too long I've been out of the PC world, but every desktop/laptop I had that was built by a mom and pop shop was a bad experience.

                                      • 16. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                        RDA972 Level 3

                                         

                                        That said, we are looking at a mobile editing setup for the field and I am actually considering getting a PC for this over a 17" MacBook Pro. Are there any PC laptops out there with graphic cards with CUDA, lots of memory, etc for video editing?

                                         

                                         

                                         

                                        Take a close look at the Dell Precision M6600, it has all the features you are looking for.

                                        • 17. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                          Islanders66 Level 1

                                          I'm glad I switched from Mac to PC. A year ago I would have gone with the Mac and FCP 7, but Apple has scaled down to the consumer grade FCPX. I'm still using Mac Pros at the college where I'm taking classes that are still mostly taught in FCP 7, Color, Soundtrack Pro, that were supurb programs however they have been discontinued. I built my own PC and couldn't be happier. It hasn't crashed once. The only issuse has been 4 of the 8 Hatachi harddrives have failed and replaced under waranty. I went with the Windows because Apple could discontinue the Mac Pros taht are overpriced and limited to several choices. I enjoy both Macs and PC. Some of the interface on the Mac OS can be a little more user friendly, as well as FCP, but they are really kind of minor difference. The real advantage in the PC is all the choices to build or have someone build it for you. The upgrades or next processor, graphics cards, etc isn't a secret with PC, where as with Mac they announce what you will get and it might not be what you want or need or they might discontinue your tower and then you are stuck on the Mac platform. Then if you wanted to swich back to Windows you would need to buy new software on that platform.

                                          • 18. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                            al_bergstein Level 1

                                            Sorry, I should have been more clear, there is much more context sensitive stuff on the Windows side for right clicking than on the Mac. I was not trying to say that right clicking did not exist on the Mac. I have used a mac since the first macs. I know that there is right clicking. But posting like this is a very incomplete way of communicating... my apologies.

                                             

                                            And I also use OWC for my Mac upgrades. OWC has great technical support, and great prices. Almost all my RAID arrays have come from them, both Windows and Mac.

                                            • 19. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                              Islanders66 Level 1

                                              Indeed you can right click with the Macs. In fact, in FCP you can hover over a cut, right click and choose add cross disolve. In Pr that is not an option. I also haven't been able to find a way to save custom cross disolves, besides the default, unless it was added to 5.5 and I just haven't found that option yet.

                                              • 20. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                Glitchdog Level 1

                                                I think the best bet is to get the Dell M6600 w/4000M card and run Lion OK, I"m being cheeky, but I couldn't resist. Wow couldn't believe all the options on the Dell, memory galore, etc, etc, but even the M6600 gets pricy once you load it up. It approaches a loaded MacBook Pro, but does have more features I admit, that really is amazing, Dell really has a winner there. Could we make the Dell more elegant though? I finally broke down and put an artsie sticker on my MacBook Pro, and all my Mac buddies think I'm crazy.

                                                • 21. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                  al_bergstein Level 1

                                                  I am running a Dell XPS 15z with a nVidea 525m and with a modification that updates the Adobe insttall files  from http://www.studio1productions.com/catalog.htm I'm able to run Pr with  CUDA support. Works fine.

                                                  • 22. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                    Pharther Phurther Level 1

                                                    The issues regarding Mac Pro and Adobe are Adobe's lack of engineered support. There is several major performance issues yet to be addressed ONE YEAR LATER!!!

                                                     

                                                    I purchased the most expensive fastest Mac Pro 12 Core .. loaded it with RAM .. a fast RAID .. and I can't believe how lousy it performs.

                                                     

                                                    As far as I can tell .. Adobe is at fault. They never finished the support for Snow Leopard OS X .. and now that Lion is the latest .. I am still waiting for a super-editing workflow.

                                                     

                                                    I got the run-around last year here on the Forums .. now I'm back.

                                                     

                                                    Soon I will go through the whole list to pinpoint what is wrong and where.

                                                     

                                                    Look out.

                                                    • 23. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                      Glitchdog Level 1

                                                      Go after them Pharther, we deserve equal time! That said, unfortunately I think, (and I wish someone would prove me wrong,) corps of any animal will go after the money...the biggest market. Wasn't there a day when Adobe's focus was more on the Mac? That said, our Communications dept has slowly shifted to the Mac. When we hire graphic designers, at least thus far, they've all been haulling in there MacBook Pros. The company is still pretty much PC focused, but our IT dept finally got a guy that supports all us crazy, usually biased Mackies. We're not complaining and, for the record, I respect my PC brethern. Hey if it works for you and you're happy PC or Mac, I'm happy! My programming buddies down the hall are all Linux nuts and I love them anyway

                                                       

                                                      Hey Al, I looked at the Dell you mentioned. Looks good, has some good reviews and  style. Thanks for the tip.

                                                      • 24. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                        al_bergstein Level 1

                                                        Pharther: What are you using to measure performance? Compared to what? Not that I question what you are seeing, just not sure I understand exactly what you are measuring. I am not running Lion yet on my Mac Pro and likely never will since support for FCP was never 'officially' put together and FCP is stable under Snow Leopard, at least for me.

                                                         

                                                        What were you expecting from Adobe that they didn't do, and is it actually faster on a comparable Windows machine? 

                                                        • 25. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                          Pharther Phurther Level 1

                                                          There are error codes in my "Console" that fault Adobe's programming, there is unbelievably long lag times while opening and saving files. My RAID disc tests are better than perfect. The Activity monitor shows many instances of poor hyperthreading performaance within the Adobe suite .. while other applications .. such as Handbrake .. fully use the 12 Core ( 24 Hyperthreads ) processors. There is also poor estimation of processing encode in the dialog boxes .. stating 15 min. at first .. then upward to 45 min . plus in certain instances.

                                                           

                                                          If other applications work fine .. no console errors .. full use of hyperthreading .. excellent RAID disc access .. then it is Adobe's fault of poor programming ... noted by others with similar machines.

                                                           

                                                          Why wouldn't Adobe support the fastest Mac Pro Available?

                                                           

                                                          I think ( assume ) that the cost for programming the applications has been noted .. and Adobe decided that it is not lucrative to support the Mac in this manner.

                                                           

                                                          It wouldn't be too hard to get a insiders deposition on this.

                                                           

                                                          It may not sound like it .. but I really like Adobe .. and used them for years. I prefer it over FCP. I don't like corporate pen pushers deciding that finacial health is more important that building the best software available.

                                                           

                                                          If you build a good product . your rewards come after that fact .. like Roll Royce.

                                                           

                                                          I would fire some senior Adobe staff and use the money to hire strictly Apple Adobe coders to save the company .. and the Suite.

                                                           

                                                          [Inflammatory, unnecessary and unacceptable comments removed]

                                                          • 26. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                            Jeff Bellune Level 5

                                                            Pharther Phurther,

                                                             

                                                            I've asked you nicely once to keep you comments relevant and polite.  This is the second time I'm asking you to do that.  There won't be a third time.

                                                             

                                                            -Jeff

                                                            • 27. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                              Stephen_Spider Level 3

                                                              Al, feedback here indicates more Mac users having tech issues. Much of that stems from trying to run CS5 on an Imac or laptop that aren't up to the task of HD editing.

                                                               

                                                              There are experienced Mac Pro users on the forum who seem to be making a good go of it with a properly configured system.

                                                               

                                                              Most of the issues described by Mac Pro users seem to stem from 3rd party hardware ( BM, Aja, mattrox ) which seems to give users a completely different experience than a plain system.

                                                              Other issues stem from recent FCP converts who are still finding their way with the software.

                                                               

                                                              I must add, last week I had to edit a project with FCP 7 on a 2011 Mac Pro. Boy did I feel spoiled by Premiere. Having to render playback with every effect adjustment just to see preview........horrible; even with 8 cores and 12gb of memory.

                                                              Is that why so many of those systems are using RT cards?

                                                              • 28. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                Islanders66 Level 1

                                                                It just doesn't make sense that Adobe would in some way be limiting the performance on the Mac platform. They have aggressively marketed for FCP to switch over to Pr Pro on the Mac platform. They have nothing to lose by people using Macs or PCs when they sell both for the same price and want to sell as many copies as possible. However Apple has a lot to lose if Mac users switch over to Adobe. Apple won't even install Flash. Apple also has a nice walled in garden that no one else can use. Either you have to own their hardware or you can't run their software. This all indicates that it's Apple that's not being cooperative. The last Adobe software I had on Mac platform was FrameMarker. Adobe discontinued it when Apple switched to OSX, but it worked fine and Adobe supported it. I think people will use FCP 7 for year with Mac Pros, but after that you really have to reconsider if you want to change platforms.

                                                                • 29. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                  jasonvp Level 3

                                                                  Islanders66 wrote:

                                                                   

                                                                  This all indicates that it's Apple that's not being cooperative.

                                                                  UNIX pthreading (no, I didn't mispell that) has existed long before Microsoft considered adding threading to Windows.  Like YEARS before.  But coding in pthreads is difficult if you're not experienced in it.  MS has made it a little easier in WIndows from what I understand by not requiring application designers to understand pthreads.  Therefore the knowledge gained by writing to MS' threading engine won't necessarily transfer well to the older pthreads way of doing things.

                                                                   

                                                                  OS X uses pthreads because it's just a pretty GUI sitting on top of BSD UNIX.  From my observations, Adobe could and maybe should spend some more time learning pthreads so that they can clean up the Mac versions of their software.  It's quite clear that other software can thread well on a Mac, even with 12 cores.  You can run various CPU-intensive apps that'll pin all 12 (or 24 virtual) cores.  But Premiere Pro won't.  It'll try, but it just can't succeed.

                                                                   

                                                                  What this has led a lot of people to believe is that it's OS X's fault.  Understand that OS X and its base OS has been threading for a long, long time.  But it's using an old POSIX-compliant threading library that all UNIXen are using, and it's not going to change that.  It's not Apple's fault Adobe isn't writing efficient pthread apps.  It's Adobe's.

                                                                   

                                                                  jas

                                                                  • 30. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                    Islanders66 Level 1

                                                                    JAS wrote:

                                                                     

                                                                    "But it's using an old POSIX-compliant threading library that all UNIXen are using, and it's not going to change that.  It's not Apple's fault Adobe isn't writing efficient pthread apps.  It's Adobe's."

                                                                     

                                                                    Thanks for the explination. I really hope they get the pthreading sorted out. I'm just wondering why the problem is only on the newer Mac Pros and not the 2008, if the Apple has been using an old treading library? Also do the other unix platform also suffering from the lack of non threading?

                                                                     

                                                                     


                                                                    • 31. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                      lasvideo Level 4

                                                                      Yes I to am curious why my early 2008 Mac Pro 3,1 8 core seems to run great while the newer 12 cores have a variety of problems.

                                                                      • 32. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                        jasonvp Level 3

                                                                        lasvideo wrote:

                                                                         

                                                                        Yes I to am curious why my early 2008 Mac Pro 3,1 8 core seems to run great while the newer 12 cores have a variety of problems.

                                                                        Mac Pro 3,1s had a maximum of 8 cores, and those older Xeons didn't have Hyperthreading available.  So at absolute most, you had 8 cores.  Eight seems to be the sweet spot for Adobe's software, with a slightly lower return from 12 cores.

                                                                         

                                                                        Think about it for a moment.  An 8-core Mac Pro 3,1 compared to an 8-core Mac Pro 4,1.  What's the main difference between the boxes?  Eight hyperthreaded virtual cores.  Pop those 2 4-core chips out of the 4,1 and add in 2 6-core chips, and now you have 24(!) virtual hyperthreaded cores.  If software isn't tuned and/or optimized to for that sort of resource, you may see problems.

                                                                         

                                                                        One annoyance with Lion is that Apple removed the neat little utility that allowed you to disable cores.  But that would be an interesting way to test whether PPro started responding better (however you quantify: better) on the newer Macs.

                                                                         

                                                                        jas

                                                                        • 33. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                          lasvideo Level 4

                                                                          Jason, when I run PrP, AE and AME I see all 8 cores very active, and even pegged at times. Its probably the one time in my computer experience Im glad I have older technology. But I am anticipating a switch in the future to the new EVGA board (SR-X I believe) that will run the new Sandy Bridge EP - Xeon chips. Then I will be happy having the NEW technology.

                                                                          • 34. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                            Islanders66 Level 1

                                                                            "One annoyance with Lion is that Apple removed the neat little utility that allowed you to disable cores.  But that would be an interesting way to test whether PPro started responding better (however you quantify: better) on the newer Macs."

                                                                             

                                                                            Part of the problem is that Apple makes extensive changes to their OS and keep it all a big secret until it's released, then expect all the 3rd party developers to scramble to make extensive alterations. For smaller programs or applications making extensive alterations isn't as hard as Pr Pro. Too bad most software don't let you change platforms when you upgrade. Otherwise OSX is at a disadvantage for the reasons you mentioned. 

                                                                            • 35. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                              lasvideo Level 4

                                                                              Actually a lot of the software vendors Ive contacted are very generous with cross platform switching. I guess it just depends on who you are dealing with.

                                                                              • 36. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                                Glitchdog Level 1

                                                                                Gentlemen, this is facinating and very appreciated. Like lasvideo we have an older MacPro actually 1,1 and we have the newest 8 core (our main edit system). We haven't really done any tests as the 1,1 unit is kinda been retired from video editing. The newer 8 core was a dog on PP until we installed the Nvidia 4000 card. Now it works very, very well and we're quite pleased with the preformance. Even still using our Kona LHe, though only for audio at the moment. Have had ZERO crashes in PP or the OS since we switch from FCP. We have a newer iMac (i5) that our intern was editing on and it seemed to crash PP quite a bit until we realized it was a PP audio filter causing the problems.

                                                                                • 37. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                                  jasonvp Level 3

                                                                                  Islanders66 wrote:

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Part of the problem is that Apple makes extensive changes to their OS and keep it all a big secret until it's released, then expect all the 3rd party developers to scramble to make extensive alterations.

                                                                                  That's simply not true at all.  Apple makes very early versions of their OSs available to anyone signed up on their development program.  Long before the OSs get released.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  I'm not sure where you're getting that information or impression from, but it's far from true.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  jas

                                                                                  • 38. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                                    Islanders66 Level 1

                                                                                    Yes, I'm fully aware they seed out beta versions but my observations were that Apple didn't communicate very well in this respect with the last release of Lion. Of course the Apple fans pounced all over Adobe but the fact remains that Apple makes extensive changes and expects everyone else to jump through hoops. There is no reliable road map for Apple FCP. There was no warning. FCPX couldn't even use previous projects on FCP. This all goes back to the points I made in my original post. Of course not everyone would agree with me. That's just my take on Apple. I would only be interested in iPhone, or MacBook Air, and wouldn't dump a bunch of money into third party software, because you don't know what Aplle will do.

                                                                                    • 39. Re: Should I switch to a Mac?
                                                                                      al_bergstein Level 1

                                                                                      While Apple may seed early betas, the real question is how many sessions were dedicated to these issues at the Developer's Conference? That's where the rubber meets the road, along with devs being deeply involved in online boards. My impression, and it may be wrong, is that Apple has not been doing the kind of job you would expect for having a relationship with third parties. The way they handled the FCP mess, not showing up at the Dev Conf last summer (is what I heard from many people), and the lack of advance notice given to third parties at that time, lead me to assume that it's not an Adobe issue, as much as Apple's way of working with the outside world. That seemed to change when the FCP group was gutted about what, a year and a half ago?

                                                                                       

                                                                                      So while all the discussion of pthreads is interesting, it's a two way street, and Adobe is only one 3rd party amoung many. The lack of third party stuff for FCPX at ship date and beyond is a clear indicator. Another issue is the whole change to a true 64 bit environment for Apple. I think Lion is indicative of a cross over to the new world, and that just takes time. You don't find all the issues at ship date. It's taken Windows about what, 3 versions to get it to a point of real stability? XP 64, Vista 64 and now W7 64?

                                                                                       

                                                                                      I'm not biased about any OS, the OS is just a tool. It's not a religious icon or something. I use whatever works and gets the job done fast and best.  But there are costs we have to pay to do it, we are small businesses, and we rely on the OS vendors to not leave us out to dry when they make changes. I was amazed at how the FCP change over was handled, and immediately decided it was time to move back to Windows.  Pr and Adobe seem the best bet forward. They do care about this market, and us that are their customers, from what I've seen. Their product runs on both platforms. I've used MSFT OS's since DOS 1.0, and can say without hestitation that W7 has been the best and most stable that they've done. I've liked using OSX too, but I don't buy OS's just for the sake of them. I buy the entire package.  Now back to work...

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